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Other Entertainment => The Telly => Topic started by: Spark Of Spirit on February 20, 2015, 08:47:33 PM

Title: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on February 20, 2015, 08:47:33 PM
I'm mostly starting this thread for the upcoming Netflix series of Daredevil, Jessica Jones, Luke Cage and Iron Fist. And eventually The Defenders as well. But you can discuss any Marvel live action here you want.

If you want to talk Agents of Shield or Agent Carter, go ahead, but I'd rather keep discussion of those shows to their respective threads.

So, in current news, I just saw the trailer for Daredevil and I thought it looked pretty good, though it is Iron Fist I'm most looking forward to. I've wanted live action Iron Fist for a long time now.

UPDATE: Full list of MCU series suitable for discussion in the thread

Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D.
Agent Carter
Daredevil
Jessica Jones
Luke Cage
Iron Fist
The Defenders
Damage Control
Cloak & Dagger
Most Wanted
The Punisher

All are series either currently being made, in development, or rumored. This is the topic for any of them.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on February 20, 2015, 09:03:00 PM
Yeah, after Agent Carter, I've had some of my faith restored in Marvel's television branch, so I'm looking forward to the Netflix shows. Hopefully the Daredevil series can make up for that shitty Ben Affleck movie.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on February 20, 2015, 09:15:10 PM
i did not know dd, iron fist or luke cage (and his wife) were getting series! that is awesome.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on February 20, 2015, 09:22:03 PM
After Agent Carter I'm willing to give it a chance, especially since Netflix is pushing them and their track record has been pretty good.

Also, the showrunners are quite interesting:

Quote
Executive Produced by series Showrunner Steven S. DeKnight ("Spartacus," "Buffy: The Vampire Slayer," "Angel") and Drew Goddard ("Cabin in the Woods," "Lost," "Buffy The Vampire Slayer," in addition to writing the first two episodes of "Marvel's Daredevil"), along with Marvel TV's Jeph Loeb ("Marvel's Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D.," "Marvel’s Agent Carter,” “Lost")
If you haven't seen the trailer, I recommend it.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on February 20, 2015, 09:49:25 PM
I saw the trailer a couple of weeks ago. It looks decent, but it's still too early for me to tell how good the quality will be when the finished product comes out.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Avaitor on February 20, 2015, 10:47:33 PM
Agent Carter excels from a relative lack of involvement from Loeb. If his finger prints are still here, I dunno.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on March 10, 2015, 06:27:47 PM
New trailer for Daredevil! (http://io9.com/all-new-daredevil-trailer-reveals-marvels-darkest-creat-1690513261)

It's a month away now.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on March 10, 2015, 06:30:41 PM
Damn, didn't expect that. Will watch it soon.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on March 10, 2015, 11:10:49 PM
Of course it's very easy to mess up, but I think they've got this. They've nailed the look, feel, themes, and style of Daredevil in just this trailer. The usage of blood and water are very effective for the Catholic themes they're going for, too (of course I'm biased there  ;)), but so is just about everything else. I'm also liking how they'll be exploring good vs. evil, as well, ("Just because the other man's evil, doesn't make you good.") and the way they're portraying the Kingpin as a man who lost the line between good and evil.

Short of a screw up, I'm really liking where this is going so far.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on March 11, 2015, 02:47:10 PM
"Just because the other man's evil, doesn't make you good." Yes, I love that line. I've recently became a Daredevil fun so I'm excited after just seeing this trailer. I'll have to dust off the old Netflix for this next month. I've never watched an exclusive series on it before.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on March 20, 2015, 06:47:52 PM
How many Easter eggs can you find? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ltzGfeqWp_M (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ltzGfeqWp_M)
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on April 07, 2015, 08:02:18 PM
A reminder that Daredevil is being put up on Netflix on Friday and early buzz is very positive.

Sort of makes up for DC being repeats this week.

Also, Trailer 2 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bQFhHGMhdbw) and Trailer 3 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fZKzaw4l_7Q) have been released.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on April 07, 2015, 11:50:55 PM
I didn't put 2 and 2 together about it being on this Friday. Whoa, I've been waiting for this to come!!!
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Avaitor on April 09, 2015, 03:54:15 PM
I'm still trying to decide if we should just talk about Daredevil here, or if I should make its own thread.

And apparently, ABC is working on an Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. spin-off (http://www.avclub.com/article/abc-and-marvel-are-putting-together-agents-shield--217789). There's no word on what this will be about, or if it'll replace Agent Carter (hell, AOS hasn't even been officially renewed), but saying that it's an AOS spin-off rather than a MCU spin-off opens possibilities up to that area.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: GregX on April 10, 2015, 11:48:42 AM
And apparently, ABC is working on an Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. spin-off (http://www.avclub.com/article/abc-and-marvel-are-putting-together-agents-shield--217789). There's no word on what this will be about, or if it'll replace Agent Carter (hell, AOS hasn't even been officially renewed), but saying that it's an AOS spin-off rather than a MCU spin-off opens possibilities up to that area.

How about we make the spin-off a reality show where a SWAT team travels the country, kicking in the doors of people who still watch this vile, repulsive, piece of shit, and put bullets in their brains.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Peanutbutter on April 10, 2015, 02:02:05 PM
Just watched the first two episodes a bit ago of Daredevil. So far, it's fantastic! It's too early for me to spoil any of the plot, so I'll just say that the show has a great cast so far, as well as superb camera work and great fight choreography.





And apparently, ABC is working on an Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. spin-off (http://www.avclub.com/article/abc-and-marvel-are-putting-together-agents-shield--217789). There's no word on what this will be about, or if it'll replace Agent Carter (hell, AOS hasn't even been officially renewed), but saying that it's an AOS spin-off rather than a MCU spin-off opens possibilities up to that area.

How about we make the spin-off a reality show where a SWAT team travels the country, kicking in the doors of people who still watch this vile, repulsive, piece of shit, and put bullets in their brains.


 :whuh:


That's.....harsh. I mean I dropped the show too, but I could see why some people would stick to it. Just on the wrestling board I go to, there's a number of guys there that apparently like season two has gone.



Plus, my mother watches it too, so yeah....NO.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on April 10, 2015, 02:07:54 PM
In other news, Daredevil is finally up on Netflix. I just watched the first episode, but I'll just save my throughts for when I finish the entire season over the next few days.

I will say that it's already better than that Ben Affleck crapfest, which isn't saying much in and of itself, but I still take it as a good sign.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on April 10, 2015, 02:10:56 PM
How about we make the spin-off a reality show where a SWAT team travels the country, kicking in the doors of people who still watch this vile, repulsive, piece of shit, and put bullets in their brains.
I'm sure you meant it in jest, but please don't make posts like this on AR. Thank you!
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: GregX on April 10, 2015, 02:16:47 PM
How about we make the spin-off a reality show where a SWAT team travels the country, kicking in the doors of people who still watch this vile, repulsive, piece of shit, and put bullets in their brains.
I'm sure you meant it in jest, but please don't make posts like this on AR. Thank you!

Fair enough, it won't happen again.

Two episodes into "Daredevil" and, how shall I put this? It's a much better show than "Special Snowflake & The SHIT Squad" and "Got Ham", but that's damning with faint praise. If I want to watch a darker superhero TV show, "Arrow" is doing it better. If I want to watch a show about a struggling lawyer in the seedy underworld, "Better Call Saul" is doing it much better. Those shows consistently leave me wanting the next episode right away, and waiting a week for the next one is frustrating. I have the option to watch the next episode of "Daredevil" right now, and the one after and the one after... and the thought just feels like a damn chore.

It's not bad, but it's not good either.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action2
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on April 10, 2015, 03:19:24 PM
I'm also only 2 episodes in, myself, right now. I'm enjoying it a bit more than you are, but I definitely agree that Arrow is a better "dark superhero" show. I'd also say that Agent Carter is still by far Marvel's best live action series. That said, I certainly don't find watching the show to be a chore, though it doesn't really hook me into watching the next episode either.

Still, being only 2 episodes in, I think it's solid, personally. Speaking of Arrow again, it sort of reminds me of its first season, where the show was a ways off from hitting its stride, but still entertaining in its own right. Of course, the quality could easily go to shit, get better, or stay exactly the same as I make it through the rest of the season, so as I stated before, my final verdict will only come after completing the season.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on April 10, 2015, 06:55:50 PM
I watched 5 episodes.

Excellent. One of my favorite superhero shows by far.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on April 10, 2015, 08:40:48 PM
I watched 5 episodes.

Excellent. One of my favorite superhero shows by far.
Glad to hear it! I've never been particularly keen on live action superhero television, but everything I've read about the Daredevil series makes it sound great to me. Going to watch some soon!
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on April 10, 2015, 08:46:46 PM
I watched 5 episodes.

Excellent. One of my favorite superhero shows by far.
Glad to hear it! I've never been particularly keen on live action superhero television, but everything I've read about the Daredevil series makes it sound great to me. Going to watch some soon!

Personally I'd say that Arrow gets really good after the first season. It's just decent up to that point, though.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on April 10, 2015, 09:02:34 PM
I do really want to give Arrow another shot eventually. I wasn't a huge fan of what I saw, but it seems like you guys really like the later seasons.

Couldn't stand Gotham, SHIELD, Smallville, or anything else I've seen, though.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on April 10, 2015, 09:06:20 PM
I watched 5 episodes.

Excellent. One of my favorite superhero shows by far.
Glad to hear it! I've never been particularly keen on live action superhero television, but everything I've read about the Daredevil series makes it sound great to me. Going to watch some soon!
I think you'd really like it. Episodes 4 and 5 in particular were knockouts. Episode 2's backstory was one of my personal favorites, Jack Murdock's story was so touching, especially when the crowd starts cheering.

(https://breakinggeek.files.wordpress.com/2015/03/figtin.png)

One of my personal favorite moments from any superhero show or movie.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on April 10, 2015, 09:09:37 PM
Apparently it takes some inspiration from both The Wire and Oldboy, which is pretty much all I needed to hear. ;D
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on April 10, 2015, 09:13:29 PM
Apparently it takes some inspiration from both The Wire and Oldboy, which is pretty much all I needed to hear. ;D
Wilson Fisk is really good too. Of all the live action attempts, I think he makes the best villain so far. Especially when you see what he can do when someone makes him mad.

I've still got more to see, but it has hooked me. It starts out a bit slow, but I like slow, so the breathing room doesn't bother me. It also helps that the fights scenes have no shaky cam or quick cuts which make them last really long.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on April 10, 2015, 09:28:49 PM
That all sounds wonderful to me. :joy:
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on April 10, 2015, 10:08:39 PM
I do really want to give Arrow another shot eventually. I wasn't a huge fan of what I saw, but it seems like you guys really like the later seasons.

Couldn't stand Gotham, SHIELD, Smallville, or anything else I've seen, though.

Gotham and SHIELD are awful, so it doesn't help if you're watching the worst of the worst.

Arrow is sort of like a Whedon show, where it takes some time for the characters to really find their footing, but the writing improves by the end of the first season, and gets surprisingly excellent by season 2's second half.

I mean, don't go in expecting quality on the level of The Wire, Breaking Bad, House of Cards, Game of Thrones, The Sopranos, etc., as its clearly not that type of show, and even as a darker superhero show, it thankfully doesn't take itself "too" seriously so it can be really fun at times. But all the same, it's currently the best in its genre as far as TV superhero shows go, IMO, which is just really refreshing for me since most other shows that I watch focus on some dark anti-hero-ish sort of protagonists and all manner of scheming, betrayal, and general unpleasantness; which are great, of course, but can be a bit too depressing in bulk. :P
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on April 10, 2015, 10:10:54 PM
The first season and a half of Arrow is a pretty good superhero show, but by Three Ghosts it gets great all the way through to now.

If you want something fun (with some dark moments) you might like The Flash. It's got a good sense of humor and makes a good counterpoint to Arrow.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Avaitor on April 10, 2015, 11:48:15 PM
Adam West doe.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on April 10, 2015, 11:51:18 PM
Adam West doe.
Y'all KNOW I love the 1960's Batman show. It's the best. :)
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on April 10, 2015, 11:55:48 PM
Thanks for reminding me about it. I keep forgetting to put the DVDs on my wishlist.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on April 10, 2015, 11:57:00 PM
My family got me the BD set for Christmas (I think because they wanted to watch it too ;)) and it's a truly amazing release. :joy:
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Avaitor on April 10, 2015, 11:57:13 PM
I wish that I had enough to get the mega Blu set.

But I did just buy the complete series set of Taxi, so...
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on April 11, 2015, 08:05:59 PM
Caught the first episode of Daredevil. Loved it! Can't wait to watch the second one tomorrow. :)
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on April 12, 2015, 03:06:43 PM
Just got done with the 7th episode. This show has gotten progressively better, to my delight, and Stick is an awesome character. I'm really hooked, now, but unfortunately I have too much to do today, so I can't watch anymore episodes until tomorrow (and I'll also have to watch the season premiere of GOT tomorrow, as well).
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on April 13, 2015, 12:00:42 PM
I finished it off. Loved it. Especially on a character level. By the end I was really on the side of Matt and his friends and was pulling for them to succeed. I also really liked that Kingpin and his men got a lot of focus which easily made him my favorite villain in the whole Marvel Movie Universe. Of course I could quibble about the speed of the show, but it honestly didn't bother me at all. I was engaged in every moment.

Here's hoping it did well enough to merit a second season, because I want to see more of these characters. Though I think the hints as to what we're going to get next are pretty obvious just based on Stick.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on April 13, 2015, 09:53:26 PM
Daredevil seems to get progressively better. Just finished episode 4, and I haven't been this engaged by a TV show in some time!
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on April 13, 2015, 10:04:44 PM
**cough**Game of Thrones**cough**

I'm 8 episodes in, and it's great. Foggle, if you like it now, it gets even better by the end of the fifth episode. ;)
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on April 13, 2015, 10:06:00 PM
True Detective, then Breaking Bad, then Treme, then Game of Thrones. That's how I'm gonna do. ;)
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on April 13, 2015, 10:09:11 PM
Daredevil gets better as you get used to the characters. I'm betting a re-watch would do it a lot of additional good, too.

Also, that fight scene at the end of episode 2 deserves a lot of credit.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on April 13, 2015, 10:12:08 PM
True Detective, then Breaking Bad, then Treme, then Game of Thrones. That's how I'm gonna do. ;)

I thought that you already watched Breaking Bad. ???
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on April 13, 2015, 10:13:09 PM
Not all of it. :(
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on April 13, 2015, 10:16:15 PM
Also, that fight scene at the end of episode 2 deserves a lot of credit.

Oh god, yes! It looks like somebody took notes from old-school Bruce Lee films. No shaky cam bull-shit at all. Just straight up excellent choreography from a stationary camera where you could see all of the action. Nothing else is there to enhance the effects. The action is comprised entirely of good stunt-men pretending to beat the crap out of each other.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on April 13, 2015, 10:18:32 PM
It was basically that amazing fight scene from Oldboy but with a different camera angle and no hammer. :D
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on April 13, 2015, 10:19:19 PM
Not all of it. :(

Man, I don't know how you could manage to just stop in the middle, I couldn't help but binge-watch the shit out of it into the early hours of the morning, even when I had a big presentation assignment to do the next day at the hospital that I was doing my rotation at during that time. I literally just couldn't stop watching. :joy:
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on April 13, 2015, 10:24:38 PM
Actually the fight scenes in this show are really good in general. They frequently feature little to no camera cuts, NO shaky cam, and some cool stunts. It's like the return of old school action sequences.

If this staff is going to be behind Iron Fist, then I'm beyond excited for that.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Avaitor on April 13, 2015, 11:40:46 PM
True Detective, then Breaking Bad, then Treme, then Game of Thrones. That's how I'm gonna do. ;)
I still really need to see Treme. And Enlightened really should be on there.

And I still really need to start on this. But right now, I'm just too busy to.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on April 15, 2015, 03:18:00 PM
I'm 10 episodes in, now. Anyone who found this show to be a bit too slow in the beginning should really stick with it. Over the course of this season (so far), it has only gotten better and better. I'm really loving the supporting cast, now, and the story-line has been kept very intriguing in terms of how things play out. While I still stand by my opinion that Arrow is (currently) the best superhero show around, this one already has a superior first season, and I can see it becoming a close second by the end of it, and maybe even surpassing Arrow by its next season if Netflix decides to order one. Either that or they will just go ahead with The Defenders after a season of each of these individual shows hit streaming. Either way, I can't wait to see the return of Matt Murdock/Daredevil in the MCU, and I'm not even done with the season, yet!
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on April 15, 2015, 03:26:21 PM
They're currently producing Jessica Jones right now, which means it will probably play out like this:

Daredevil - 13 episodes
A.K.A. Jessica Jones - 13 episodes
Iron Fist - 13 episodes
Luke Cage - 13 episodes
Defenders - 8 episode event

For a total of 60 episodes.

What they do after that is anyone's guess, but I'm almost certain Iron Fist and Luke Cage will share a show should they move to season 2.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on April 15, 2015, 04:10:49 PM
I assume Daredevil will get a second season that introduces characters like Elektra and The Punisher into the MCU. Luke Cage & Iron Fist as a shared season 2 seems like a no-brainer to me, as well.

Speaking of which, if Fox ends up making a sequel to the Deadpool film, my money's on it being a Cable & Deadpool movie.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on April 15, 2015, 04:22:22 PM
My only problem is having to wait at least two years for a season 2 of Daredevil. I really want to see more of this character and his friends and foes.

Season 2 will almost certainly include The Hand and The Chaste as well as Elektra and Bullseye, possibly the Punisher as an anti-hero ally, but I'm fine with whatever they do. As long as it's more Daredevil.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on April 16, 2015, 09:11:27 PM
Watched episodes 7 and 8 of Daredevil. Didn't much care for the former; it was nice seeing how Matt learned to fight, but not knowing what Black Sky was really detracted from my immersion, and Stick just kinda' came out of nowhere, giving me no reason to care about his character or organization. Episode 8, however, was the best one so far IMO. No other superhero movie or TV show I've seen has ever had such an interesting and well-developed villain as Fisk. Brilliant television.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on April 16, 2015, 09:36:34 PM
Wow, I totally disagree about episode 7, it's one of my favorites. Stick is an awesone character, and the stuff you seem to be focusing on were the least important parts of the episode. Black Sky was the Macguffin for this episode (though I still haven't finished the season yet, so maybe it'll come back), and Stick had to be introduced somewhere, so you're complaint about him coming out of nowhere doesn't really make sense since Matt's past has been presented to us in chronological order via the flash-backs, and he of course wouldn't meet Stick until after his dad's death.

The whole episode was also an excellent character-study of Matt and his stance at that point in the series. Stick points out that he'll never get anything truly accomplished until he's willing to cross a certain line. He represents the opposite side of the coin to the priest who serves as Matt's other guiding figure throughout the season, and although Matt rejects him in the episode, he hasn't truly given up the temptation to follow Stick's recommended path.

To me, it's one of the finest written, directed, and acted episodes in the series out of the 11-episodes that I've seen so far. We're just going to have to agree to disagree on that.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on April 16, 2015, 09:48:11 PM
When I say he "randomly shows up," I mean he just somehow walks into a parking garage not only knowing that Matt would be there but also that the guy in the mask was him. It's not a huge stretch of the imagination in a universe where characters like Hulk and Thor exist, but it still took me out of the moment, if only briefly. Also, Black Sky may be a MacGuffin, but having what I assume is a child slave pop up only to serve no purpose other than die without any explanation didn't sit right with me.

Maybe it's because I haven't read the comics, but I just thought Stick was an asshole. I get that he's basically Daredevil if Daredevil wasn't compassionate or against killing people, but I didn't particularly have an opinion on him one way or the other. The character study was interesting enough, but it didn't really make me feel anything like the scenes with Matt's dad or Fisk's family did.

I didn't actually dislike the episode though, it was still pretty good; I just wasn't as engaged in it as I was with the other 7. Glad it worked more for you.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on April 16, 2015, 10:14:44 PM
The Stick episode exists to flesh Matt's past out to show where he got his training from. Otherwise it is to do two other things, one of which is spoiler-related to Nobu which is brought back many times before the end of the season and the other is to hint as to where season 2 will be going.

Whether you like any of those things is up to you, but that is why the episode is there.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on April 16, 2015, 10:18:45 PM
Well, as long it isn't just dropped, I'm good. If it gives more development to Nobu later on, then I rescind my complaint. The only mention of it in episode 8 was "I'm not happy! It's hard to get!" which just made me annoyed instead of intrigued.

Anyway, I'm glad the episode is there, even if I didn't quite like it as much as the others. I'm sure Stick will be important in season 2, and it was good to know where Matt's training came from. I just found myself less engaged than usual, is all.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on April 16, 2015, 10:27:26 PM
On an off-topic note, why am I always the one defending good stuff that I like? As in: Hunter X Hunter (from g2s), Fumoffu (from CX), MVC3 (from Rynnec), Daredevil episode 7 (from you), Spider-Man 3 (from the rest of the world), and so on. Maybe it's because it's not in my nature to talk about what I dislike, but I need to play things out from the other perspective a bit more often. It seems like way more fun. :humhumhum:

When I say he "randomly shows up," I mean he just somehow walks into a parking garage not only knowing that Matt would be there but also that the guy in the mask was him. It's not a huge stretch of the imagination in a universe where characters like Hulk and Thor exist, but it still took me out of the moment, if only briefly. Also, Black Sky may be a MacGuffin, but having what I assume is a child slave pop up only to serve no purpose other than die without any explanation didn't sit right with me.

It's a series. Not a movie. Stuff like that can (and probably will) come back. Maybe by next season or in The Defenders if not this one. For the sake of the episode, that wasn't the focus. Stuff like this happens in television all the time, so it doesn't seem like a fair criticism to me. I mean, I didn't hear anyone complaining about the Infinity Gem in GOTG barely being utilized because it was mainly just there as a Macguffin and wouldn't be truly important until Infinity War.

Quote
Maybe it's because I haven't read the comics, but I just thought Stick was an asshole. I get that he's basically Daredevil if Daredevil wasn't compassionate or against killing people, but I didn't particularly have an opinion on him one way or the other. The character study was interesting enough, but it didn't really make me feel anything like the scenes with Matt's dad or Fisk's family did.

I haven't read the comics either, so that didn't factor into my judgement. Stick is an ass-hole, but that's an intentional aspect of his character. Do not ignore, however, that he did a lot to help Murdock and that he purposely acted the way that he did to toughen the kid up. He was the one who taught Matt to see his blindness as a gift rather than a burden, which from a character with a questionble moral alignment, was a surprisingly positive influence. He is a mentor to Matt, but stands out because he's different from the typical archetype, in that he's neither a pure good nor evil influence. And in that regard, despite being a killer, he isn't presented as a good or bad character. Just as a character.

Take for example the scene where he leaves Matt as a kid. It's very well-acted just through facial expressions alone. When Matt shows him affection for just a moment, he actually pauses briefly to consider it, and you can see hints of both doubt and also a little sentiment in his facial features. He then tells Matt that he can't be a father-figure to him, which can seem ass-holish at a glance, but consider the fact that he has a point. Whatever Stick was training him for, he knew that Matt wouldn't be up to par if emotions got in the way, so from his point of view he's sparing him from going down that path. Of course, Matt tries to pursue justice anyway, but under his own lofty ideals, and that's what the confrontation in the present is about. The point being, though, is that he's not just a darker version of Daredevil, like you suggest. He's a character, and one that I hope to see return and be further fleshed out in the future.

As for the stuff with Matt's dad, I liked it well enough, but I feel like I've seen that parent to kid relationship done better before. With Stick, I felt that he brought something new to the mentor archetype.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on April 16, 2015, 10:45:20 PM
Not once did I say the episode was bad. In fact, I said it was good, and I just didn't care for it as much as the others. I picked my words carefully to specify how it was my opinion that specific elements detracted from the overall experience for me, not that I thought they were outright bad. I've tried to tone down talking about things I dislike lately, and only even mentioned episode 7 because I loved episode 8 and watched them both in sequence. (Do note that making fun of notoriously bad arcade ports isn't quite the same thing, in my opinion.) I even said I was happy that the episode worked better for you than it did for me.

I didn't care about the Infinity Gem in GOTG, and the film also revealed what it was minutes after we first saw it. Child slaves are a lot more interesting, and Daredevil is much stronger from a storytelling standpoint, but I was worried that it would never be explained until The Defenders. This annoyed me greatly, as I would rather take DD as its own work rather than a lead-in to a crossover event, since it's so good so far.

Stick turning down Matt's gift was my favorite part of the episode.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: LumRanmaYasha on April 16, 2015, 10:50:57 PM
Maybe it's because it's not in my nature to talk about what I dislike

  ::)
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on April 16, 2015, 10:54:25 PM
Maybe it's because it's not in my nature to talk about what I dislike

  ::)
:lol:
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on April 16, 2015, 10:56:05 PM
What? Shonen manga don't count since I barely post about them anymore, smart-ass. :>
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: LumRanmaYasha on April 16, 2015, 11:05:51 PM
You made a fairly detailed post about how much you didn't care for Azumanga Daioh, without any prompting, just last week.   :humhumhum:
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on April 16, 2015, 11:11:46 PM
Yeah, and that was the first time that I had criticized something generally well-liked in a long time. I never said that I don't ever talk about what I dislike. I just stated that it's not in my nature, and that I should do it more often since it seems more entertaining to criticize than to defend. :bleh:

Of course, when I try to be too negative about something, then I realize that I just feel much better writing about the things that I genuinely love.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on April 17, 2015, 02:51:02 PM
Just finished the season. Great show, overall, despite a slow start.

I'll be really interested to see Stick return in the future and learn more about his organization and mission, but as for the story of Matt Murdock's transformation into Daredevil, it was a great first season. The supporting cast also grew on me over time. I really grew to like Foggy, Karen, and Ben.

Spoiler
I also actually felt a bit sad to see Ben get killed off, since I really did end up appreciating the character and his role in the story.

Kingpin was also a really well-done villain. He's the kind that you can clearly call a "bad-guy," but not 1-dimensionally evil like most MCU villains.

I'm definitely looking forward to the rest of the upcoming Marvel shows on Netflix. After both this and Agent Carter, while neither show was anywhere near perfect, they were both completely unique in tone from each other yet equally entertaining, and it convinces me that Marvel's TV department actually knows what it's doing, and that AOS was just a huge first misstep that shouldn't happen again.

And of course, yes, this completely washes out the bad taste of that 2003 fuck-up.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on April 17, 2015, 03:06:31 PM
The show successfully put both Daredevil and Kingpin up several ranks now as up there with my favorite superheroes and villains. Charlie Cox is Matt Murdock/Daredevil and Vincent D'Onofrio is Wilson Fisk/Kingpin.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on April 17, 2015, 03:34:45 PM
In general, Marvel has been pretty excellent at casting their most iconic characters since day one. RDJ as Tony Stark, Chris Evans as Steve Rogers, Chris Hemsworth as Thor, and even though Ed Norton wasn't the best choice for Bruce Banner (he wasn't bad, just not great), they fixed it on their second attempt with Mark Ruffalo. And of course they nailed the casting on GOTG.

It's no surprise that they got it right yet again, with Daredevil.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on April 17, 2015, 08:47:09 PM
Watched two more episodes. This show is too damn good. Marvel raised the bar for superhero television in 2008 with The Spectacular Spider-Man, and now they've done it again with Daredevil. I don't think I've been this engaged by a TV series since I finished The Wire. Just brilliant. Going to buy the Blu-Ray set for sure. There better be a season 2.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on April 17, 2015, 09:21:54 PM
I've already talked about why I personally love "Stick," but my overall personal favorite episode is "Nelson v. Murdock," as I'm all about characters over action, and that was a great character piece, IMO. I love that Foggy didn't just become the "comic relief side character" that lesser writers would have made him. You really get a sense that him and Matt are genuinely great friends, and seeing their trust tested like that really came through in their emotional responses via terrific acting.

Also, the costume design for Daredevil's suit us excellent. One of the best I've seen in the medium, film, TV, or otherwise. It's just a shame that we only got to see it in the finale, so I can't wait for Daredevil's return in The Defenders.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on April 17, 2015, 09:28:32 PM
Nelson v. Murdock is probably my favorite episode so far as well. Foggy is surprisingly great.

I haven't seen the costume in the show proper yet, but it looks very slick and comic-accurate in the still images I've seen. I think the upcoming Deadpool movie is going to have the best superhero costume design yet, though; it literally looks EXACTLY like the comic book!
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on April 17, 2015, 09:33:50 PM
Yes, I like how every episode gives time to breath on a certain character in certain episodes as the plot goes on. Foggy, Karen, Ben, Stick, Jack Murdock, or even Wesley, are all characters I really grew to know by the end. Not to mention characters like Claire, Father Lantom, or Vladimir, who might not have many appearances compared to the rest, but are also very memorable.

I definitely want to see more.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on April 17, 2015, 09:38:36 PM
The costume design on Arrow and The Flash is also excellent, IMO.

The worst superhero costume design from an actual big-budget production easily goes to Green Lantern....because painting CG over Ryan Reynolds doesn't qualify as a costume, and it just looks wrong. I get that they were trying to make it look otherworldly, but it just came off looking....like CG painted over Ryan Reynolds.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on April 17, 2015, 09:43:45 PM
Green Lantern's costume actually looked worse than the Bat-Nipple suits. :shit: :shit: :shit:
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Avaitor on April 18, 2015, 06:45:49 PM
I finally got around to watching the first 2 Daredevil episodes. It's pretty good so far, even if it's not perfect.

Charlie Cox so far is a fine Daredevil. He has a good balance between  charismatic and dedicated that fits the character, and most of his delivery is solid, the Bale-esq line aside. I also like Karen, who's a strong female in the MCU sense, in that she's smart, able, and deserves her own time to shine away from the boys. But I was a little annoyed with Foggy in the first episode, but he won me over a little in the next since he's given something to do as the relief, instead of being it just because.

Besides that, the direction is pretty solid throughout, with some great fight scenes and sharp composition. This helps the merely above-average writing, but I can already tell that there is more to look forward to as it goes along. Consider me sold.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on April 18, 2015, 07:15:04 PM
The first 4-5 episodes are merely solid. Good stuff, but hardly great. I feel like episodes 6 and on are where the show really takes off.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on April 18, 2015, 08:00:29 PM
To be honest, I thought every episode was fantastic. (Still have two left to go, though.)
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on April 19, 2015, 08:32:17 PM
Finished it! I thought the finale could have been a bit longer, but overall it was an excellent and very satisfying show. The ending is great, easily working as both a standalone conclusion and a lead-in to a second season. I do hope they make more outside of that crossover event thing. :)
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on April 19, 2015, 08:40:05 PM
It depends on how successful the show (and related merchandise) is. If it makes Marvel money, we'll get a sequel, though sadly we'll have to wait AT LEAST two whole years to get one, or possibly even longer.

I'm still looking forward to the other Marvel shows on Netflix. I've really liked what I've read of Ed Brubaker's run on Iron Fist, so that should be a great "fun" Marvel series (in contrast to the gritty crime drama that Daredevil is).

One thing that I'm curious about is when exactly this takes place in the MCU timeline. Obviously it has to be after Avengers, but I'm not sure where it fits in the context of Phase Two.

Also, considering that this was the most serious and noticeably darker in tone MCU production to date, it does slap me as incredibly hilarious that this somehow takes place in the same Universe in which Viking demi-gods, a talking raccoon and tree, and apparently Howard The Duck exist. :joy:
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on April 19, 2015, 08:57:08 PM
I'll be sure to do my part and pick up the BDs when they come out. :el_hail:

I'm really looking forward to both Luke Cage and AKA Jessica Jones. I don't know much about the latter character, but the MCU is long overdue for a female-led superhero story, and I'm a huge Bendis apologist (except for when it comes to X-Men, where his writing is complete garbage). I'm sure I'll enjoy Iron Fist as well, but I only really know him as Luke Cage's partner. I should check out Brubaker's run.

I'm just going to assume that Daredevil takes place between Guardians of the Galaxy and Age of Ultron due to its release date. Personally, I find the MCU to be more fun if you also include films like Blade, X-Men, and Big Hero 6 in it, but I've never been a huge stickler for comic book canon, so maybe that's just me. :lol:
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on April 19, 2015, 09:07:01 PM
As for no X-Men, blame Fox for that. Characters like Wolverine and Deadpool would be so awesome in the MCU.

As for Blade, I only really know it by the movies as opposed to the comics. While Daredevil shows that Marvel is willing to do something dark, Blade might be a bit too violent and graphic in nature to be associated with the more family-oriented demographic that Marvel is currently catering to.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on April 19, 2015, 09:10:15 PM
I do wish Deadpool was allowed appear in the MCU just so that we could see him troll the Avengers during Infinity War, but damn, Fox is really killing it right now. First Class and especially Days of Future Past were amazing, and Deadpool looks like a dream come true for me.

I think The Punisher might appear in Daredevil season 2, but yeah, Blade probably isn't going to be brought into the MCU, unfortunately.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on April 19, 2015, 09:18:40 PM
Also, while I know that they aren't exactly great movies, I have a lot of nostalgic attachment to the first two Blade films, and it's hard for me to imagine who would be able to replace Wesley Snipes in that role.

And yeah, Fox is doing great with X-Men right now....because Bryan Singer came back. In the period that he was absent from the franchise, though? It almost self-destructed. Also, the Fantastic Four movie looks awful, so it feels like Fox as a studio doesn't really know what they are doing. They just happened to be lucky enough to get some talented people to save the X-Men franchise.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on April 19, 2015, 09:25:03 PM
I love the first two Blade films. They're not high quality entertainment by any means, but they're ridiculously awesome if all you're expecting are badass popcorn flicks.

Fant Fourstic looks terrible, I agree. That Deadpool movie is buying them a lot of credibility with me, though... I've read some of the leaked script, which they seem to be mostly adhering to, and all I can say is that it's going to be the most accurate version of the character ever seen outside the comics. I mean, I loved the Deadpool game and his appearances in stuff like Hulk Vs., but they aren't exactly good representations of him or his story.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on April 19, 2015, 09:32:08 PM
I love the first two Blade films. They're not high quality entertainment by any means, but they're ridiculously awesome if all you're expecting are badass popcorn flicks.

And also the second one had Guillermo del Toro behind it, who's never not been entertaining when he makes a film, in my book, so there's that. Oh, and I distinctly remember the late, great Gene Siskel giving the original a positive review, so fuck it, I think that they are both cool movies that (mostly) hold up, and prove that R-rated Marvel films can most definitely work.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on April 19, 2015, 09:41:10 PM
My mom wanted me to check if there was a release date for season 2 yet, and I found this article: http://www.ew.com/article/2015/04/15/daredevil-binge-thoughts

I had to stop about halfway through because I was raging too hard. Fucking horrible.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on April 19, 2015, 09:57:30 PM
Pshhh....That's nothing. You should see the hilariously over-the-top level of nit-picking that Arrow has been getting, with about half of it being complaints that they aren't shipping Ollie and Felicity, and the other half being about shit that's barely consequential to anything relating to the actual plot or character arcs going on.

Compared to that, this stuff is pretty tame, though ultimately just as stupid for the fact that it's either nit-picking or completely unfounded criticism.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on April 19, 2015, 10:12:29 PM
I saw one of those Arrow articles I think. Some people just live joyless existences, I guess.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on April 19, 2015, 10:43:32 PM
People just love to complain. No matter how good something is, you'll encounter ass-holes who have nothing better to do than to look for everything wrong with a show or movie rather than enjoying it for what it is.

Even high-profile shows like Game of Thrones or Better Call Saul aren't exempt from this. For the former you get book purists bitching about how it's different from the source matetial, or others making ridiculous claims that it's basically a porno because it has a few sex scenes every couple of episodes (it's actually pretty tame by HBO standards). Nevermind that the writing, acting, and directing are top notch. With BCS it's either complaints about it being too different from Breaking Bad or whining about how "this doesn't connect to this doesn't connect to this" while ignoring the fact that the show is still ongoing and also character-driven rather than just conveniently trying to tie every little incident together.

It makes sense to complain about AOS or Got Ham because those shows have huge, crippling flaws that make them unbearable to watch for some people. At least shows like Daredevil and Arrow are generally good to begin with. Meanwhile, I'm no longer even following those other two shows.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on April 20, 2015, 01:02:48 PM
I'm almost certain a re-watch will bring the early episodes up to the level of the latter ones. Now that we know the characters, it's a lot easier to understand where they're coming from and why exactly things are the way they are. Honestly, I want to re-watch it, but I want to wait a bit longer to let it settle in and watch other things first.

Maybe a season 2 that takes place a few years later is a good thing. That way Daredevil will have grown in experience and become such a threat that the Hand will have to directly engage him themselves.

As for the other Netflix Marvel shows, Jessica Jones will probably be more noir detective in execution so it should transition well between Daredevil and Iron Fist. Though at this rate I'm expecting second seasons for some of these shows. Daredevil apparently did well both critically and in watches.

If we're talking about when it takes place, I found this timeline out there:

Quote
Before 20th Century

Thor: The Dark World (prologue)
Thor (prologue)

20th Century

Agent Carter
The Iron Ceiling (flashbacks)

Captain America: The Winter Soldier (1942 flashback)

Captain America: The First Avenger

Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. (season two)
The Things We Bury (HYDRA Fortress flashbacks)
Shadows (flashbacks)
The Things We Bury (The Rat flashbacks)


Agent Carter
Now is Not the End
Bridge and Tunnel
Time and Tide
The Blitzkrieg Button
The Iron Ceiling
A Sin to Err
Snafu
Valediction


Daredevil (season one)
Shadows in the Glass (flashbacks)

Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. (season two)
Aftershocks (1983 flashbacks)

Guardians of the Galaxy (1988 prologue)

Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. (season two)
The Things We Bury (1989 flashbacks)

Daredevil (season one)
Cut Man (mid-1990s flashbacks)
Into the Ring (mid-1990s flashbacks)
Cut Man (mid-1990s flashbacks)
Into the Ring (mid-1990s flashbacks)
Cut Man (mid-1990s flashbacks)
Stick (mid-1990s flashbacks)


Iron Man 3 (New Years Eve, 1999 prologue)

21st Century

Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. (season two)
Melinda (flashbacks)

Daredevil (season one)
In the Blood (2007 prologue)
Nelson v. Murdock (2010 flashbacks)


Iron Man

Iron Man 2

The Incredible Hulk

Thor

Captain America: The First Avenger (prologue & epilogue)

The Avengers

Iron Man 3

Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. (season one)
Pilot
0-8-4
The Asset
Eye-Spy
Girl in the Flower Dress
FZZT
The Hub


Thor: The Dark World

Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. (season one)
The Well
Repairs
The Bridge
The Magical Place
Seeds
Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D.: The Chase
T.R.A.C.K.S.
T.A.H.I.T.I.
Yes Men
End of the Beginning


Captain America: The Winter Soldier

Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. (season one)
Turn, Turn, Turn
One Door Closes (flashbacks)
Providence
The Only Light in the Darkness
Nothing Personal
Ragtag
Beginning of the End


Guardians of the Galaxy

Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. (season two)
Shadows
Heavy is the Head
Making Friends and Influencing People
Face My Enemy
A Hen in the Wolf House
A Fractured House
The Writing on the Wall
The Things We Bury
Ye Who Enter Here
What They Become
Aftershocks
Who You Really Are
One of Us
Love in the Time of HYDRA
One Door Closes
Afterlife
Melinda
The Frenemy of My Enemy
The Dirty Half Dozen
Scars
S.O.S
I kept it only to films and TV for ease of use.

I would say DD probably takes place around the same time as Guardians.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Avaitor on April 21, 2015, 10:51:51 AM
So the AOS spin-off is very likely going to be about Mockingbird. (http://www.avclub.com/article/agents-shield-spinoff-will-probably-be-about-adria-218300)

I won't lie, I haven't got to the second season yet, but its fans tend to be people who think the show pulled a 180 with the post-Winter Soldier season 1 episodes (spoiler alert: it did not). As a result, I haven't seen Palicki's take on Bobbi. But I do wonder if this means that Hawkeye will appear on the show, and if so, how long will it take until all they do is bicker?
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on April 21, 2015, 11:25:36 AM
People keep saying season 2 was a major turnaround for the show, but as you said, people were also hyping the second half of season 1 which really wasn't an improvement from what I saw.

That said, Marvel needs to keep the quality up and they can't do that if something like AoS is tarnishing their brand. Especially considering that it's their obvious weak link.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on April 21, 2015, 01:29:45 PM
I watched as far as the season two premiere of AOS, and it was still just as much of a POS as when it first started, IMO. That's not even me being harsh. I'm fairly easy to entertain, as evidenced by how much I enjoy The Flash despite it being a bit too formulaic and far from perfect. The problem with AOS was never truly story-related. It was always about characters. None of them besides Phil Coulson are the least bit likable, and even Phil has completely ceased to be interesting in the show. So, when the big Hydra story-line hit, I couldn't care less because I wasn't invested in any of the characters. In fact, I specifically made a post about how Ward's heel turn was essentially a complete waste since the character barely felt any different despite switching sides, and he had absolutely no interesting character arc to go through. It was just "Hi guys, I've actually been evil this whole time, but it's not like you could ever tell thanks to my monotonous acting ability and complete lack of nuanced range."

So, forgive me when I refuse to believe the same people who said that AOS got good in the back half of the first season claim the same thing about the second one. If they can enjoy it, then that's good for them. I just can't bring myself to watch any more of it, though, so I won't.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Avaitor on April 21, 2015, 08:03:04 PM
Well in actual good Marvel news, we're getting a second season of Daredevil sooner than we thought! (http://marvel.com/news/tv/24478/netflix_orders_a_second_season_of_marvels_daredevil)

I got to watch the next couple of episodes earlier today, and while it isn't really a show that you can marathon, it's a good one, alright. I am liking Kingpin so far, as his date was a welcome change of pace and a great introduction to the character. I can't wait to see what's next for him.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Peanutbutter on April 21, 2015, 08:08:33 PM
Thank you Lord Jesus.  :shakeshakeshake:
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on April 21, 2015, 08:09:17 PM
Excellent news!

Quote
"Marvel's A.K.A. Jessica Jones" comes only to Netflix later this year and "Marvel's Luke Cage" premieres on the streaming service in 2016. Future series exclusively debuting on Netflix include “Marvel’s Iron Fist” and “Marvel’s Defenders,” a mini-series event that reimagines a team of self-sacrificing, heroic characters.
I'm guessing it will premiere after the Defenders event, but I can't say enough about this good news. I'm excited!
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on April 21, 2015, 08:10:55 PM
Awesome!! :joy:
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Avaitor on April 21, 2015, 08:27:09 PM
Hmm, but we are losing Steven S. DeKnight for this season. I'm not sure if that's a good sign, but the talent chosen to follow up as producers look promising enough.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on April 23, 2015, 01:46:17 PM
"The Coulson thing was, I think, a little anomalous just because that really came from the television division, which is sort of considered to be its own subsection of the Marvel universe. As far as the fiction of the movies, Coulson is dead." ~ Joss Whedon
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on April 23, 2015, 01:48:14 PM
He means the network shows, I assume. Daredevil is definitely canon to the films and I'm pretty sure Feige said something about wanting The Defenders to potentially appear in Infinity War.

I have no problem with this.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on April 23, 2015, 01:52:09 PM
I think he specifically means Agents of Shield. Nothing in Agent Carter can really be considered non-canonical.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on April 23, 2015, 01:52:57 PM
Agents of S.H.I.T.E. deserves to be non-canon tbh.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on April 23, 2015, 02:08:31 PM
That quote just made my day. I never considered AOS to be canon, anyways.

As for Agent Carter, being set in the past makes it work with continuity either way.

Daredevil also seems like its part of the MCU.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on April 23, 2015, 02:28:49 PM
The Netflix shows certainly are since they're planning to have the Defenders show up in Infinity War.

But, Coulson? I doubt he'll ever show up in the films ever again.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Peanutbutter on April 23, 2015, 03:04:46 PM
So even Whedon now realizes how much his brother screwed up I take it?
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: GregX on April 23, 2015, 11:21:49 PM
"The Coulson thing was, I think, a little anomalous just because that really came from the television division, which is sort of considered to be its own subsection of the Marvel universe. As far as the fiction of the movies, Coulson is dead." ~ Joss Whedon

JOYGASM!!!!

 :shakeshakeshake: :shakeshakeshake: :shakeshakeshake:
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on April 27, 2015, 12:54:26 AM
Just finished the episode. So far, a decent start. And of course everyone and there grandma knows that was Vincent D'Onofrio on the phone. That's one of the most recognizable voices on tv.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on April 27, 2015, 02:03:57 AM
Also, it was so good to hear the Avengers (the movies' events) get referenced.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Avaitor on April 29, 2015, 09:38:07 AM
"I was a mean three-point shooter on my high school basketball team. I like the long shots."
"This isn’t a game, Karen."

I really am enjoying Daredevil, but damn if it doesn't have some dumbass dialogue. Some of the cheesier moments are highlighted by the show's upped violence, which makes them stand out in comparison to the movies. Another moment that comes to mind is the previous episode's "You and I have a lot in common"/"I'm nothing like you!" montage between DD and Kingpin.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on April 29, 2015, 06:59:20 PM
Just finished watching episode 2 of Daredevil. Decent episode outside of too much Foggy and the clumsy fight at the end.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on April 29, 2015, 07:51:28 PM
clumsy fight at the end.
:wth:
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on April 29, 2015, 07:54:27 PM
I liked the fight at the end because it felt realistic. Matt Murdock isn't skilled enough at this point, so his fighting style is supposed to be imperfect and full of mistakes. That combined with the stationary camera (as opposed to terrible shaky-cam) made it feel much more intense.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on April 29, 2015, 08:04:58 PM
Not to mention the fact that he was half-dead and missing a lot of blood which was supposed to parallel with his father marching to his death because it was the right thing to do.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on April 29, 2015, 10:11:15 PM
I forgot to mention that I was so surprised to see Rosario Dawson.

And the fact that Daredevil had his super smell for once. I was geeking out at that. :swoon:
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on April 30, 2015, 01:38:16 AM
Ah, Fisk and Ben Urich in one episode. Beautiful. :'(
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on April 30, 2015, 11:49:29 PM
Ah, Fisk and Ben Urich in one episode. Beautiful. :'(
If it's the one I'm thinking of, that was a pretty powerful episode.

The more I think about this show the more I want to re-watch it.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Peanutbutter on May 07, 2015, 09:34:41 PM
Got some good news and some bad news for you guys.



The bad news is.....Agents of Shield got renewed again.  :bleh:


The good news is.....so did Agent Carter!!!  :shakeshakeshake: :shakeshakeshake: :shakeshakeshake: :shakeshakeshake: :shakeshakeshake: :shakeshakeshake: :shakeshakeshake: :shakeshakeshake:



http://www.spoilertv.com/2015/05/agent-carter-renewed.html
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on May 07, 2015, 09:39:14 PM
It's only good news then. Because Joss Whedon already confirmed that, for all intents and purposes, AOS doesn't actually exist, and thus we can all go on enjoying AC and ignoring AOS.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on May 07, 2015, 09:40:58 PM
AoS was on the bubble. They have a lot to prove next season.

Agent Carter is good news, though. Any word if it's another mini-series event? I liked how packed the first season was because of it and I'd kind of like more like that.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Avaitor on May 07, 2015, 10:00:55 PM
No real word yet, but it seems likely that we're getting another 8 episodes. The first season wasn't successful enough to merit a big enough order for more.

I'm not too surprised that AOS was renewed, either. The show is hardly a big hit, but it serves enough synergy purpose to stick around until ABC can come up with a better longer form Marvel or Star Wars show to replace it.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Avaitor on May 09, 2015, 12:49:48 PM
The Mockingbird spin-off isn't happening. (http://www.avclub.com/article/unlike-anyone-mcu-agents-shield-spinoff-dead-219182)

That's not really surprising, since there was no mention of it during ABC's press release, but this is about as official of a clarification as we can get. Although the other ABC Marvel show could still happen...
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on May 22, 2015, 06:27:38 PM
Watched episode 4 of DareDevil...well that was, brutal. Also, what a good car door that was.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on May 22, 2015, 07:08:36 PM
The darker and more violent nature of Daredevil (an advantage of being a Netflix series) gives me hope that maybe one day we could see something like a new Blade series in the MCU. And yes, I know that a Blade TV series actually existed and ran for one season, so nobody has to bring it up. I just want to see an actual well-written R-rated comic book adaptation again.

I know that I'm in the minority on that opinion, but the thought of something like  this (https://youtu.be/0m822scb5MA) happening to an AOS character or something along those lines is just too much fun.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on May 22, 2015, 08:37:20 PM
I just want to see an actual well-written R-rated comic book adaptation again.
Deadpool! Also, Kingsman and Snowpiercer if we aren't just talking about superhero comics.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on May 22, 2015, 08:48:14 PM
Well, I still haven't seen Kingsman, yet, and I'm excited for Deadpool but can't be sure if it'll be good or not until the movie actually comes out, but Snowpiercer is definitely really good.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on May 24, 2015, 07:16:06 PM
I finished watched episode 5. Things are heating up and whoa, DD actually has his radar sense!
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on May 28, 2015, 11:11:51 PM
I watched episodes 6, 7 and 8 over the last few days. Episode 6 was pretty bleak and I loved it. Episode 7...whoa, I did not expect to ever see a present day Stick. I loved seeing more backstory on Matt. And the fight at the end was so incredible. Episode 8 - within 2 minutes of seeing Bill Fisk, I hated the guy. What a piece of shit.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on May 28, 2015, 11:16:14 PM
Contrasted with Jack Murdock, there isn't much competition over who was the better dad.

Though the Kingpin's obsession with the painting makes much more sense after you see why it appeals to him.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on May 29, 2015, 06:29:04 PM
I have finished episode 9. I love the moral conflict going on. It was a surprise (well kind of, thanks Netflix picture) to see where Matt first meets Fisk. Elena gets killed and Matt meets Fisk and Wesley again and they actually fight. I really didn't see that coming. Also, looks like DD has taken his first life. That was really shocking. And of course so was Foggy unmasking him at the end.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on May 29, 2015, 07:48:54 PM
Aaaand I just finished episode number 10. Foggy's acting is a whole lot better when he's serious/angry, strange enough and this episode made me like him a whole lot more..strange enough. I love the Elektra hint drop when they said Matt was trying to get with a Greek girl. Weird enough, I wouldn't have picked up on that if it wasn't for the movie, probably. Poor Urichs. That was just sad to see. And everything with the Fisks at the end was shocking and surprising. This was really one of my favorite episode if not my favorite so far and there was little action in it.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on May 29, 2015, 07:55:50 PM
I honestly like every character in the show. They did a remarkable job of adding layers to everybody. I wasn't the most knowledgeable on Daredevil before, but I'm definitely planning on changing that eventually.

As for what's next in the show, I think the ending to episode 11 (IIRC) will probably surprise you a great deal.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on May 29, 2015, 08:00:58 PM
Dammit, sentences like your last one is why I was completely ignoring every post in this thread since I started the show. :D Sorry, I'm extra spoiler squeamish, even to the point where it doesn't even make sense.

I just know what I do from the handful of comics I've read...the movie and well that's mostly it.

Also, Leland is making me crack up. "Someone can't hold their liquor". Just typing that makes me crack up. I hope he doesn't get shot.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on May 31, 2015, 05:05:31 PM
Episode 11...yea, that ending was shocking. :o
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on June 01, 2015, 12:46:38 AM
An hour or two ago tonight I finished episode 12 of Daredevil.  :cry: He was supposed to meet Spider-Man. Besides that, whoa, so the obvious back stab was so obvious that I completely did not expect it. I can't complain. One more episode left.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Insomniac on June 01, 2015, 02:07:15 AM
First impressions be damned, I watched the last four episodes of Daredevil in a row today and loved it. I really want to see Marvel invest more in this format than the movies, actually.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on June 01, 2015, 02:34:51 AM
I really want to see Marvel invest more in this format than the movies, actually.
Same here! Serialized television lends itself far better to adaptations of stories told via the comic book format than single films do, I'd say.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on June 01, 2015, 09:45:33 AM
Eh, we're getting both, so I don't see any problems on my end.

Whenever something new and popular comes out, it feels like the popular reaction is: "Wow, this is awesome, screw those Avengers and Guardians movies, those suck compared to this."

But I say that Marvel has it down perfectly. Leave the bigger-budget movies for stuff that's far too reliant on special effects and big actors to be done in television format, like any of the Avengers or solo Avengers films (though, Captain America could arguably work in the TV format) as well as GOTG. With the Defenders characters, Marvel wisely picked street level heroes with little to no outlandish powers or abilities who have plenty of smaller-scale and more character-driven stories to adapt that are perfect for TV.

Marvel's doing it the right way, IMO, so leave the movies the way that they've been. Either way, you're getting what you want, as we have three other solo shows coming to Netflix, a Defenders mini-series, and even a second season of Daredevil.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on June 01, 2015, 11:16:36 AM
First impressions be damned, I watched the last four episodes of Daredevil in a row today and loved it. I really want to see Marvel invest more in this format than the movies, actually.
That's not a bad idea. I pray the Iron Fist show is just as good.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on June 01, 2015, 12:01:56 PM
We're getting a season 2, which bodes well for the future of these series.

First impressions be damned, I watched the last four episodes of Daredevil in a row today and loved it. I really want to see Marvel invest more in this format than the movies, actually.
That's not a bad idea. I pray the Iron Fist show is just as good.
A certain character in this one will be in that show. Though they did push it last in line, and I'm not exactly sure why. But after Daredevil it was the one I was most interested in seeing.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on June 01, 2015, 01:03:59 PM
Guardians is still my favorite MCU thing, so it's not like I'm calling it bad? I've always preferred the TV format to films for anything that contains a lengthy story with lots of character development. And while they couldn't do all the awesome special effects in a GOTG TV show, it would still make for an amazing weekly series.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Avaitor on June 01, 2015, 01:42:22 PM
I think the serialized format works better for some, while other characters are stronger in film. I'd probably get bored of an Iron Man show, even with RDJ, but Daredevil really seemed to have worked better as a series.

Just keep Jeph Loebas as far away as possible.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on June 01, 2015, 02:20:03 PM
I think the serialized format works better for some, while other characters are stronger in film. I'd probably get bored of an Iron Man show, even with RDJ, but Daredevil really seemed to have worked better as a series.
Yeah, I completely agree with this.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on June 01, 2015, 02:26:10 PM
Well, we ARE getting the GOTG animated series in just a few months, but given Marvel's animated show track record since they canceled AEMH, I'm not keeping my hopes up for it to be good.

As for TV vs. Movies, I'm just saying that both have their place. Some big stories work better as movies, whereas long serialized story-lines can be adapted for TV. I've even gone on record saying that I prefer AEMH for its great stories and character development to the live-action Avengers movies, so clearly I enjoy the TV side of things quite a bit.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on June 01, 2015, 02:36:33 PM
Well, we ARE getting the GOTG animated series in just a few months, but given Marvel's animated show track record since they canceled AEMH, I'm not keeping my hopes up for it to be good.
Man Of Action why... :cry:

Quote
As for TV vs. Movies, I'm just saying that both have their place. Some big stories work better as movies, whereas long serialized story-lines can be adapted for TV. I've even gone on record saying that I prefer AEMH for its great stories and character development to the live-action Avengers movies, so clearly I enjoy the TV side of things quite a bit.
I also thought SSM was way better than any of the Spider-Man films! But yeah, it really does depend on what kind of story they're trying to tell.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on June 01, 2015, 04:42:39 PM
A few hours ago, Daredevil became the first live action show I've ever completed (shut up, I know it's getting another season. Let me enjoy my hollow victory). The finale was pretty good and whatshisname is now my 2nd favorite Daredevil (first favorite live action, before anyone says anything stupid.) It sucks that 3 of my 6 favorite characters died (Ben, Owlsley and Wesley). Wesley was turning into my favorite right hand man since Owen.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on June 01, 2015, 05:06:38 PM
Leland has a son, by the way. Just thought I'd throw that out there.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on June 01, 2015, 05:38:42 PM
Feel free to ignore my wall of text. I would have replied sooner if I didn't hate spoilers so damn much. Also, I was thinking about Leland's son a bit. I wonder if he'll try to get Kingpin killed in prison. That would be interesting.

I watched 5 episodes.

Excellent. One of my favorite superhero shows by far.
It's my favorite superhero show so far.
They're currently producing Jessica Jones right now, which means it will probably play out like this:

Daredevil - 13 episodes
A.K.A. Jessica Jones - 13 episodes
Iron Fist - 13 episodes
Luke Cage - 13 episodes
Defenders - 8 episode event

For a total of 60 episodes.

What they do after that is anyone's guess, but I'm almost certain Iron Fist and Luke Cage will share a show should they move to season 2.
Ahh, sweet, 13 episodes and Iron Fist will likely cross over to Luke Cage and vice versa. I hope they give him his yellow energy and use good CG on it and not give it the Jean Grey/Magneto non-effects effects.
I assume Daredevil will get a second season that introduces characters like Elektra and The Punisher into the MCU. Luke Cage & Iron Fist Heroes For Hire as a shared season 2 seems like a no-brainer to me, as well.

Speaking of which, if Fox ends up making a sequel to the Deadpool film, my money's on it being a Cable & Deadpool movie.
:)

I love Punisher but I don't think he fits in MCU at all. I think his movie rights are tied up anyway.

I'd of course love a Cable & Deadpool movie. Isn't Deadpool still tied to the X-Men's universe though?
Wow, I totally disagree about episode 7, it's one of my favorites. Stick is an awesone character, and the stuff you seem to be focusing on were the least important parts of the episode. Black Sky was the Macguffin for this episode (though I still haven't finished the season yet, so maybe it'll come back), and Stick had to be introduced somewhere, so you're complaint about him coming out of nowhere doesn't really make sense since Matt's past has been presented to us in chronological order via the flash-backs, and he of course wouldn't meet Stick until after his dad's death.

The whole episode was also an excellent character-study of Matt and his stance at that point in the series. Stick points out that he'll never get anything truly accomplished until he's willing to cross a certain line. He represents the opposite side of the coin to the priest who serves as Matt's other guiding figure throughout the season, and although Matt rejects him in the episode, he hasn't truly given up the temptation to follow Stick's recommended path.

To me, it's one of the finest written, directed, and acted episodes in the series out of the 11-episodes that I've seen so far. We're just going to have to agree to disagree on that.
Pretty much all of this. I've been thinking ever since I finished the show and I got to say that episode 7 and Nelson Vs. Murdock are my favorites out of the entire series.
When I say he "randomly shows up," I mean he just somehow walks into a parking garage not only knowing that Matt would be there but also that the guy in the mask was him. It's not a huge stretch of the imagination in a universe where characters like Hulk and Thor exist, but it still took me out of the moment, if only briefly. Also, Black Sky may be a MacGuffin, but having what I assume is a child slave pop up only to serve no purpose other than die without any explanation didn't sit right with me.

Maybe it's because I haven't read the comics, but I just thought Stick was an asshole. I get that he's basically Daredevil if Daredevil wasn't compassionate or against killing people, but I didn't particularly have an opinion on him one way or the other. The character study was interesting enough, but it didn't really make me feel anything like the scenes with Matt's dad or Fisk's family did.

I didn't actually dislike the episode though, it was still pretty good; I just wasn't as engaged in it as I was with the other 7. Glad it worked more for you.
He surprise threw kid Matt off of a building for training and Daredevil said he hated him in a comic a read a week or two ago. Does that answer your question? :D
I've already talked about why I personally love "Stick," but my overall personal favorite episode is "Nelson v. Murdock," as I'm all about characters over action, and that was a great character piece, IMO. I love that Foggy didn't just become the "comic relief side character" that lesser writers would have made him. You really get a sense that him and Matt are genuinely great friends, and seeing their trust tested like that really came through in their emotional responses via terrific acting.

Also, the costume design for Daredevil's suit us excellent. One of the best I've seen in the medium, film, TV, or otherwise. It's just a shame that we only got to see it in the finale, so I can't wait for Daredevil's return in The Defenders.
:shakeshakeshake: :swoon: :swoon: You love Nelson V. Murdock as much as I do.

Also, I have no clue what The Defenders is.
I finally got around to watching the first 2 Daredevil episodes. It's pretty good so far, even if it's not perfect.

Charlie Cox so far is a fine Daredevil. He has a good balance between  charismatic and dedicated that fits the character, and most of his delivery is solid, the Bale-esq line aside. I also like Karen, who's a strong female in the MCU sense, in that she's smart, able, and deserves her own time to shine away from the boys. But I was a little annoyed with Foggy in the first episode, but he won me over a little in the next since he's given something to do as the relief, instead of being it just because.

Besides that, the direction is pretty solid throughout, with some great fight scenes and sharp composition. This helps the merely above-average writing, but I can already tell that there is more to look forward to as it goes along. Consider me sold.
Yeah, Foggy was getting on my nerves at first. The fact that he's probably my favorite normal human (i.e. not a badass or deranged or a hero or anything) in comic books right now made it that much worse. I still prefer the Mark Waid version but he's in a good 2nd place ever since Nelson v. Murdock and hasn't had a misstep since. :)
I love the first two Blade films. They're not high quality entertainment by any means, but they're ridiculously awesome if all you're expecting are badass popcorn flicks.

Fant Fourstic looks terrible, I agree. That Deadpool movie is buying them a lot of credibility with me, though... I've read some of the leaked script, which they seem to be mostly adhering to, and all I can say is that it's going to be the most accurate version of the character ever seen outside the comics. I mean, I loved the Deadpool game and his appearances in stuff like Hulk Vs., but they aren't exactly good representations of him or his story.
I loved his role in Hulk Vs., I like him in Marvel Ultimate Alliance 1 and 2 were he's a giant troll, played as him a bit in X-Men Legends 2 but can't say much about that and I still stand by him being the funniest boss ever in Shattered Dimensions. But of course the world still needs much more Deadpool.
clumsy fight at the end.
:wth:
I still stand by this. ;D
Ah, Fisk and Ben Urich in one episode. Beautiful. :'(
If it's the one I'm thinking of, that was a pretty powerful episode.

The more I think about this show the more I want to re-watch it.
Wihch one did you think it was?

I know that I'm in the minority on that opinion, but the thought of something like  this (https://youtu.be/0m822scb5MA) happening to an AOS character or something along those lines is just too much fun.
Awesome
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on June 01, 2015, 05:52:51 PM
I don't remember what I was referring to. But I still want to rewatch it.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on June 01, 2015, 06:04:35 PM
I was referring their first episode, iirc.

I really need to rewatch this show as well. I took like a month break in between the early episodes.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on June 01, 2015, 06:19:08 PM
Actually, I'm pretty sure that Marvel has already gotten the rights back to Punisher, as well as Blade.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on June 01, 2015, 06:35:53 PM
I wasn't sure. I just remember ramblings of a sequel to War Zone being a Barracuda movie. I would have preferred that since I love Barracuda and like Warzone.

And yeah, Blade without Wesley would be hard to see. When they say an actor is a character, he's probably at the top of my list with Blade.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on June 04, 2015, 03:53:42 PM
It's interesting how Fisk hates seeing his name dragged through the mud as much as his father did. So much so that he had the freaking internet scrubbed of anything bad about him.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on June 09, 2015, 05:00:37 PM
The Punisher will be in season 2 of Daredevil! (http://marvel.com/news/tv/24699/jon_bernthal_cast_as_frank_castle_in_the_netflix_original_series_marvels_daredevil)

This is a perfect fit both for the themes of the show and for the character himself. I also much prefer Frank Castle when he works with someone else.

Can't wait for this!

(http://x.annihil.us/u/prod/marvel/i/mg/9/c0/5577507a7fdad/standard_incredible.jpg)
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on June 09, 2015, 06:16:16 PM
That should certainly be interesting. I wonder if it means the show will get to Punisher Max levels of blood and gore and violence in Season 2.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Peanutbutter on June 09, 2015, 08:10:35 PM
The Punisher will be in season 2 of Daredevil! (http://marvel.com/news/tv/24699/jon_bernthal_cast_as_frank_castle_in_the_netflix_original_series_marvels_daredevil)

This is a perfect fit both for the themes of the show and for the character himself. I also much prefer Frank Castle when he works with someone else.

Can't wait for this!

(http://x.annihil.us/u/prod/marvel/i/mg/9/c0/5577507a7fdad/standard_incredible.jpg)



HOLY CRAP THAT'S AWESOME!!!!  :swoon:



Please let this be the beginning of a Punisher spin-off. A Punisher series done like Daredevil would be amazing.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on June 10, 2015, 01:59:03 PM
http://www.comicvine.com/articles/jon-bernthal-cast-as-frank-castle-for-second-seaso/1100-152544/ (http://www.comicvine.com/articles/jon-bernthal-cast-as-frank-castle-for-second-seaso/1100-152544/) Interesting.
(http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/7/73958/4615993-chfdzadxeaif0b5.jpg)
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on June 10, 2015, 03:01:49 PM
I love it when actors familiarize themselves with the source material. That probably contributes to why Charlie Cox was so good as Daredevil.

As I said before, just look at the early trailers for Daredevil and imagine Frank Castle in there. He fits perfectly. Though I do heavily anticipate the moral battles between the two more than anything.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on June 10, 2015, 03:18:22 PM
They'll probably start out as enemies and then end up becoming allies by the middle of the season, with the obvious clash between them initially being their stances on killing.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on June 10, 2015, 03:36:07 PM
(http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11114/111144184/4616701-0344908847-CHG0n.png)

Pretty cool.

I do wonder what else season 2 will have. I'm thinking they'll save Elektra, Bullseye, and The Hand for season 3 at this rate, but focus instead on what the rise of a hero like Daredevil would entail in Hell's Kitchen and the power vacuum the Kingpin left. Or maybe Fisk still pushes things from behind bars. I'd guess Tombstone, Ikari, The Owl, and Typhoid Mary, are obvious candidates for immediate threat level villains all working from different places.

Either way, I'm excited.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on June 10, 2015, 06:39:01 PM
The Owl? He's kind of dead, unless you mean Leland's son. I have a theory that he'll have the same name as his father and try to kill Kingpin in jail (did I already say this?) I don't know about if whatever powers The Owl has will carry over into the show though. The Hand established a foothold with whatever property that acquired in Hell's Kitchen (namely Elena's apartment complex) so I'm 100% convinced that they'll be in season 2. It seems a bit early for Elektra and Bullseye but then again time will probably pass a lot in between both seasons so maybe it won't feel rushed. It's probably just me though.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on June 10, 2015, 06:46:31 PM
I assume Leland's son will become The Owl to try and crush Fisk for what he did to his father. Tombstone would obviously fill in the void left by the crime lords and the other two are just obvious street level threats that would threaten Daredevil more directly. Honestly, I don't see any other Daredevil villains outside The Hand and these really fitting into the tone of this show, and The Hand could very well still be involved sending assassins like Ikari after him.

Elektra and Bullseye make a lot of sense, but they're a bit too important to Daredevil to be on the sidelines this soon into the game. Though I guess they can be introduced, yet more as side/background characters for now.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on June 10, 2015, 07:29:03 PM
Elektra and Bullseye make a lot of sense, but they're a bit too important to Daredevil to be on the sidelines this soon into the game. Though I guess they can be introduced, yet more as side/background characters for now.
I have a feeling both of them will pop up next season in minor roles and then return as major characters for season 3. I also think they might end up making a new Punisher movie (or series) if his character is well-received in season 2.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on June 10, 2015, 07:40:52 PM
A series is more likely since Marvel tends to keep its movies more family-friendly, whereas they can get away with darker story-lines and a bit more violence on Netflix.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on June 10, 2015, 07:53:47 PM
Something that puzzled me recently is that Marvel apparently said they want their Netflix shows to remain somewhat family-friendly, like "hard PG-13 instead of R." Now, I don't know if it's just me, but I'm not sure what planet you'd have to be on to consider Daredevil a PG-13 series...
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on June 10, 2015, 08:09:47 PM
Well, maybe I've just watched too much Game of Thrones (and HBO shows in general), but the violence in Daredevil seemed fairly tame to me. There was blood and on-screen deaths, but more often than not the violence was implied rather than shown in full force (such as with the notorious car door scene).

The real maturity of DD came from its themes rather than its violence, IMO.

I'd also like to point out that the way movies and TV are rated these days are complete BS, IMO. This video does an excellent job of explaining it: https://youtu.be/O-NeJRrgoTY
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Insomniac on June 10, 2015, 08:11:36 PM
Yeah, PG-13 seems fitting for Daredevil. It didn't have much I wouldn't show to teenagers.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on June 10, 2015, 08:16:09 PM
That seems like a good video, I'll watch it soon.

Maybe I'm out of touch when it comes to movie ratings (as I hardly pay attention to them anymore), but I'm not sure this scene would fly in a PG-13, even today: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cEW53_5donY&t=18s Obviously it's nothing compared to Game of Thrones, but then again neither are most NC-17 films.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on June 10, 2015, 08:22:06 PM
I had considered that scene, but while it is definitely violent, it's in a darkly lit area and you barely see any blood. I personally feel that it could count as "hard PG-13" rather than straight-up "R" material, myself. Personally I find the car door scene to be more disturbing, and once again that's still more implied violence rather than directly shown.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on June 10, 2015, 08:27:57 PM
I think maybe 20 years ago the car door bit could have gotten an R rating, but yeah, it's not particularly explicit despite the shocking-ness, so I guess it wouldn't today.

To be fair, I almost never watch modern PG-13 movies unless they're Marvel or James Bond, so I don't really know what kind of stuff can fly in them these days. DD just seemed a lot more brutal to me than, say, The Avengers. Though I guess it wasn't too much worse than Casino Royale, and that was almost a decade ago.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on June 10, 2015, 08:49:31 PM
The original Star Wars featured a scene with an arm getting severed and blood leaking out, and TESB had a scene where Han Solo slices open a creature and has Luke covered in its entrails to keep him from freezing to death. Indiana Jones has a scene where Nazis get their faces melted off. Poltergeist has a scene where a guy hallucinates ripping his face off. Beetlegeuce has way too much bizarre and fucked-up imagery to keep track of, and Michael Keaton quite clearly drops an F-bomb in one infamous line of the film.

Guess what all of those movies have in common? :humhumhum:

It's not that movies today would get a harsher rating twenty years ago. It's the other way around, actually. Censorship has actually gotten worse for PG and PG-13 movies over the years. None of those movies that I mentioned could even dream of getting away with a PG rating if they came out today and didn't heavily edit those scenes to tone them down. On the flip side, movies like The Lord of the Rings and The Avengers would have easily been PG had they come out in the 80's or early 90's.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on June 10, 2015, 08:54:31 PM
You're right that censorship has gotten worse overall, but for some reason my brain always defaults to how Evil Dead 2 was apparently so "shocking" that it got banned in some countries and received an NC-17 in the US, when it could have easily gotten a PG-13 today.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on June 10, 2015, 11:18:48 PM
I assume Leland's son will become The Owl to try and crush Fisk for what he did to his father. Tombstone would obviously fill in the void left by the crime lords and the other two are just obvious street level threats that would threaten Daredevil more directly. Honestly, I don't see any other Daredevil villains outside The Hand and these really fitting into the tone of this show, and The Hand could very well still be involved sending assassins like Ikari after him.

Elektra and Bullseye make a lot of sense, but they're a bit too important to Daredevil to be on the sidelines this soon into the game. Though I guess they can be introduced, yet more as side/background characters for now.
Whoops, I missed you said Season 3. Looks like we agree there on Elektra and Bullseye.

Tombstone is a Daredevil enemy, right? I just know him from the Spider-Man cartoon, lol. Too bad they can no longer use the Urich angle with him.  :(
I think maybe 20 years ago the car door bit could have gotten an R rating, but yeah, it's not particularly explicit despite the shocking-ness, so I guess it wouldn't today.

To be fair, I almost never watch modern PG-13 movies unless they're Marvel or James Bond, so I don't really know what kind of stuff can fly in them these days. DD just seemed a lot more brutal to me than, say, The Avengers. Though I guess it wasn't too much worse than Casino Royale, and that was almost a decade ago.
This. I think I'm just comparing the show with other PG-13 movies when I think the show would be "R" territory.

And in what why would they not consider LOTR a PG movie? lol I also remember Goldeneye being PG, which is shocking compared to how they rated movies afterwards.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on June 10, 2015, 11:26:13 PM
Tombstone is a Daredevil enemy and one of the crime boss supervillains of Marvel like Kingpin and Silvermane. But Tombstone is the next best thing to have with Wilson Fisk in jail.

His power would also be quite difficult for both Daredevil and Punisher to overcome, too. I'm certain next season will have a few more dangerous street level powers like his and Typhoid Mary's are.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on June 10, 2015, 11:38:52 PM
Silvermane...sounds like another familiar face from the 90s Spidey cartoon. lol

I wonder how they'll handle supervillains in this show.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on June 10, 2015, 11:50:00 PM
You should check out Tombstone's appearances on Spectacular Spiderman. If he's even half as good on Daredevil as he is in that show, it would be interesting.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on June 10, 2015, 11:52:06 PM
 :immad: :imnothappy: I'll consider the following.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on June 18, 2015, 01:07:39 AM
(https://a.disquscdn.com/uploads/mediaembed/images/2142/5781/original.jpg)
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on June 27, 2015, 02:19:09 PM
http://www.comicvine.com/articles/season-2-of-daredevil-will-be-daredevil-vs-the-pun/1100-152740/ (http://www.comicvine.com/articles/season-2-of-daredevil-will-be-daredevil-vs-the-pun/1100-152740/)
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on July 07, 2015, 09:55:35 PM
I'm a bit late but http://www.comicvine.com/articles/marvel-announces-elodie-yung-to-play-elektra-in-da/1100-152837/ (http://www.comicvine.com/articles/marvel-announces-elodie-yung-to-play-elektra-in-da/1100-152837/)
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on July 07, 2015, 10:11:44 PM
Now I await Bullseye and we should be on our way.

In other news, Marvel still hasn't cracked Iron Fist yet (http://birthmoviesdeath.com/2015/07/02/marvel-hasnt-cracked-the-iron-fist-series-yet). Is that really so hard to just use the Brubaker comics and old kung-fu movies as a source? That's really what people want to see.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on July 08, 2015, 12:11:18 AM
Quote
You could technically do that with Iron Fist - he could mention his chi and shit a couple of times, but you don't have his hand glow

I stopped reading after this. If his hands don't glow, I don't watch. seriously.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on July 08, 2015, 12:25:35 AM
It's easy to take for granted how tough it is to translate something as out there as superhero comics to a medium of movies or television and actually make it good, especially since Marvel has been doing that for years, now.

But make no mistake, making films is hard work, and most of what you actually end up seeing in the final product vastly differs from the original concepts that were initially pitched. Iron Man, Guardians of the Galaxy, and Daredevil didn't just happen overnight and turn out good simply because Marvel wanted them to. Those took a lot of planning and effort. So I can understand perfectly fine how Marvel has to take its time with Iron Fist.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on July 28, 2015, 02:12:22 PM
Quote
News is coming out that Punisher could get his own stand-alone series now. Netflix Chief Content Officer Ted Sarandos revealed “Some [shows] will selectively have multiple seasons as they come out of the gate."
(http://www.comicvine.com/articles/netflix-confirms-when-jessica-jones-will-air-and-f/1100-153034/)
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on August 09, 2015, 05:09:36 PM
http://www.comicvine.com/articles/images-of-jon-bernthal-as-frank-castle-for-daredev/1100-153168/ (http://www.comicvine.com/articles/images-of-jon-bernthal-as-frank-castle-for-daredev/1100-153168/)
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on September 28, 2015, 04:24:23 PM
Jessica Jones trailer. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eQ3s178GW0Q)

November 20th. Looks like it's making 2015 after all.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Daikun on October 23, 2015, 04:54:59 PM
Jessica Jones trailer. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eQ3s178GW0Q)

November 20th. Looks like it's making 2015 after all.

Full trailer. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nWHUjuJ8zxE)
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on October 23, 2015, 07:42:31 PM
It definitely looks like a good followup to Daredevil. I'm glad it made 2015.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on October 24, 2015, 07:06:44 PM
Ah, less than a month away. Jeez Marvel, why so awesome?
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on November 19, 2015, 10:35:26 PM
When's the exact time that Jessica Jones is released?

Anyway, my expectations are low but I wouldn't be surprised if Marvel blew me away again. I want to get some snacks for this.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on November 19, 2015, 10:47:06 PM
I honestly can't remember when Daredevil was put up, but it was a bit of a wait.

Still, I'm hoping for the best from this.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Avaitor on November 20, 2015, 12:58:36 AM
Netflix's shows usually come out at 3 am eastern time, since they're based in the west coast. At the same time though, they did put the latest season of OITNB up at 9 pm in the summer, so who knows.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on November 20, 2015, 01:36:13 AM
Well, I'll probably be late today watching it so it'll probably not matter. :D
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: GregX on November 20, 2015, 10:30:13 AM
So, let's see, what's the tally now?

Agents of SHIELD: Complete and total crap.
Agent Carter: Terrific.
Daredevil: Awesome
Jessica Jones: Tragically beautiful... maybe I'm being premature, I'm only two episodes in, but it hooked me.

I'm no mathematician, but I think this averages out to Marvel's TV department being very good at what they do. Now, if only their animation department would follow suit.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on November 20, 2015, 12:22:18 PM
Glad to see that you enjoyed Daredevil after all. Simlar to me, it looked like the first couple of episodes hadn't really grabbed you. I ended up really getting hooked on the show by the episode five cliffhanger, myself.

I really wish that I could start Jessica Jones today, but I'll have to hold off until after Thanksgiving for reasons and shit.

Looking at their output so far, AOS sticks out like a sore thumb. When I found out that none of the movie department people had any involvement with it, and that Kevin Feige personally oversaw the production of Agent Carter, it all suddenly made perfect sense. Agent Carter and Daredevil were run by talented people. AOS is run by ABC and hacks. No wonder the movie department has disowned it.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on November 20, 2015, 09:42:14 PM
Checked out the first episode of Jessica Jones. It was really good! I liked the Daredevil premiere more than most, but this was a much better series opener. The writing and acting were both great, but the soundtrack and cinematography were the clear standouts IMO. Excellent jazzy score and fantastic usage of color/camera movement. Can't wait to watch the second one tomorrow! :joy:
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on November 20, 2015, 09:56:55 PM
I watched the first couple of episodes, they're good but not as strong as Daredevil. Gets much better as it goes, though. The second half of episode 3 and on through episode 4 are great. Still have more to go.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: LumRanmaYasha on November 20, 2015, 11:38:40 PM
It's out? Ack, and I still haven't watched Daredevil. My backlog is piling up... :sweat:
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on November 21, 2015, 05:02:29 PM
Saw the next two episodes. I wouldn't really say this show is either better or worse than Daredevil - it has completely different strengths and similar weaknesses - but, for me, it's definitely just as engaging. Despite having very little screen time so far, Kilgrave is already my second favorite MCU villain (doubt it will be possible for anyone to surpass Fisk). I'm liking these Netflix shows way better than the movies, to be honest.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Avaitor on November 21, 2015, 05:44:27 PM
I'm starting this up tonight, and I'm excited!
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on November 21, 2015, 07:00:59 PM
I'm liking these Netflix shows way better than the movies, to be honest.

Eh, I think that it's a tad unfair to group the movies altogether and then say that "this or that" is way better than those collectively mediocre Marvel movies, which I have never agreed with, myself. On the contrary, Marvel has been pretty good about tonally differentiating their different franchises, despite them all sharing a Universe. Captain America is not Iron Man, and Iron Man is not Thor.

Is it fair to say that the Netflix shows are on par with or maybe even a little better than Marvel's best movies like Iron Man, Guardians, The Winter Soldier, and so on? Absolutely. And it's just as fair to say that they are way better than Marvel's weaker output like The Incredible Hulk, Iron Man 2, or Thor: The Dark World. But lumping them all together and using the weaker films of different franchises to collectively hold down the quality of genuinely great films in their own rights doesn't make much sense to me, personally.

Personally, I still think that Marvel has it down really well with which characters are more well-suited to films and which to shows. Captain America and Guardians of the Galaxy, for example, are much better as big-budget films that can really tell epic stories that don't have the constraints of a TV budget. Daredevil, Jessica Jones, Luke Cage, and Iron Fist are all street level heroes who work better tackling smaller cases and such.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on November 21, 2015, 09:49:00 PM
Eh, I think that it's a tad unfair to group the movies altogether and then say that "this or that" is way better than those collectively mediocre Marvel movies, which I have never agreed with, myself.
When did I do that?

You know I love Guardians of the Galaxy and both Captain America films, and also like the original Iron Man. The only MCU movies I actually think are bad would be Iron Man 2 and Incredible Hulk; I will readily admit that the Avengers films are good (especially the first one) but not my cup of tea. I just happen to think that Daredevil and (what I've seen of) Jessica Jones are the best superhero shows I've watched, along with Spectacular Spider-Man. Saying I find something superior to something else does not necessarily mean I think the latter is a lesser work. To this day, Guardians of the Galaxy and Winter Soldier are by far my favorite superhero movies (unless you count Kick-Ass, I guess).

Quote
On the contrary, Marvel has been pretty good about tonally differentiating their different franchises, despite them all sharing a Universe. Captain America is not Iron Man, and Iron Man is not Thor.

Is it fair to say that the Netflix shows are on par with or maybe even a little better than Marvel's best movies like Iron Man, Guardians, The Winter Soldier, and so on? Absolutely. And it's just as fair to say that they are way better than Marvel's weaker output like The Incredible Hulk, Iron Man 2, or Thor: The Dark World. But lumping them all together and using the weaker films of different franchises to collectively hold down the quality of genuinely great films in their own rights doesn't make much sense to me, personally.
Are you reading my posts from 2-3 years ago or something? All I said was that I'm finding myself liking the Netflix shows more than the films so far. Yes, that's a generalization, but DD and JJ are easily my favorite entries in the MCU at this moment in time, somehow surpassing 2014's films, which I already thought were 10/10 comic book adaptations. I love the artful manner in which these shows are shot and the excellent development they were able to give Fisk, plus I find the MCU's versions of Matt Murdock and Jessica Jones to be the most interesting protagonists in a live action superhero adaptation to date. Each series has a few noticeable problems, sure, but rarely have I found myself so engaged by television. I'm only lumping The First Avenger in with The Dark World in the sense that they are both films in the same series of films. Obviously there is a huge quality disparity between the two, and I'm not judging the best movies on the merits of the worst ones; I legitimately have found both serialized TV entries more enjoyable than even the best of the theatrical releases. My comment was not meant to disparage what Marvel puts into theaters as a whole, but more to celebrate just how good I think their Netflix output is so far.

Quote
Personally, I still think that Marvel has it down really well with which characters are more well-suited to films and which to shows. Captain America and Guardians of the Galaxy, for example, are much better as big-budget films that can really tell epic stories that don't have the constraints of a TV budget. Daredevil, Jessica Jones, Luke Cage, and Iron Fist are all street level heroes who work better tackling smaller cases and such.
I agree that the Avengers characters are all better suited to film than television (except Spider-Man if you count him, his story really needs a treatment similar to SSM to reach its full potential IMO), but I think Guardians at least could work equally well for both. A big budget is preferable, of course, but I could easily seem them making a truly great Firefly or Star Trek-esque TV show out of GOTG (the Man of Action cartoon doesn't count).
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on November 21, 2015, 10:18:12 PM
Ah, I misunderstood you, my mistake. ;)

I personally love the better Marvel movies as much as I love Daredevil and Agent Carter (I still have yet to see Jessica Jones). I can understand and respect your viewpoint, though.

Sorry if it seemed like I was attacking your opinion. It seemed like you think that I did, but I was only responding with my defense to what I thought that you were saying, instead of what you were actually saying. :)
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on November 21, 2015, 10:29:58 PM
It's okay! Sorry if I got a little overly defensive. :sweat: I know I've said things like what you were defending against in the past, and I'm trying to distance myself away from such bad vibes and unfair generalizations. I'm definitely not trying to paint my opinion as the "right" one or anything! I do agree that the better Marvel movies are every bit as good as DD and JJ, but I think I'm just more partial to the lengthy serialization format overall. Which is probably why I still feel gutted over SSM's cancellation. :(

Should I watch Agent Carter, by the way? I intentionally avoided it at the time because I was worried about it being too similar to AOS, but it seems like it might have a similar feeling to The First Avenger, which is of course excellent. :)
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on November 21, 2015, 10:46:46 PM
Yeah, as a fan of The First Avenger, I absolutely loved Agent Carter. Keep in mind that despite being an ABC show, it's not run by the same people who do AOS. Kevin Feige and the rest of the head movie department people had no involvement in the latter, but got personally involved with Agent Carter, and the vast difference in quality shows. It also helps that Hayley Atwell is a superb leading actress, and having Shea Whigham from Boardwalk Empire doesn't hurt either. ;)
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on November 21, 2015, 10:55:17 PM
Okay, I'll be sure to check it out, then. :D
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Avaitor on November 22, 2015, 02:33:11 AM
It's always nice to see Clarke Peters, and hear his hella voice again!
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on November 22, 2015, 02:56:25 AM
It's always nice to see Clarke Peters, and hear his hella voice again!
God yes. I sort of squealed when I saw him in episode 2. :il_hahaha:
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Avaitor on November 22, 2015, 12:40:11 PM
I'm 3 episodes in, and this is very good. I don't want to say if it's better or worse than Daredevil, though, since they're different, equally well-made series.

But really, while I do understand the complaint that Marvel needs to have more female and non-white-led properties (which is totally true, but let's please don't act like this is a problem that only Marvel is guilty of), people have got to stop sleeping on the shows. Agent Carter and Jessica Jones are steps in the right direction.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Peanutbutter on November 22, 2015, 01:09:24 PM
I marathoned through more of the episodes yesterday afternoon. I only have three episodes left. Jessica Jones is superb!  I love that she's definitely flawed but not to the point of her being a jerk, which a number broadcast and cable stations would go overboard with. I like Trish and Malcolm, and even Officer Simpson. I don't really care for the lawyer and her subplot though. Man or woman, an affair angle in a show like this just comes off like padding. But the rest is very good! David Tennant knocks it out of the park as Kilgrave. Honestly, I don't see why he's not ever referred to as the Purple Man. I can understand not having his skin purple like it is in the comics, but in a show that's otherwise subtle I don't think it was a good choice to have always referred to as Kilgrave when Purple Man can be used much more subtly.



The only real bad thing about Jessica Jones is it triggers my Daredevil withdrawal. DD's second season can't come soon enough. Also can't wait until Punisher's series starts. I hope these people will also do Ghost Rider, that would make for a cool series.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on November 22, 2015, 02:22:54 PM
The only real bad thing about Jessica Jones is it triggers my Daredevil withdrawal. DD's second season can't come soon enough.
I know! :drool:

I'm 3 episodes in, and this is very good. I don't want to say if it's better or worse than Daredevil, though, since they're different, equally well-made series.
Yeah, that's pretty much how I feel, as well. It feels like neither a retread of nor an attempt to outdo DD, IMO; it's just its own thing (like how all the MCU films are different from each other). The way it should be!
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Avaitor on November 22, 2015, 03:38:44 PM
Also, it's strangely a minority opinion to still dislike AOS, but everything I've seen from even now gives me no incentive to think that it's a good show.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on November 22, 2015, 05:07:40 PM
A lot of people seem to agree it's gotten better, but since it's practically been rendered non-canon and there are so many better superhero shows to watch from both Marvel and DC, I have to wonder why anyone would bother.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on November 22, 2015, 05:11:03 PM
Despite having to take a mandatory state board exam tomorrow, I decided to call it quits on studying since I've been doing that for almost a month and there isn't really much more I can do to cram dull, repetitive state statutes into my head.

So, I decided to check out the first two episodes of Jessica Jones. I really like what I've seen so far. Krysten Ritter (who I distinctly remember from season two of Breaking Bad) is great in the role, and I was surprised to see that Luke Cage is a supporting character in this series, being that he's going to be getting his own solo-show next.

It actually kind of bums me out that I'll be too busy packing up for my trip home to watch the rest of this show until after Thanksgiving.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on November 22, 2015, 05:22:38 PM
A lot of people seem to agree it's gotten better

Even the people who actually like it still seem to admit that it's one of the weaker superhero shows, though. In this video from Screen Junkies, three different comic book fans all unanimously rank it below all of its competition except for Gotham: https://youtu.be/lGRzAAV1yCk
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on November 22, 2015, 06:56:27 PM
I just finished watching the first two episodes. Kind of funny how the show wears its raunchiness on its sleeve. Besides that, this show has my attention and I like Jones.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on November 22, 2015, 10:22:59 PM
Saw the fifth and sixth episodes. Wow, Krysten Ritter and David Tennant are such talented actors! I love Jessica's character and Kilgrave is easily the scariest villain in any superhero comic book adaptation I've seen. Just like DD, this just gets better with every episode. I thirst for Daredevil season 2 and Luke Cage now. :drool:
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on November 22, 2015, 10:35:44 PM
Speaking of Daredevil season 2, I've heard that apparently the production people at Netflix are so impressed with how The Punisher has turned out in the early footage that they want Marvel to give him his own spin-off show.

Also, is Kilgrave the same character as The Purple Man from Avengers: Earth's Mightiest Heroes? I know nothing about the comic books, but I get that impression based on the fact that both characters use mind control and in JJ you see purple lighting around Jessica whenever she's thinking about him and his influence on her.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on November 22, 2015, 10:38:53 PM
Speaking of Daredevil season 2, I've heard that apparently the production people at Netflix are so impressed with how The Punisher has turned out in the early footage that they want Marvel to give him his own spin-off show.
That's awesome! An adaptation of Punisher MAX with real effort put into it would be a dream come true. :swoon: Also, I hope Luke Cage and Iron First have a combined season 2 titled Heroes For Hire. :)

Quote
Also, is Kilgrave the same character as The Purple Man from Avengers: Earth's Mightiest Heroes? I know nothing about the comic books, but I get that impression based on the fact that both characters use mind control and in JJ you see purple lighting around Jessica whenever she's thinking about him and his influence on her.
Yep! In the Jessica Jones comic book, Alias, Kilgrave is actually purple and also referred to as The Purple Man.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Avaitor on November 23, 2015, 12:13:30 AM
I still kind of want a Daredevil & Black Widow show somewhere down the road, but since it seems like we're getting Elektra sooner than later, and who knows how much longer Johansson will play Nat, that seems like a pipe dream.

But Power Man & Iron Fist needs to happen, yes. I also would like to see The Pulse happen, but it'd probably have to happen without Jameson. I think that Robbie could appear, though, since he's yet to appear in a Spider-Man movie.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on November 23, 2015, 09:17:24 AM
I badly want them to cast Iron Fist now because I want a Luke Cage & Iron Fist spin off show (Call it Heroes For Hire!) sooner than later.

I only got to see episode 5 this weekend, but it was a great episode. That opening theme is just incredible. Kilgrave sure is one nasty creep.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on November 23, 2015, 03:11:55 PM
Episode 3. Jessica finally meet Kilgrave and much more raunchiness ensues. I'm loving this show
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on November 23, 2015, 09:15:53 PM
Only got to watch one episode today, but it was really intense! Kind of wish I could just marathon it like some people. :il_hahaha:
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Peanutbutter on November 23, 2015, 10:56:46 PM
Saw the final three episodes earlier today. This series is a blast. I won't spoil it but the final showdown between Jess and Purple Man (I refuse to use Kilgrave because it's more stupid and sillier sounding than Purple Man and its not his real name in this anyway) is great. I can't wait to see what they do with more seasons of this.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on November 23, 2015, 11:01:42 PM
Just be glad they removed one of the L's. It was literally just the words kill and grave mashed together in the comic. :lol:
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Avaitor on November 24, 2015, 12:52:04 AM
Yeah, Bendis isn't exactly subtle.

I'm watching episode 7 now, and I'm still very positive towards the show. The acting and writing are great all around!
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Insomniac on November 24, 2015, 02:15:19 AM
Yeah, Bendis isn't exactly subtle.
He was named before Bendis even worked on Marvel though.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Avaitor on November 24, 2015, 02:34:40 AM
Yeah, Bendis isn't exactly subtle.
He was named before Bendis even worked on Marvel though.
Shit, and I actually have the first Daredevil Essentials book somewhere. Lee is definitely not subtle, either.

I'm on episode 9 now, and holy shit! There were instances that I felt Daredevil wasn't able to fully handle its darkness, but i feel like Jessica Jones has this down 100%. It's getting more painful to watch, but is all the more powerful to handle. Great stuff.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on November 26, 2015, 05:31:10 PM
I finished the series! Jessica is now my favorite MCU protagonist (closely followed by Daredevil and Captain America) and Kilgrave is now my second favorite antagonist (after Fisk, naturally). What a truly great show, just like DD. Pretty psyched for the upcoming second seasons, Luke Cage, Iron Fist, and Defenders now. :) If only we could get a third season of Spectacular Spider-Man as well...
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on November 26, 2015, 05:41:19 PM
....And AEMH (with the original team of writers, of course).
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on November 26, 2015, 05:45:54 PM
....And AEMH (with the original team of writers, of course).
And let's also have them cancel the Man of Action Guardians of the Galaxy cartoon for one made by the AEMH and SSM staff. ;)
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on November 26, 2015, 05:55:00 PM
I hope they're making good progress on Iron Fist. That should be fairly different from the other MCU series and movies (until Doctor Strange, anyway) dealing with mysticism and martial arts. Last I heard itwas pushed last because they were having problems getting it together.

....And AEMH (with the original team of writers, of course).
And let's also have them cancel the Man of Action Guardians of the Galaxy cartoon for one made by the AEMH and SSM staff. ;)
Now that would have been awesome.

Unfortunately, the animated shows have no hope until they get someone new in charge of them.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on November 26, 2015, 06:09:25 PM
Jeph Loeb (I know, I know) said in an interview that the rumors were false and Iron Fist's development is proceeding smoothly. I'm sure they'll give us some real info on it after Luke Cage and/or Daredevil season 2.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on November 27, 2015, 12:59:41 AM
I watched episode 4-8 on this Turkey Day

Spoiler
So much to say but I'll only say a little. Oh Jessica oh Jessica, it makes no sense whatsoever that you slept with Luke over half a dozen times before/instead of A: Catching Kilgrave first and then coming to him B: Keeping your distance C: Both! That obviously ended in a bad situation.

Dammit, wish I didn't watch the trailer. It spoiled the great precinct scene, even though I did assumed a lot of people would die.

I can imagine what Jeri's going to end up doing.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on November 27, 2015, 01:20:54 AM
I just finished the season. Overall, I really enjoyed the show. If I'm to be honest, I still find Daredevil to be just a smidge more to my liking, but that does not at all mean that I didn't love what I saw here. I think that Kilgrave is easily one of the MCU's stronger villains (though, like Foggle, I think that Kingpin takes the #1 spot by far), and Jessica is easily one of the MCU's best heroes. She proves (along with Agent Carter) that a well-cast, great female character backed by strong writing and directing can carry their own story in the MCU. The TV series have nailed it twice. It's long past-due for the movies to follow suit.

I have minor gripes here and there, including to some extent the one that GSF brought up, but one in particular that kind of bothered me was the ending:

Spoiler
For one thing, I really wasn't fond of the way that Kilgrave was defeated. I love it when a villain is outsmarted, but falling for the cliche reverse psychology shenanigans felt way too beneath him, IMO, despite his delusional love for Jessica. Just because she didn't get all out of line and show any anger after he made out with her adopted sister doesn't prove that she's faking being under his control, and it felt rather out of character for him to just dismiss the idea that she was putting up a really great act after all. I feel that he was smart enough to come up with a more definitive test than what he did, and it bugs me that the writers didn't handle his defeat much better than they did. He deserved a better way to go out, IMO.

And that brings me to my second point. Among other things, one thing that I really loved about Daredevil is that it recognized how great of a villain Wilson Fisk is, and that he could have more to his character arc, so naturally they had him appropriately defeated and broken, but not dead. MCU films have a bad habit of just killing off their villains at the end of each movie so haphazardly. Granted, most usually aren't that interesting to begin with, and it was a smart decision to let Loki live, but most of these deaths still feel like such a waste of great potential. Daredevil managed to avoid this trope, and that makes me excited to see where the story can go when that villain inevitably returns to the story. I was hoping that the same could be done for Kilgrave, who was just a great character in general, but was disappointed to see him killed off at the end, and as I mentioned in my previous point, I wasn't satisfied with the way that it happened.

Those issues I have aren't nearly as much of a detriment to the series as I make them sound, but as my only somewhat major gripe with the show, I felt that it was worth mentioning. That said, this is still easily one of the best things to come out of the MCU, movies or otherwise.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on November 27, 2015, 02:44:36 AM
Spoiler
I don't like it when villains get killed in superhero stories in general, but Kilgrave needed to die IMO. I found his anticlimactic death pretty cathartic, since he gets trounced so easily despite his ego making him believe he was unstoppable and in the right. That said, I don't blame you (or anyone else) for not agreeing with me, as I seem to be in the minority in always loving this kind of death for characters like him.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Avaitor on November 27, 2015, 03:37:13 PM
Spoiler
Actually, Kilgrave's death reminded me of Bill's from Kill Bill, which is probably the best for him.

I feel that Kilgrave's death was important for the show, and Jessica's character in general. She will never fully get over everything he has done to her, but it's going to make for some fascinating material to see how she adapts to life without him being there to haunt her physically. Emotionally, well...
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on November 27, 2015, 06:30:37 PM
I finished episode 9 at the end of the last hour. Sin Bin reminded me of Carrie Anne-Moss' Unthinkable so much. I wonder if they did that on purpose.
Spoiler
Another one of Jessica's plans went south. I wonder if Simpson is supposed to be that one Captain America who's parents Red Skull killed. That might be a stretch. It would kind of explain while he beat up a thousand guys while Jessica got tasered into oblivion in probably the biggest narm moment in the series so far. lol I thought he might have been S.h.i.e.l.d. earlier in the episode but not so much anymore. Especially since he probably could have just told the doctor about Kilgrave. I love that smile Jessica cracked at the end of the episode. I suspect that Reva's blood stopped Kilgrave's mind control from working ever again. I wouldn't be surprised since so many seem to love using that blood cure trope.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on November 29, 2015, 01:56:01 AM
I finally finished the show.
Spoiler
I've been forgetting to say this but the show is pretty intense. I think episode 10 was the most intense for me. I had to stop a few times during it. Wendy being murdered, Clamons being murdered and Simpson going out there and me worrying about Hope just...Of course episode 11 was right behind it. I am now thinking Simpson is/was a part of some Hydra cell that tried to duplicate the super soldier serum. I suspect Luke and Jessica will be fighting them in Cage's show. They had Sequel Hook all over them.

I was going to say that I liked Jessica Jones more than Daredevil and Black Widow (don't ask) but I think she's my favorite MCU character. Hell, maybe favorite live action comic book character ever. I think it's safe for me to say that for now.

Unimportant stuff: I think how Kilgrave got killed was predictable after awhile. I'm still kind of surprised they killed him because he's still alive in the comics (well, the last time I checked) but of course there was nothing else they could do with him so no complains. Robyn..boy, they gave that fucking weirdo too too much screentime. I'm sure the internet is making fun of her as we speak. I wonder if Loeb had something to do with her because..blame Loeb. :thinkin:

This was all bittersweet. I don't see Jones getting into anything close to what happened in her debut season. I'm sure it'll be closer to a normal superhero series with her putting supervillains more frequently. Obviously what happened to her can't be done again. I'll still watch though.

Oh and I think Jeri was my 3rd or 4th favorite character in the series. I thought she was going to all complete evil or something. I liked that even she had boundaries...even though the whole baby thing...Either way, Carrie Anne-Moss played the hell out of that part. I was liking awkward Simpson before he went all crazy..I just assumed the actor himself was awkward or something at the beginning.
Just be glad they removed one of the L's. It was literally just the words kill and grave mashed together in the comic. :lol:
:whuh:
Yeah, Bendis isn't exactly subtle.

I'm watching episode 7 now, and I'm still very positive towards the show. The acting and writing are great all around!
That reminds me, I was seriously impressed by how great the actresses for teen Jessica and Trish were. They were giving the adults a run for their money.
I finished the series! Jessica is now my favorite MCU protagonist (closely followed by Daredevil and Captain America) and Kilgrave is now my second favorite antagonist (after Fisk, naturally). What a truly great show, just like DD. Pretty psyched for the upcoming second seasons, Luke Cage, Iron Fist, and Defenders now. :) If only we could get a third season of Spectacular Spider-Man as well...
Kilgrave's 1st or 2nd for me. It's either him or Loki. And I like this show slightly less than Daredevil.
Spoiler
I don't like it when villains get killed in superhero stories in general, but Kilgrave needed to die IMO. I found his anticlimactic death pretty cathartic, since he gets trounced so easily despite his ego making him believe he was unstoppable and in the right. That said, I don't blame you (or anyone else) for not agreeing with me, as I seem to be in the minority in always loving this kind of death for characters like him.
Spoiler
2nded. Basically, Kilgrave dying represented Jones moving on with her life and no longer being controlled by him, even if he couldn't literally do that anymore. Also, Kilgrave walking right into Jess' trap was almost laughably stupid. I can get over that though.
Spoiler
Actually, Kilgrave's death reminded me of Bill's from Kill Bill, which is probably the best for him.

I feel that Kilgrave's death was important for the show, and Jessica's character in general. She will never fully get over everything he has done to her, but it's going to make for some fascinating material to see how she adapts to life without him being there to haunt her physically. Emotionally, well...
Yes, this, yes. Jeez, I wish I wasn't always late to these threads. I hate bombarding y'all with quotes like this. :D
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on November 29, 2015, 02:34:39 AM
On the contrary, if you pay attention to the part where her lawyer has to basically lie for her to justify her murder of Kilgrave, the look that she gives on her face is one of genuine realization with a hint of guilt, from my interpretation, and suggests that her decision to resort to killing will be haunting her for some time in the future, whether he deserved to die or not.

And I disagree that there was nothing more that could've been done with his character. Going by his past, he clearly had a descent into the person that he became as he began to live on his own. That makes for a three-dimensional character, and he could have still had further aspects to his character arc which were never explored before finally being finished off. To say that he needed to die is fair, but to say that he needed to die by the end of this season is like saying the same thing for Wilson Fisk. Both of those guys have so much potential to their characters still left untapped. Only one of them, however, may actually get the chance to capitalize on that potential.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on November 29, 2015, 02:51:55 AM
Spoiler
Fisk is very different from Kilgrave. Over the course of DD, Wilson basically became his Marvel comics counterpart. They can obviously get more mileage out of him. I think Kilgrave sticking around would have made things eventually get stale. They already showed his past. He already did virtually every horrible thing he could have done to Jessica. He would have just kept on going straight after her, trying to kill her. Plus, he became completely and totally overpowered.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on November 29, 2015, 05:13:36 AM
Spoiler
As great a villain as Kilgrave was, he's one that would really suffer from overuse IMO. It also benefited both the narrative and Jessica's character arc for her to kill him at the end of season 1, I'd say. They'll probably show more of his past in season 2 via the IGH subplot, at least.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Insomniac on November 29, 2015, 05:55:25 AM
Spoiler
So any thoughts on who IGH is? The Inhuman Growth Hormone theory or a way to sneak some mutants into the MCU like an article I read suggested?
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on November 29, 2015, 12:22:19 PM
Those arguments could just as easily be turned around on Fisk. We already saw his past and he already did a bunch of horrible things. That doesn't mean that we've seen his full character arc progress, though, and the same applies to Kilgrave, IMO.

Also, ANY character would suffer from overuse, so that's a moot point. I'm not saying to make Kilgrave a regular character again, just like I don't believe that Fisk should be, but future appearances would have a lot more weight to them. The difference here is that Fisk is being treated like an actual character, which makes him interesting and warrants future appearances. Kilgrave had that same potential but is ultimately only treated as a villain, and a villain always needs to die at the end because that's the trope, but it's that same line of thinking that would deprive us of otherwise great characters in other great series and films.

Shows like Game of Thrones, Boardwalk Empire, and Breaking Bad excel at those sorts of characters, for a frame of reference. Arrow was also smart not to kill off Deathstroke.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on November 29, 2015, 12:26:07 PM
Spoiler
So any thoughts on who IGH is? The Inhuman Growth Hormone theory or a way to sneak some mutants into the MCU like an article I read suggested?

It's no secret that the MCU fully intends to utilize mutants that don't exclusively belong to the X-Men brand. They'll just sneakily have to call them something else. IGH may very well fit the bill as a mutant-related organization.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Insomniac on November 29, 2015, 01:06:24 PM
While I understand the want to not kill off superhero villains, I don't know how you could write the scenario in a way where Kilgrave gets out alive. Jessica Jones was in no state to lower her hatred enough to spare him, and his powers would have rendered any due process completely useless. You could have him get away with his crimes and ride away with the boat, but that leads to either a dangling plot thread or a complete change in setting (Jessica Jones Vice perhaps?). And frankly, they had Jessica capture Kilgrave only for him to escape so many times as it is that another season of that would've been exhausting.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on November 29, 2015, 02:30:35 PM
You don't actually have to do that for another season. There are plenty of ways to keep Kilgrave incapacitated or unable to use his powers and under restraint. He could be brought back into the story at a later time, perhaps even past the second season.

But whatever. It seems like I'm just not going to be able to agree with any of you on this, so agree to disagree it is.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on November 30, 2015, 01:05:26 AM
Did I mention that I liked how Luke Cage turned out? They didn't force "trendy" hip hop clothes on him and made him use slang over other sentence, unlike the modern comics of him that I've seen. He came off as intelligent and cool. Besides maybe Immortal Ironfist, it was my favorite iteration of the character.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on November 30, 2015, 01:19:19 AM
Did I mention that I liked how Luke Cage turned out? They didn't force "trendy" hip hop clothes on him and made him use slang over other sentence, unlike the modern comics of him that I've seen. He came off as intelligent and cool. Besides maybe Immortal Ironfist, it was my favorite iteration of the character.
Yeah, I loved that too. :)
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Daikun on December 30, 2015, 04:24:14 AM
The Punisher will be in the next season of Daredevil. (http://www.msn.com/en-us/tv/news/daredevil-season-2-to-have-faster-pace-punisher-morality-debate/ar-BBo16zb)

EDIT: Also Elektra. (http://www.ew.com/article/2015/12/29/daredevil-elektra-photo)
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on December 30, 2015, 09:31:07 AM
Hasn't that been known for a while, now?
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on December 30, 2015, 09:42:56 AM
Yeah, I still remember gsf flipping out about it.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on December 30, 2015, 02:21:59 PM
Yeah, I still remember gsf flipping out about it.
I remember that guy losing his shit too.

Dammit, gsf read that way too fast and then freaked out again and thought Punisher and then Elektra were getting their own shows next year  :'(
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on December 30, 2015, 02:52:44 PM
Since it was never posted here, let me just post the Season 2 teaser of Daredevil. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y44m5739m-4) The first part is just clips from season 1, but the last thirty seconds teases the new stuff.

And yes, some changes for the upcoming season include faster pacing (which will be good to differentiate it from season 1), more romance, and a moral battle with the Punisher. So far, I'm liking what I'm hearing and seeing.

Oh, and an interesting cameo (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pB8ApZbRHd4) for season 2.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on January 06, 2016, 04:36:23 PM
April needs to get here (it comes out in April, right?)
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on January 06, 2016, 04:45:02 PM
Apparently the official release date is March 25.

So, even earlier than last year.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on January 06, 2016, 05:39:46 PM
Awesome! :im_nabeshin:
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on January 06, 2016, 07:13:13 PM
Apparently the official release date is March 25.

So, even earlier than last year.
:huh: It went from about 2 years to a year to under a year, amazing. :worship:
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Peanutbutter on January 07, 2016, 04:21:35 PM
Apparently the official release date is March 25.

So, even earlier than last year.
:huh: It went from about 2 years to a year to under a year, amazing. :worship:



That's what happens when a show does even better than the high expectations it had already.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: The Shadow Gentleman on January 08, 2016, 09:46:15 AM
Wow, right on my birthday.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on January 09, 2016, 01:06:43 AM
New season 2 trailer for Daredevil! (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L-ZGgFuyv8U)

It was, uh, pushed up to March 18th now.  :D
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on January 09, 2016, 01:40:05 AM
I can live with that. I'll watch it in a bit :)
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on January 09, 2016, 10:26:15 PM
I reread that. Oh, push UP and not back. Jesus, I am used to bad news when it comes to release dates that I assumed wrong. That's fucking amazing. *actually watches trailer this time.*
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Avaitor on January 17, 2016, 02:52:29 PM
In case you had your doubts, season 2 of Jessica Jones is happening. (http://variety.com/2016/tv/news/jessica-jones-season-2-netflix-krysten-ritter-mike-colter-luke-cage-1201666573/)
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on January 17, 2016, 03:02:11 PM
We also have Daredevil season two, Luke Cage (Iron Fist seems to have been delayed until early next year), and just later this very month, Agent Carter season two. Marvel TV is going to kill it this year.

Also, Legends of Tomorrow is premiering in just a few short days, and combined with Arrow, The Flash, and Supergirl (which I still need to catch up to), DC isn't slouching either, by any means.

That's a total of eight genuinely good superhero shows to watch in this year alone. We may have very well just entered into the golden-age of this genre on TV.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Insomniac on January 17, 2016, 03:04:19 PM
Thank Christ the Teen Titans show by the Batman & Robin writer didn't get greenlit in order to ruin that streak.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on January 17, 2016, 03:10:11 PM
Well, we already have Gotham and AOS to do that for us....
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Avaitor on January 17, 2016, 03:15:50 PM
We're also getting Lucifer and Legion shows that are looking iffy to me, but eh, there will always be bad to balance in between the good.

I just hope that the Y: The Last Man series happens, and delivers.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on January 17, 2016, 03:17:23 PM
Good news. Now I just need a Punisher show fully announced.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on January 17, 2016, 04:24:04 PM
If Netflix has their way, you'll get it sooner than you think. Word is that they loved what they saw of the character from early season two footage so much that they've essentially been pleading with Marvel to make a spin-off series for the character ASAP.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on January 17, 2016, 06:46:44 PM
I've been hearing that. A Punisher MAX type of series would be an absolute dream.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Avaitor on January 18, 2016, 12:07:36 AM
It kind of feels that the Punisher is better suited for a TV series than a film franchise, so that should work.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Peanutbutter on January 18, 2016, 11:54:25 PM
A Punisher show is already on the way.


Quote
The Punisher, actor Jon Bernthal’s character from Netflix’s Daredevil, will get his own Netflix spinoff series from Marvel, Deadline has confirmed. The character makes his debut when Daredevil begins its second season March 18. No date has been set for The Punisher bow, which was first reported by TVLine.


-Deadline

Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on January 19, 2016, 04:33:48 AM
A Punisher show is already on the way.


Quote
The Punisher, actor Jon Bernthal’s character from Netflix’s Daredevil, will get his own Netflix spinoff series from Marvel, Deadline has confirmed. The character makes his debut when Daredevil begins its second season March 18. No date has been set for The Punisher bow, which was first reported by TVLine.


-Deadline
:swoon: :swoon: :swoon: :swoon: Give us Barracuda, Jigsaw and the arcs The Slavers, Welcome Back Frank, Born and In the Beginning, please! Jesus, I love me some Punisher. Didn't expect to ask for so much :sweat:
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on January 19, 2016, 10:01:03 AM
Netflix and Marvel are really tearing it up.

I still want some Iron fist and Defenders news, though.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on January 20, 2016, 03:18:30 AM
That's all I want to hear for now.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Avaitor on January 20, 2016, 09:51:40 PM
I'm almost done with the first half of last night's Agent Carter premiere, and I'm really digging it so far. The location switch seems to be a good call to keep the show fresh, as the lighting is keenly lit to keep the vintage Hollywood aesthetic going. It also helps that Peggy, Jarvis, and the gang remain as likable as ever.

I'll have to save the second episode, as well as Flash and Legends of Tomorrow, for later, but I'm happy so far.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on January 21, 2016, 10:14:51 PM
Since I don't have Cable or Sattelite right now, I'll have to be a week behind on Agent Carter episodes since the ABC app only lets people without providers watch episodes once they turn a week old.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on January 26, 2016, 01:27:31 PM
https://youtu.be/xt6uagFjJsU

They went too easy on this show, if you ask me. Still pretty funny jabs, though.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on January 26, 2016, 01:53:46 PM
Good stuff. All reasons why I ditched it.

But the excuse that it has only a portion of the budget and therefore can't be as good is hogwash. The writing being lackluster is not a budget issue. No one complains about the special effects.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on January 26, 2016, 03:35:38 PM
Good stuff. All reasons why I ditched it.

But the excuse that it has only a portion of the budget and therefore can't be as good is hogwash. The writing being lackluster is not a budget issue. No one complains about the special effects.
:thinkin: Good points.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on February 15, 2016, 10:42:36 PM
Get hyped: http://youtu.be/m5_A0Wx0jU4
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on February 15, 2016, 11:10:50 PM
They did it. They finally nailed Frank Castle on screen.

Not only that, but... everything looks awesome! It's Daredevil in all its greatness but with more. That conflict, that direction, those themes, those characters. Something tells me that I'm going dig this. And we're only a month out!
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on February 16, 2016, 01:33:39 AM
Finally? Castle was fine in WarZone.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Peanutbutter on February 16, 2016, 05:56:37 AM
The Thomas Jane movie was also good. But I'm really looking forward to both Daredevil and Punisher!
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on February 16, 2016, 06:12:07 PM
Eh, didn't care for him in any of the movies. But then I've always liked him more when he bounces off characters like Spider-Man or Daredevil.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on February 17, 2016, 12:01:33 AM
Since I want to watch the show (mostly) blind, I'm not going to watch the latest or any trailer. And I won't be back until I watch the show. I will say that even though I've seen like a second of her in the last trailer, I think who they picked as Elektra will be perfect for the role. I cannot wait to see her in action!
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on February 17, 2016, 12:36:04 AM
Well, I do hope you come back for this.

Because there's been some Iron Fist news. (https://marvel.com/news/tv/25516/scott_buck_to_showrun_the_netflix_original_series_marvels_iron_fist?linkId=19388163) It's officially in production. Obviously it will be the last of the four series to premiere.

Quote
Returning to New York City after being missing for years, Daniel Rand fights against the criminal element corrupting New York City with his incredible kung-fu mastery and ability to summon the awesome power of the fiery Iron Fist.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on February 25, 2016, 06:35:07 PM
Ok, I'm back in here one time to post this: http://mashable.com/2016/02/25/finn-jones-iron-fist-netflix/ (http://mashable.com/2016/02/25/finn-jones-iron-fist-netflix/)
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on February 25, 2016, 07:00:42 PM
Sounds cool. He does look a lot like Danny.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on February 25, 2016, 09:42:38 PM
Even as a big Game of Thrones fan, I can't make a comment on this casting since Loras is a pretty minor character on the show with barely any screen-time (despite being important to one of the main story-lines from last season).

It is good to hear that they're moving forward with Iron Fist though. I'ver been hearing some troubling reports of the constant delays being due to pre-production problems, and that Marvel was considering canceling the series entirely.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on February 25, 2016, 10:03:07 PM
I'm really glad they're moving forward because Iron Fist has always been a hero that has never quite gotten the focus he's deserved despite his abilities and the quality of his stuff.

I heard the reason why they were having problems moving forward was the whole mystical element and how to fit it in, but I really don't think it should be that hard. If it's up to Netflix's usual standards, this should be great. It should be much different than the other Marvel shows if they hit it right.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on February 25, 2016, 10:06:51 PM
And, speaking of the other shows:

Daredevil trailer 2 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Cn3DVV0LHY)
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on February 26, 2016, 12:46:23 AM
I'm really glad they're moving forward because Iron Fist has always been a hero that has never quite gotten the focus he's deserved despite his abilities and the quality of his stuff.

I heard the reason why they were having problems moving forward was the whole mystical element and how to fit it in, but I really don't think it should be that hard. If it's up to Netflix's usual standards, this should be great. It should be much different than the other Marvel shows if they hit it right.
Again, they better make Rand's limbs glow or I'm boycotting. :unimpressed: *leaves for real this time*

Edit: And yes, Iron Fist does deserve to finally be mainstream. He's interesting enough to become that big.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on March 17, 2016, 09:14:41 PM
Any Daredevil hype? After season 1, I couldn't be more excited.

Unfortunately, it won't be out until early morning, so there's still a bit of wait left.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on March 17, 2016, 09:22:41 PM
Of course I'm hyped! After season 1 and Jessica Jones, how could I not be? ;)
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on March 17, 2016, 09:56:52 PM
Is there an exact time it'll be uploaded?!
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on March 17, 2016, 10:08:25 PM
No, but it always gets uploaded really early in the morning so there's no chance of watching a few before bed. Still, I'm hyped anyway.

After watching the season, I suggest watching a few episodes of Person of Interest to anyone reading. You might find some strange similarities between the two.  :D
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on March 17, 2016, 10:18:03 PM
My hype levels just suddenly got out of control. I have high expectations for Elektra and The Punisher. I'm liking going to bed early so I can wake up early and start watching. Sucks that tomorrow will be busy and it'll be impossible for me to finish until Saturday night. :'(
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on March 18, 2016, 12:50:38 AM
It start in 1 hour and 10 minutes!! I was going to go to sleep in 30 minutes but FUCK THAT, FUCK SLEEP!! I'm going to catch 2 or 3 episodes. Wake up fast and catch about 6 more before I go out.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on March 18, 2016, 01:05:08 AM
I'll hopefully get to watch 2 or 3 tomorrow, myself. :)
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Avaitor on March 18, 2016, 10:28:13 AM
I'll try to start it up after work tonight. I'll only get to a few episodes, though.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on March 18, 2016, 02:06:51 PM
I'm 4 episodes in so far, and personally I'm really digging it. I love The Punisher in this show, and the staircase fight scene from episode 3 may just have surpassed the hallway fight scene from the first season as my favorite action scene in this show.

Now to see how Elektra turned out. It'll also be great to see the return of The Yakuza and Stick later on this season, as well.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on March 18, 2016, 02:09:04 PM
Just spent the past hour trying to watch the first episode. First, my internet decided not to work for 40 minutes (thanks, Time Warner). Now, Netflix keeps glitching out or refusing to buffer the episode once I've initially loaded it. I'm 9 minutes in and unable to continue. Fuck streaming.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on March 18, 2016, 03:17:12 PM
Seems like more of a connection problem than a streaming problem. I've had that problem before as well, and usually because my connection was slow. Right now my connection is fine and I've had no problems streaming.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on March 18, 2016, 03:51:16 PM
Yeah, my first issue was definitely a connection problem. Just a little mad at streaming since you have to be online to do it and my internet can be kind of wonky. :( About to try again!
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on March 18, 2016, 04:42:33 PM
Just finished the first episode. Great start to the new season; probably the best Marvel Netflix premiere yet! I absolutely loved how it introduced the Punisher, and can't wait to watch more later. :im_nabeshin:
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on March 18, 2016, 05:55:11 PM
I'm a bit behind today, but episode 1 was off the wall. The Punisher had literally one line (word, actually) which made him more than a credible threat. It's nice to see him in his early days before he learned any semblance of restraint, too. Then there was Foggy and Karen being incredible and Matt continuing being a great hero. DD is back and as good as ever!

Going straight into episode 2.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on March 18, 2016, 06:33:03 PM
I'm 7 episodes in and just can't stop watching.

I will say that the Elektra/Yakuza sub-plot, while fine, isn't nearly as good as The Punisher story-line, which is amazing. But if my biggest complaint about a show is that sometimes it's only just pretty good, and great the rest of the time, then you know that it's an awesome show.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on March 18, 2016, 07:02:11 PM
I really loved how they built up the Punisher in the first episode.

Spoiler
Having that Irish mobster give a five-minute monologue about how he was going to be the next bad guy after Fisk and then immediately get killed by the real antagonist was awesome.
That's one of my favorite narrative devices in this kind of story. :D
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on March 18, 2016, 07:17:03 PM
I just finished off episode 3. Wow, this is certainly paced faster than season 1 was, though with no less great stuff.

Spoiler
The moral battle between Matt and Frank in episode 3 was pretty amazing in how they went back and forth. Matt is too cocky and Frank refuses to admit culpability for his faults. Charlie Cox and Jon Bernthal are amazing in their roles. It's up there with episode 2 in season 1 as one of my favorite episodes.

There's no question that this is the best portrayal of the Punisher in live action by far.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on March 18, 2016, 07:36:09 PM
Just watched episode 3. It did the, imo, the greatest Punisher/Daredevil comic book scene ever
Spoiler
with The Punisher tying up Daredevil and sticking a gun on him with the only way to stop Frank from killing someone is to shoot him
from Welcome Back, Frank. I suggest everyone read that. Also, the stairway scene was unbelievable awesome. Unlike the hallway scene from episode 2 of season 1 I liked it..hell, freaking loved it. The argument between Frank and Matt seemed so natural. I'm happy that got good actors for both guys. I can't believe I can't watch anymore right now but boy tomorrow night I'm marathoning the rest of the show.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on March 18, 2016, 08:06:15 PM
Episode 8:

Spoiler
1. FISK!!!!

2. STICK!!!!

3. How the hell is Matt having so much trouble believing Stick's story? This is the same Universe in which a giant green monster tore up half of New York, an alien invasion destroyed the other half, a magic hammer-wielding demigod is totally a thing, and an evil AI-controlled robot attempted to  bring about the extinction of humanity by lifting up a small country and slamming it back down to Earth. Compared to all of that, the concept of The Hand seems pretty tame.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on March 18, 2016, 10:12:20 PM
Just wrapped up episode 6. I'll probably finish up tonight with one more and then call it a night.

So far, this is every bit as good as the first season. Which basically means its more of Marvel at its best. If season 3 isn't announced by the end of the month I'll be very disappointed.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on March 19, 2016, 01:55:59 AM
Just finished the season. It was a hell of a binge-watch, but it was worth it. Personally, I loved it. This was a great follow-up to an already great first season, IMO.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Insomniac on March 19, 2016, 09:14:32 AM
Two episodes in, and my only gripe so far is that Punisher's voice is nowhere near deep enough. I'll get used to it though.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on March 19, 2016, 10:57:42 AM
I think it's perfect, myself. We don't need another Grizzly-Bale Batman.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Avaitor on March 19, 2016, 01:59:11 PM
I watched the first 3 last night. I thought that the first was a little slow, until that explosion of an ending. As soon as the Punisher shows up, though, is when the season has started to pick up.

I can't wait to watch more!
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Peanutbutter on March 20, 2016, 03:29:34 PM
Up to episode 7 I believe. The stairway fight was indeed awesome! Remember, we already have confirmation for a Punisher spin-off. After every scene with him, I can't wait to see even more of him!



I'll watch some more when I get off the Net, can't wait to see where they go with Elektra and DA Reyes.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on March 20, 2016, 04:25:43 PM
Yeah, that stairway fight was incredibly badass. I love this new trend in film-making where action scenes are done using tracking shots with as little cutting as possible - it looks amazing every single time. Oldboy will always contain my favorite iteration of this kind of scene, though.

A little disappointed that
Spoiler
the Punisher is already seemingly out after episode 4. I hope he comes back later on!
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Insomniac on March 20, 2016, 04:32:44 PM
Jeremy Renner wants a piece of that Netflix love. (http://www.slashfilm.com/hawkeye-netflix-series/)
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on March 20, 2016, 05:17:58 PM
Yeah, that stairway fight was incredibly badass. I love this new trend in film-making where action scenes are done using tracking shots with as little cutting as possible - it looks amazing every single time. Oldboy will always contain my favorite iteration of this kind of scene, though.

If we're talking about melee-style fighting, then I 100% agree that Oldboy is the best tracking shot of a brawl-style fight (which is to say that it's a purposefully less refined and somewhat more realistic style of fighting). I particularly like how it draws attention to the fact that the protagonist is a vulnerable man and has to take a beating himself when facing that much opposition, and he gets visibly tired as well. It completely broke the trope of the Bruce Lee style of a seemingly invincible man taking on those lesser than him with perfect choreography. Of course, I mean that with the utmost of respect to the legend himself. And while one could argue that Jackie Chan broke the trope with his slapstick style of fighting with humor injected into it, I've always seen that as more of an intentional (and brilliant) parody of the style of film fighting that Bruce Lee made popular, as opposed to an evolution of the art-form.

As for street brawl-style fights in general, though, my favorite has always been the Roddy Piper and Keith David fight from They Live, for managing to be both legitimately well choreographed and hilariously over-the-top at the same time.

As for tracking shots in regard to action scenes in general, the hospital shootout from Hardboiled has always been and still is my favorite, by far.

Quote
A little disappointed that
Spoiler
the Punisher is already seemingly out after episode 4. I hope he comes back later on!

Minor Spoilers (since the trailers kind of give this away, anyways):

Spoiler
This definitely isn't the end of his arc in this season, if that's what you're worried about. He still hasn't even gotten to wear his iconic skull symbol get-up from the comic books yet (by episode 4), after all. ;)

One thing that does legitimately bug me about this season is how Foggy still tries to guilt-trip Matt over the whole vigilante thing. I think that Matt's argument that people die when he doesn't help pretty much puts a nail in the coffin of any of Foggy's counter-arguments. And seeing as how Daredevil never kills people (at least not directly or intentionally), it's not like he has no control like The Punisher. I get that Foggy is pissed that Matt isn't there for their real jobs enough, but that doesn't automatically make what Matt is doing wrong, or less important.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Insomniac on March 20, 2016, 05:29:44 PM
Yeah, Foggy is more often than not annoying. He doesn't drag the show too much, but with Elektra and Page getting some nice development, Foggy's just standing around while everyone else goes by. Plus, he looks like a ten-year-old kid in a monkey suit.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on March 20, 2016, 05:34:20 PM
It made me happy when I finally got to that trailer line in the show, where Matt straight up tells Foggy that he is who he is, and isn't going to take any more shit from him about it.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on March 20, 2016, 07:18:43 PM
I just finally finished the season.
Spoiler
I think I still like Season 1 more but S2 put me through a lot of emotions. I was teary eye a few times. Probably all from the Punisher. The graveyard scene and two times he talked to Karen, iirc. Basically, Frank stole the show. Jon Bernthal's portrayal of the character is probably my favorite version of the Punisher. They did it so right. They made you feel sorry for him and his family, without forcing you to think he's supposed to be a hero and how brutal he was showed exactly why you probably shouldn't. If his series is going to be anything like this then I'm very interested.

Overall, I liked Elektra even though she was kind of..bratty, idk lol, before she stopped lying to Matt all the time and it was revealed that she was one of Stick's student. Then it was all good from there.

I called Stick a jerk twice because I ended up rewinding the part where he opens the door on Elektra in Matt's bed when Karen came by. What an asshole. lol I hope we see more of him.

I am officially sick of Kingpin's stilted, pretentious dialogue, which is why I loved it when he talked normal after Matt pissed him off. That's what I want to see more. He needs to just stop pretending like he was ever trying to do good. He never did a single good thing in season 1, he just talked about it. I don't care for this show's Kingpin that much.

I loved how Karen and Foggy had a lot to do. They were set up with a lot since the beginning. I like it when the non-hero character don't get ignored. Also, looks like the saddest part of anything I know about Daredevil's life is about to be set up and I'm not talking about Elektra dying.

I think that's virtually everything. I kind of wish they didn't want so long to reveal who the villains were but whatever. Also, Clancy Brown was officially the Blacksmith right? they made that a bit confusing. I also can't believe they got Brown on the show. That was fucking awesome.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on March 20, 2016, 07:33:45 PM
I really loved how they built up the Punisher in the first episode.

Spoiler
Having that Irish mobster give a five-minute monologue about how he was going to be the next bad guy after Fisk and then immediately get killed by the real antagonist was awesome.
That's one of my favorite narrative devices in this kind of story. :D
:D I also wonder if it's the same mobster from the Kitchen Irish comic. I of course absolutely hate that comic so I'm glad I forgot his name but still.

I'm 4 episodes in so far, and personally I'm really digging it. I love The Punisher in this show, and the staircase fight scene from episode 3 may just have surpassed the hallway fight scene from the first season as my favorite action scene in this show.

Now to see how Elektra turned out. It'll also be great to see the return of The Yakuza and Stick later on this season, as well.
The best action scene in the entire series. I'm glad that teased Daredevil getting his billy club like I thought it would after seeing him with the chain.
Eh, didn't care for him in any of the movies. But then I've always liked him more when he bounces off characters like Spider-Man or Daredevil.
:-\ If they ever put him around Spider-Man, I am going to quit the MCU.
I'm 7 episodes in and just can't stop watching.

I will say that the Elektra/Yakuza sub-plot, while fine, isn't nearly as good as The Punisher story-line, which is amazing. But if my biggest complaint about a show is that sometimes it's only just pretty good, and great the rest of the time, then you know that it's an awesome show.
Agreed.
Episode 8:

Spoiler
1. FISK!!!!

2. STICK!!!!

3. How the hell is Matt having so much trouble believing Stick's story? This is the same Universe in which a giant green monster tore up half of New York, an alien invasion destroyed the other half, a magic hammer-wielding demigod is totally a thing, and an evil AI-controlled robot attempted to  bring about the extinction of humanity by lifting up a small country and slamming it back down to Earth. Compared to all of that, the concept of The Hand seems pretty tame.
Because he thinks he's a murderous asshole.
Two episodes in, and my only gripe so far is that Punisher's voice is nowhere near deep enough. I'll get used to it though.
:oo: Not sure if serious. I think Bernthal's voice is freaking deeper than Clancy Brown's, which really says something.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on March 20, 2016, 08:30:27 PM
I just finally finished the season.
Spoiler
I think I still like Season 1 more but S2 put me through a lot of emotions. I was teary eye a few times. Probably all from the Punisher. The graveyard scene and two times he talked to Karen, iirc. Basically, Frank stole the show. Jon Bernthal's portrayal of the character is probably my favorite version of the Punisher. They did it so right. They made you feel sorry for him and his family, without forcing you to think he's supposed to be a hero and how brutal he was showed exactly why you probably shouldn't. If his series is going to be anything like this then I'm very interested.

Overall, I liked Elektra even though she was kind of..bratty, idk lol, before she stopped lying to Matt all the time and it was revealed that she was one of Stick's student. Then it was all good from there.

I called Stick a jerk twice because I ended up rewinding the part where he opens the door on Elektra in Matt's bed when Karen came by. What an asshole. lol I hope we see more of him.

I am officially sick of Kingpin's stilted, pretentious dialogue, which is why I loved it when he talked normal after Matt pissed him off. That's what I want to see more. He needs to just stop pretending like he was ever trying to do good. He never did a single good thing in season 1, he just talked about it. I don't care for this show's Kingpin that much.

I loved how Karen and Foggy had a lot to do. They were set up with a lot since the beginning. I like it when the non-hero character don't get ignored. Also, looks like the saddest part of anything I know about Daredevil's life is about to be set up and I'm not talking about Elektra dying.

I think that's virtually everything. I kind of wish they didn't want so long to reveal who the villains were but whatever. Also, Clancy Brown was officially the Blacksmith right? they made that a bit confusing. I also can't believe they got Brown on the show. That was fucking awesome.

I actually agree with most of this. Except I'm still not sure how I'd rank this season in comparison to the first (it's definitely close, though), and I enjoy this show's Fisk in a love to hate sort of way.

And yes....

Spoiler
Mr. Krabs is The Blacksmith.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on March 20, 2016, 08:45:20 PM
 :D

I was going to mention how I'd rank the series but I was already going on for too long. :D

At this very moment I'd go: Daredevil Season 1>Jessica Jones>DD Season 2. The first two seem more consistent, from what I can remember. I have only seen them all once. I'll do a replay of all of Daredevil soon enough.

Also,
Spoiler
I'm kind of surprised they didn't reveal Bullseye. I think it's almost too obvious that Fisk is going to hire him in Season 3 and make him go after Daredevil. I also thought he'd be the one to kill Elektra..maybe she'll end up dying again. lol
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on March 20, 2016, 09:04:24 PM
I still can't rank these seasons or shows, but as far as first impressions go, I'd say that the Elektra stuff is weaker than anything in season one, however The Punisher arc is, IMO, the best material to come out of this show to date, by far.

So, while I agree that this season is less consistent than season one, I personally feel that the high points are even better.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on March 20, 2016, 09:43:43 PM
Hmmm, yeah The Punisher probably my favorite thing about this show. Hell, I think I might like him more than Matt now.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on March 20, 2016, 10:22:56 PM
Spoiler
This definitely isn't the end of his arc in this season, if that's what you're worried about. He still hasn't even gotten to wear his iconic skull symbol get-up from the comic books yet (by episode 4), after all. ;)
Spoiler
Yeah, he's back already. :il_hahaha:

I actually don't dislike Foggy or Elektra, to be honest. But I only just finished episode 5.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on March 20, 2016, 10:47:11 PM
Punisher's definitely better than both put together
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Insomniac on March 21, 2016, 02:21:17 PM
Spoiler
So what was the sarcophagus full of blood for? Is that how The Hand resurrect themselves? With blood magic? And now I can't remember when we saw scenes of Nobu or any of the Hand ninjas in daylight...

And what made Elektra different from the Black Sky kid Nobu had last season? It seemed like she was their chosen one because of the way they bowed to her, but then what was the deal with the previous kid? So there are multiple Black Skies? And why did Stick kill that Black Sky without a second thought while protecting Elektra as a kid, only to change his mind about that and try to kill her as an adult? And why even save her life with the baking soda if you were going to plan a hit on her a couple episodes later? Stick was a cool character, but his motives didn't make sense by the end.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on March 21, 2016, 05:15:12 PM
Spoiler
So what was the sarcophagus full of blood for? Is that how The Hand resurrect themselves? With blood magic? And now I can't remember when we saw scenes of Nobu or any of the Hand ninjas in daylight...

And what made Elektra different from the Black Sky kid Nobu had last season? It seemed like she was their chosen one because of the way they bowed to her, but then what was the deal with the previous kid? So there are multiple Black Skies? And why did Stick kill that Black Sky without a second thought while protecting Elektra as a kid, only to change his mind about that and try to kill her as an adult? And why even save her life with the baking soda if you were going to plan a hit on her a couple episodes later? Stick was a cool character, but his motives didn't make sense by the end.

That's actually a lot easier to explain than you're making it sound:

Spoiler
Clearly Stick was going against The Chased's orders in trying to protect Elektra and use her for their cause. When he realized that she would no longer be his loyal agent, he decided to kill her off rather than risk her being captured and used by The Hand.

And seeing as how TV shows have a tendency of having ongoing plot threads, is it really so strange that not every single question is answered in a single season? Black Sky and The Hand were introduced in the first season, and nothing was resolved with them then. That sub-plot progressed in this season, but still didn't wrap-up. Clearly this is an ongoing plot that is building up to something bigger. It's kind of hard to claim that it has left too many loose ends when it isn't even close to finished, yet.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on March 21, 2016, 05:18:23 PM
Still not done, but it is great stuff. Continuing off of an excellent season 1, Daredevil continues its momentum. I do wish Foggy had more development like his episode last season, but otherwise I'm enjoying just about everything.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on March 21, 2016, 06:04:51 PM
Spoiler
So what was the sarcophagus full of blood for? Is that how The Hand resurrect themselves? With blood magic? And now I can't remember when we saw scenes of Nobu or any of the Hand ninjas in daylight...

And what made Elektra different from the Black Sky kid Nobu had last season? It seemed like she was their chosen one because of the way they bowed to her, but then what was the deal with the previous kid? So there are multiple Black Skies? And why did Stick kill that Black Sky without a second thought while protecting Elektra as a kid, only to change his mind about that and try to kill her as an adult? And why even save her life with the baking soda if you were going to plan a hit on her a couple episodes later? Stick was a cool character, but his motives didn't make sense by the end.
Spoiler
Not sure if it's blood magic. According to Night Nurse, the guinea pigs Daredevil got from The Hand were full of some kind of drugs or some shit. I think they use that type of shit to both revive and control their minions. It's still kind of unclear and confusing though.

Stick's motives were confusing. Possibly because he was conflicted about what he should do. I don't know. And the deal with the Black Skies is much more confusing. They already had him should have "won the war" or whatever back then and I have no clue why there's more then one.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Peanutbutter on March 21, 2016, 08:03:21 PM
Spoiler
Finally finished forty minutes ago.



{Spoiler}{Spoiler}
The entire season was great! I don't think every episode has to be the length of Game of Thrones as some scenes could have been deleted, but this season was amazing overall.


I loved both Elektra and Punisher's arcs. Seeing Matt struggle constantly with debating Foggy after arguing similarly with Punisher was a good contrast. And more interesting was him wrestling over leaving everything behind to stay with Elektra.




Obviously she'll be back at some point. I loved Elodie Yung. She's a fine addition though I imagine she won't be back for a long while.





With Kingpin still and jail and Nobu finally ended by Stick, Bullseye has to be the main villain for Season Three. No one else would be more fitting, even though I still don't know whom all of Daredevil's Rogues Gallery are.


A little disappointed that Nelson and Murdock was dissolved. Obviously, Foggy and Matt will make up at some point but I think their firm should have lasted a couple more seasons. It just doesn't have as much emotional impact having them close their business so soon.


I don't know what Matt will be doing, but at least he finally let Karen in by telling her his secret finally. S3 can't get here soon enough!



Oh and Foggy was fine this season. He has every right to be mad at Matt, especially with how little attention he gave their case.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on March 21, 2016, 08:30:18 PM
Just finished episode 6. That one was really good! I'm loving both the Punisher and Elektra storylines so far, though I would definitely give the former a slight edge.

Oh and Foggy was fine this season. He has every right to be mad at Matt, especially with how little attention he gave their case.
Yeah, I honestly haven't had any problems with Foggy at all. He pretty much acts exactly like I'd expect a superhero's civilian best friend/business partner would.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on March 21, 2016, 09:01:36 PM
Foggy's anger is every bit justified when Matt leaves him holding the bag, but not so much about the Daredevil thing he keeps harping about. By now he should really know the hero thing is not a switch Matt can just turn off.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on March 21, 2016, 10:37:06 PM
Spoiler
Finally finished forty minutes ago.



{Spoiler}{Spoiler}
The entire season was great! I don't think every episode has to be the length of Game of Thrones as some scenes could have been deleted, but this season was amazing overall.


I loved both Elektra and Punisher's arcs. Seeing Matt struggle constantly with debating Foggy after arguing similarly with Punisher was a good contrast. And more interesting was him wrestling over leaving everything behind to stay with Elektra.




Obviously she'll be back at some point. I loved Elodie Yung. She's a fine addition though I imagine she won't be back for a long while.





With Kingpin still and jail and Nobu finally ended by Stick, Bullseye has to be the main villain for Season Three. No one else would be more fitting, even though I still don't know whom all of Daredevil's Rogues Gallery are.


A little disappointed that Nelson and Murdock was dissolved. Obviously, Foggy and Matt will make up at some point but I think their firm should have lasted a couple more seasons. It just doesn't have as much emotional impact having them close their business so soon.


I don't know what Matt will be doing, but at least he finally let Karen in by telling her his secret finally. S3 can't get here soon enough!



Oh and Foggy was fine this season. He has every right to be mad at Matt, especially with how little attention he gave their case.

Because spending his time saving lives and fighting an evil organization is clearly a waste of time.

Matt obviously wasn't ignoring the case on purpose. He had more important things to do. Like, legitimately more important. Foggy was completely in the wrong.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Insomniac on March 22, 2016, 08:41:19 AM
And Foggy definitely knows what Matt's risking. He found him lying on the roof with his mask cracked. From the increasingly small window Matt allows him to look into, he should know gambling his life fighting vigilantes and crime syndicates is going to take away time from looking into another case. Unless he thinks all the superheroes on the other side of New York City are great multitaskers, then that's just plain unsympathetic on Foggy's part.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on March 22, 2016, 03:06:55 PM
Well Iron Man is an incredible multitasker  :thinkin:
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on March 22, 2016, 03:30:32 PM
He's also rich (so, no money problems or places that he just has to be to on time for work reasons), doesn't have a secret identity to worry about, and nobody gives him shit about being a superhero.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Insomniac on March 22, 2016, 03:35:42 PM
Well Iron Man is an incredible multitasker  :thinkin:
But Age of Ultron happened because he knew he couldn't handle all the work on his platter.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on March 22, 2016, 04:45:28 PM
Well Iron Man is an incredible multitasker  :thinkin:
But Age of Ultron happened because he knew he couldn't handle all the work on his platter.
I still need to see that. :)
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on March 22, 2016, 04:52:07 PM
Saw episode 9! That one was truly exceptional.

Spoiler
I loved seeing Fisk again, and the Punisher was just amazing in that prison fight. Karen continues being great and Matt telling off Foggy for always riding his ass was a great moment. I also enjoyed Stick's role in the previous episode and am liking Elektra's character a lot more now. However, ninjas stealing blood from imprisoned children was a bit too over the top IMO. There's a thin line between dark and hokey, and the show is definitely straddling it at the moment.

Jesus, this season is violent, though. Way more blood/gore than Jessica Jones, which already had way more blood/gore than Daredevil season 1. At this rate, I can only assume The Defenders will be a remake of Martyrs featuring superheroes. :il_hahaha:
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on March 22, 2016, 04:55:08 PM
Considering that this takes place in the same fictional Universe which has a talking racoon and Howard the Duck, ninjas and zombie children don't seem that far-fetched, IMO.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on March 22, 2016, 04:57:15 PM
Considering that this takes place in the same fictional Universe which has a talking racoon and Howard the Duck, ninjas and zombie children don't seem that far-fetched, IMO.
It's not the fact that ninjas and zombies exist, just the whole situation felt like something out of Torchwood to me. That said, I didn't know there were going to be zombies, which would have explained the scenario better I guess. :( Guess I should have waited to watch the next episode before bringing it up...
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Peanutbutter on March 22, 2016, 08:30:45 PM





Oh and Foggy was fine this season. He has every right to be mad at Matt, especially with how little attention he gave their case.

Because spending his time saving lives and fighting an evil organization is clearly a waste of time.

Matt obviously wasn't ignoring the case on purpose. He had more important things to do. Like, legitimately more important. Foggy was completely in the wrong.
[/quote]


No he wasn't ignoring the case completely on purpose, but there were things he could have left to Elektra. He never fully told Foggy about the Hand, its his own fault Foggy wasn't on his side. Foggy was not completely in the wrong, especially when Matt could have still made it to Castle taking the stand.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on March 22, 2016, 08:44:47 PM
Okay, yeah, the next episode made it seem less silly. Only three left to go!
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Avaitor on March 22, 2016, 08:46:03 PM
I won't lie, some of the Hand's material feels almost like the League of Assassins in Arrow, which I'm not sure is right for the series or not.

But if this is going to help out for Iron Fist, then I'm fine with how it's turning out. The movies did a decent job making Thor and Captain America fit into the same world.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on March 22, 2016, 08:53:23 PM
No he wasn't ignoring the case completely on purpose, but there were things he could have left to Elektra. He never fully told Foggy about the Hand, its his own fault Foggy wasn't on his side. Foggy was not completely in the wrong, especially when Matt could have still made it to Castle taking the stand.

Spoiler
Were you paying attention to the part where Matt didn't even believe that The Hand existed? He thought that it was a story that Stick made up, and while I have issues with him not believing Stick in the first place, it completely explains why he wouldn't tell Foggy about them, because even he didn't really know much of anything about them until the end of the season (at which point he already went separate ways from Foggy).

And leave Elektra to deal with stuff by herself? Despite not openly showing it at first, Matt clearly cares about her, and it's not in his character to refuse to help someone who undergoes life-threatening situations, especially when they have a common enemy (in this case The Hand, but Matt thought that it was the Yakuza for most of the season). You're basically saying that Matt should abandon fighting an evil, corrupt group just to give more attention to his social and work life, which is absurd because one situation clearly has more immediate consequences at stake than the other if ignored. With the trial, at least Foggy was a capable lawyer, and The Punisher was kept restrained for a significant period of time.

It's not in any way Matt's fault that Foggy still has problems with the path that he chose. In season one it made sense for Foggy to be angry because Matt was keeping such a huge secret from him for so long, and it was all a shock that Foggy didn't know how to handle. In season two, Foggy himself continues to stay as Matt's partner of his own accord. At that point, any problems that he has with Matt's double-life are on him. Matt's blunt line to him toward the end of the season says it all: that he and Daredevil are one in the same, that he's done apologizing for who he is, and that if Foggy has such a problem with it, he can dissociate with him. I was so glad that he said it, too. Foggy really needed to hear it and get the picture that Matt will always pick being a hero over having a normal life. It's in his very nature.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on March 22, 2016, 08:56:52 PM
I won't lie, some of the Hand's material feels almost like the League of Assassins in Arrow, which I'm not sure is right for the series or not.

But if this is going to help out for Iron Fist, then I'm fine with how it's turning out. The movies did a decent job making Thor and Captain America fit into the same world.

I have the same impression about The Hand, but personally I actually liked most of the League of Assassin stuff, so I'm cool with something similar in Daredevil.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on March 22, 2016, 08:59:39 PM
I won't lie, some of the Hand's material feels almost like the League of Assassins in Arrow, which I'm not sure is right for the series or not.

But if this is going to help out for Iron Fist, then I'm fine with how it's turning out. The movies did a decent job making Thor and Captain America fit into the same world.
I do think that the show's tone and its actual content are a bit dissonant when it comes to the Elektra/Hand storyline. It feels a little corny at times to me, as it's trying to be dark and gritty despite the villains being immortal ninjas and zombie children (I guess this is what the original TMNT writers were making fun of?). I still like it overall, though, and the episode where Matt and Elektra infiltrated the Roxxon building was just the right mixture of campy and serious. I kind of wish there was more stuff like that in the show.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on March 22, 2016, 09:03:58 PM
I think that it mostly works because the show has done a good job of planting the seeds and slowly building up the supernatural elements since the first season. We got a little bit of that stuff early on, and now we had quite a bit more this season. I fully expect more of that material to come into play later on.

While I agree that it can get sappy in a few scenes and moments of dialogue, I personally feel that the majority of it has been worked into the tone of the series quite well, myself.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on March 22, 2016, 09:06:07 PM
I think that it mostly works because the show has done a good job of planting the seeds and slowly building up the supernatural elements since the first season. We got a little bit of that stuff early on, and now we had quite a bit more this season. I fully expect more of that material to come into play later on.

While I agree that it can get sappy in a few scenes and moments of dialogue, I personally feel that the majority of it has been worked into the tone of the series quite well, myself.
Oh, absolutely, it works at least 95% of the time, and I'm glad they aren't watering down the supernatural or "comic booky" elements to create a more grounded experience. There are a few stumbles, but overall this season is every bit as good as the previous Marvel Netflix outings, and the Punisher storyline is among the best material in any superhero adaptation.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Avaitor on March 22, 2016, 09:08:46 PM
Yeah, I'm not really opposed to the concept, either, and I'm also a fan of Arrow's League storyline. But at its weakest, it seems like the show struggle with deciding the right tone to use the Hand.

I will say that I do like how the show still has an overarching story, but cuts a lot of it into arcs. It helps to keep the pacing fresh, as they try to give everyone a fair amount of time. Punisher and Elektra are well-developed, and the main characters aren't forgotten about, either. I felt that the first season dragged in parts (and so did Jessica Jones, for that matter), so this little extra touch of brevity really helped to make S2 superior.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Insomniac on March 22, 2016, 09:10:46 PM
Oh yeah, thank Christ they aren't trying to hide the sillier stuff. I remember in Jessica Jones when they kept having to tiptoe around it as if they were banned from saying "Captain America" even once.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on March 22, 2016, 09:15:21 PM
I will say that I do like how the show still has an overarching story, but cuts a lot of it into arcs. It helps to keep the pacing fresh, as they try to give everyone a fair amount of time. Punisher and Elektra are well-developed, and the main characters aren't forgotten about, either. I felt that the first season dragged in parts (and so did Jessica Jones, for that matter), so this little extra touch of brevity really helped to make S2 superior.
Even though Daredevil season 1 and Jessica Jones dragged a bit, I think I appreciated their singular focus more, personally. Punisher is an amazing character, but this season desperately lacks an antagonist as engaging as Fisk or Kilgrave IMO.

Oh yeah, thank Christ they aren't trying to hide the sillier stuff. I remember in Jessica Jones when they kept having to tiptoe around it as if they were banned from saying "Captain America" even once.
They might very well have been. Even though they're connected, I feel like Marvel doesn't want the films and TV shows explicitly referencing each other's characters (except Agent Carter, obviously).
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on March 22, 2016, 09:24:35 PM
I'm glad there wasn't an overarching villain this season. One because it makes it different from season 1 and two because they can't top Fisk so soon. It made this season a pure world-building season and it works great as a bridge from season 1 into the next one. Focusing on different things benefited season 2 a lot. I already can't wait to see where its going to go next season.

Now when is Matt gonna show up in the movies?
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Insomniac on March 22, 2016, 09:26:20 PM
I remember reading an interview saying there would have to be quite a few arrangements made in order for any of the TV characters to appear in the movies, like that one where the Russos were unsure as to whether the Defenders would appear in Infinity War.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on March 22, 2016, 09:28:38 PM
Now when is Matt gonna show up in the movies?
Infinity War, prob--

I remember reading an interview saying there would have to be quite a few arrangements made in order for any of the TV characters to appear in the movies, like that one where the Russos were unsure as to whether the Defenders would appear in Infinity War.
Oh. Shit.

I really hope they can arrange for the Defenders to appear in Infinity War, maybe even get Deadpool and some X-Men in there too. That'd be the greatest superhero event movie ever.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Insomniac on March 22, 2016, 09:36:09 PM
Very unlikely given Fox. According to Feige, they wouldn't even give them Galactus or the Skrulls despite neither of those characters having a hope of appearing in the Fox movies.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on March 22, 2016, 09:39:13 PM
Now when is Matt gonna show up in the movies?
Infinity War, prob--

I remember reading an interview saying there would have to be quite a few arrangements made in order for any of the TV characters to appear in the movies, like that one where the Russos were unsure as to whether the Defenders would appear in Infinity War.
Oh. Shit.

I really hope they can arrange for the Defenders to appear in Infinity War, maybe even get Deadpool and some X-Men in there too. That'd be the greatest superhero event movie ever.
As much as I would like Infinity War to go all out, I think we're lucky enough to be getting Spider-Man in Civil War.

Still, I hope they get the Defenders in there. It will be a real loss if they can't.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on March 22, 2016, 09:44:20 PM
:( I just want Deadpool to show up in the post-credits scene so he can discuss his proposed buddy comedy with Spider-Man! Though I guess that's probably too much to ask given the rights issues. :(

But yeah, if the Defenders don't at least cameo in Infinity War, it'll be the biggest missed opportunity of missed opportunities.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Avaitor on March 22, 2016, 09:51:13 PM
I could see Ryan Reynolds show up in a red suit and try to mess around with the heroes in a post-credits scene. But that would be it.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on March 22, 2016, 09:55:56 PM
The only way that we'll ever get any X-Men characters in the MCU is if those movies start to do pretty poorly, and FOX is forced to pull a Sony in order to keep their franchise alive, and even in that situation I'm still doubtful of whether or not FOX would be competent enough to make a move like that.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Insomniac on March 22, 2016, 10:00:37 PM
Fox is still clutching those Fantastic Four rights despite that franchise being as dead as Bill Cosby's career. The only way they'll hand X-Men characters to the MCU would be if extortion were involved.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on March 22, 2016, 11:22:15 PM
As much as I want to crap on FOX for incompetence, I also have to admit that they've been handling the X-Men franchise really well in recent years. I mean, The Wolverine was a snooze-fest, IMO, but First Class, Days of Future Past, and Deadpool were all excellent, and personally I have faith in Apocalypse to be good with Bryan Singer directing it.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on March 23, 2016, 01:11:37 AM
Foggy didn't really need to know about The Hand. In fact, it seemed like he would have not given a damn. Also, Elektra would have either killed everyone or gotten captured. The former wouldn't have been too bad though. :D
Edit:
Spoiler
I honestly feel like they didn't go far enough with the supernatural stuff which is probably why we kind of got half-assed explanations from probably almost everything extraordinary The Hand did. I guess they are saving the resurrection explanation for Season 3 to surprise Matt with it for when Elektra comes back.

Oh another note, I expected Elektra to start out as a villain (I read somewhere that she was the leader of The Hand in the comics) which is why I got extra excited when she showed up. Once I think about it, I would have still preferred that. Nobu basically being the main villain this season felt kind of flat with how quickly he died last season. I'm not sure I could stomach Elektra returning as a villain after everything that happened between her and Matt in the last few episodes.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on March 23, 2016, 05:11:39 PM
I think they're building up the more mystical elements. There's more in season 2 than in 1, but they are there in both. By season 4 I'm guessing it will be all out on the table.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on March 23, 2016, 07:28:55 PM
I hope so. I can't really knock a good setup

Spoiler
I also wonder if Madame Gao is an Iron Fist villain. According to her in season 2, she just went back to Chinatown, but I still think the theory of her coming from K'un Lun could be true.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on March 29, 2016, 09:30:46 PM
I hope so. I can't really knock a good setup

Spoiler
I also wonder if Madame Gao is an Iron Fist villain. According to her in season 2, she just went back to Chinatown, but I still think the theory of her coming from K'un Lun could be true.
Spoiler
It would be an easy cross-over to make since she's the biggest player on the streets currently not dead or in jail.

Do you guys think Frank will be back in season 3? I don't think they'll be getting to a Punisher show for a while yet since they still have Luke Cage, Iron Fist, JJ season 2, and Defenders to go through.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on March 29, 2016, 10:45:02 PM
Spoiler
I think Elektra's storyline will continue in season 3 while the Punisher's will continue in his own series, possibly featuring characters from Daredevil in supporting roles.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on March 29, 2016, 11:52:53 PM
Well, word is that Netflix REALLY wants a Punisher spin-off series, and it's not like Marvel is opposed to doing it, but with all of the other projects that their TV department is juggling right now, it probably won't happen anytime soon. At the very earliest, it could premiere by late next year, after The Defenders, but even that's quite a stretch.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on March 29, 2016, 11:58:48 PM
Since Bullseye is a major villain for Punisher, too, I figured it would be a good way to meld the two in to a common enemy. If anything, if he isn't going to have a show any time soon, I really hope they consider bringing him back for DD again.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on March 30, 2016, 01:18:41 AM
I hope so. I can't really knock a good setup

Spoiler
I also wonder if Madame Gao is an Iron Fist villain. According to her in season 2, she just went back to Chinatown, but I still think the theory of her coming from K'un Lun could be true.
Spoiler
It would be an easy cross-over to make since she's the biggest player on the streets currently not dead or in jail.

Do you guys think Frank will be back in season 3? I don't think they'll be getting to a Punisher show for a while yet since they still have Luke Cage, Iron Fist, JJ season 2, and Defenders to go through.
Spoiler
(https://m.popkey.co/6cbf33/kvpaw.gif)You're God damn right! It would be like her to just wait and do something big when the time is right.

I think he'll have his own show before Season 3 but I could be wrong. Either way, I do expect him to be in both.
Since Bullseye is a major villain for Punisher, too, I figured it would be a good way to meld the two in to a common enemy. If anything, if he isn't going to have a show any time soon, I really hope they consider bringing him back for DD again.
I didn't even know that. I hope Bullseye is amazing in whatever shows he's in. He's top 30 comic book villain for me just from reading him in Deadpool comics.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on March 30, 2016, 02:10:38 AM
I honestly don't think DD season 3 will be airing next year. Since they still need to get through Luke Cage and Iron Fist before The Defenders, they really want to do a Punisher solo series, and (IIRC) they've confirmed that they'll be releasing one season of Marvel Netflix every six months, I have a feeling we won't be seeing much of these characters until late 2017/early 2018. :(
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on March 30, 2016, 02:23:39 AM
Whoa...well, if it comes to that, then I'm grateful that they got DD 2 out so early. It was originally supposed to air in 2017 and we got it in slightly less than a year later. I'm greedy and hope they still pull off giving us Luke, Iron Fist, Defenders, JJ S2, Punisher and Daredevil Season 3 by the end of 2017 though.  :light:
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on March 30, 2016, 08:10:55 AM
Luke Cage is currently scheduled for September, so it should be out before year's end.

Then next year we have the obvious Iron Fist, JJ season 2, and nothing else currently announced. If that's all we're getting I assume they will still throw in the Defenders at the end of it. That would make up the lack of a DD season 3 to me if they did that.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Peanutbutter on March 30, 2016, 02:50:50 PM
Why do we need both Luke Cage/Iron Fist seasons AND a Defenders season so soon? As much as I think the Luke Cage series should be good, I'm starting think that maybe they should have just had him on Jessica Jones as the co-protagonist and do his stuff later. Marvel is doing way too much at once.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on March 30, 2016, 04:30:38 PM
They weren't planning on Daredevil or Jessica Jones getting second seasons, so their plans have gotten considerably more complicated.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on March 30, 2016, 04:36:06 PM
They weren't planning on a Punisher spin-off series, either, but now everyone wants it to happen. It looks like lately Marvel's TV department is TOO GOOD for their own good. :sweat:
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on March 30, 2016, 07:13:58 PM
When this was first announced it was meant to be four shows with 13 episodes each capping off with Defenders.

Season 2 of DD and JJ wrecked those plans as did them taking their time on nailing a direction for Iron Fist. Not to mention, their production fell a bit behind. Defenders was originally supposed to premiere at the end of 2016. Obviously not happening any more.

Just think of it as a phase like the Marvel movies.

Phase 1:
Daredevil
Jessica Jones
DD season 2
Luke Cage
JJ season 2
Iron Fist
Defenders

Phase 2:
The Punisher
?

And so on. I find it easier to parse out that way.

Also, we need an Iron Fist season soon because he is one of Marvel's most underrated characters and is quite awesome.  ;)
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Peanutbutter on March 30, 2016, 10:13:49 PM
When this was first announced it was meant to be four shows with 13 episodes each capping off with Defenders.

Season 2 of DD and JJ wrecked those plans as did them taking their time on nailing a direction for Iron Fist. Not to mention, their production fell a bit behind. Defenders was originally supposed to premiere at the end of 2016. Obviously not happening any more.

Just think of it as a phase like the Marvel movies.

Phase 1:
Daredevil
Jessica Jones
DD season 2
Luke Cage
JJ season 2
Iron Fist
Defenders

Phase 2:
The Punisher
?

And so on. I find it easier to parse out that way.

Also, we need an Iron Fist season soon because he is one of Marvel's most underrated characters and is quite awesome.  ;)



Man its just crazy. I liked Luke Cage in Jessica Jones and I'm sure Iron Fist should be good, but they should just scrap the Defenders and let some these shows play out some seasons first. This is feeling a bit scattered to me.



Would it be they had a way to shoot two seasons at once or something.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on March 31, 2016, 04:16:47 PM
Screw that. The more, the merrier. Cage just being a co-protagonist would be lame. Cage and Iron Fist are overdue for shows.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on March 31, 2016, 05:11:37 PM
Not to mention, they are all run by separate teams. The Daredevil team would just be sitting around twiddling their thumbs if season 2 wasn't greenlit. Or worse, they would move on to new projects (like DeKnight did) and a potential season 2 would be a major letdown without them.

Oh, and after two seasons or so I wouldn't mind a "Luke Cage & Iron Fist" show to take over from their individual ones.  :D
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Peanutbutter on March 31, 2016, 06:30:40 PM
Screw that. The more, the merrier. Cage just being a co-protagonist would be lame. Cage and Iron Fist are overdue for shows.


Problem is that half of them have to have longer hiatuses.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on March 31, 2016, 06:37:41 PM
How so? They have separate teams and we got Daredevil Season 2 in less than 1 year. Even with Daredevil, its Season 3 will probably be out shortly after its previous season 2 date, which was 2017.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Insomniac on April 01, 2016, 08:43:56 PM
Anyone else call Fisk's new prison friend Black Wesley? And anybody waiting for Fisk to say "Thank you, Black Wesley" to him?
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on April 11, 2016, 06:15:38 PM
Defenders shoots at the end of the year. (http://www.slashfilm.com/defenders-start-date/)

So yeah, there's the reason they didn't announce DD season 3 yet. This means Iron Fist and JJ season 2 will be the Marvel shows for 2017 leading up to Defenders.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on April 13, 2016, 12:29:57 PM
Neat article (http://screenrant.com/marvel-tv-universe-guide/) on the TV universe. It lists out all the shows and their current status.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Insomniac on April 29, 2016, 09:20:05 AM
Frank Time is Nigh. (http://www.ew.com/article/2016/04/29/punisher-marvel-netflix?xid=entertainment-weekly_socialflow_twitter)
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on April 29, 2016, 10:15:48 AM
Cool. Though I guess this means he won't be in DD season 3, which is a shame.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Avaitor on April 29, 2016, 10:39:27 AM
I'm happy, but at the same time, I don't want Marvel's TV division swamped.

I'm starting to think that it would be for the best if they just dropped the Defenders and just continued to let their other series do their own things.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Peanutbutter on April 30, 2016, 04:33:59 PM
Bernthal was superb. He just looked and even sounded like the Punisher. I don't know who they'll have as the main villain unless they do Jigsaw, but its bound to be awesome.



I'm happy, but at the same time, I don't want Marvel's TV division swamped.

I'm starting to think that it would be for the best if they just dropped the Defenders and just continued to let their other series do their own things.



That's exactly what I was arguing earlier in this thread. Let both Luke Cage and Iron Fist's series have room to breathe, we do not need a Defenders series out that quickly.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on April 30, 2016, 06:18:34 PM
I wouldn't mind if we got a few more seasons of each series first, with crossover episodes taking place between each of them to still take advantage of the shared Universe. Then The Defenders could be released as a big event mini-series.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Insomniac on April 30, 2016, 06:23:40 PM
I'm still waiting for Marvel to throw a bone and have at least one of the Defenders cameo in a Marvel film, even if the tones would clash so hard.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on April 30, 2016, 07:01:39 PM
I don't care how, but I want to eventually see at least one scene in which The Punisher converses with Howard the Duck just for the sake of acknowledging that they exist within the same continuity. Fuck tonal clashes.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on April 30, 2016, 09:12:39 PM
I just want to see Barracuda in live action.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Peanutbutter on May 12, 2016, 08:18:36 PM
Agent Carter has been given an early retirement. :(



http://tvline.com/2016/05/12/agent-carter-cancelled-abc-season-3/
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on May 12, 2016, 08:27:17 PM
It's a shame to hear considering how good it was, but at least it had a pretty satisfying ending, all things considered.

I'm just more baffled that AOS is still going, though.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Avaitor on May 12, 2016, 10:42:18 PM
AOS is sticking around because it's going to hit syndication numbers. If a series can make it to a third season, it's usually safe for at least one or two more for that reason, especially if it's owned by the network. But I really do doubt that the show will do anything in syndication.

It sucks about Agent Carter being over, though. But this is also something that I've been expecting for a while, since not only has it never done too well in the ratings, but Hayley Atwell has her new show now. Ah well.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: GregX on May 18, 2016, 10:09:51 AM
So Chloe Bennet just bit the hand that fed her: http://io9.gizmodo.com/agents-of-shield-star-says-marvel-doesnt-care-enough-ab-1777057136

Also, AoS is being moved to 10pm next season. Otherwise known as the "Death Slot". ABC cancelled Agent Carter (I loved it, but the ratings just weren't there), and they rejected that Marvel's Most Wanted AoS spin-off and considering AoS's very mediocre and dropping ratings, I can't blame them. So yeah, a fourth season in the death slot to bleed off their episode order and it's done.

And don't count on any of these characters making their way to the big screen. After the Feige/Perlmutter split. AoS might as well kill off it's cast during the final season. The Inhumans movie is dead already.

In my mind, Agent Coulson is still very much dead. And Chloe Bennet's recent comments reveal someone who was killing time until she got a promotion to the movies... a promotion she probably thought was coming with the Inhumans movie, and now she's bitter because she realizes it's not.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on May 18, 2016, 10:19:39 AM
This is some of the best news that I've heard all year. I'm glad that the MCU is throwing this show under the bus.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: GregX on May 18, 2016, 03:21:17 PM
Well, here's my theory: http://gregxb.blogspot.com/2016/05/ponderings-on-special-snowflake.html
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on July 13, 2016, 01:43:18 PM
(http://67.media.tumblr.com/9f325f3906109719b8ad8a72c0119177/tumblr_nmo0003Gsi1rjh2ymo1_500.gif)
(http://67.media.tumblr.com/08ad61b239b2b4325791009c5ebb81f4/tumblr_nmo0003Gsi1rjh2ymo2_500.gif)

We better be getting Defenders next year. I don't want to go a whole year without any Daredevil at all.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Peanutbutter on July 13, 2016, 06:06:46 PM
Yeah, Daredevil is one of the biggest reasons I want them to hold their horses on a Defenders series. Just give Luke Cage and Iron Fist each have a few of their own seasons first. The iron is not going to be bone cold just because they don't rush it.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on July 13, 2016, 06:14:03 PM
I honestly wouldn't mind if they took a cue from the CW superhero shows and had characters from one-series team-up with characters from another series in one or two episodes each season, while having the characters still retain their own solo story-lines throughout each season of their respective shows. That way we could experience the benefit of a shared Universe and it would help hold us over for a few years until they did a full-fledged Defenders show where all of the characters team up.

I mean, they've essentially already sort of done this by using Jessica Jones as a jumping off point for the Luke Cage character. I don't see why the same logic wouldn't work with either Daredevil or Iron Fist.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on July 13, 2016, 06:25:19 PM
Well, it is sort of unfair for Daredevil fans. The show came out, was a hit, and had a second season, which was also a hit. But there's no room for a season 3. So now they have to wait to see him again while JJ (season 2), Iron Fist, Luke Cage, and Punisher all get their own series? That's like a two year gap to not have anything in production. That's pretty ridiculous for a hit show.

The least they can do is let Matt be a recurring character in Punisher season 1. He is spinning off from the show, and took up a lot of focus in DD's last season. It would be nice if the Punisher show could do the same for Matt.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on July 14, 2016, 12:42:36 AM
I don't think Jessica Jones season 2 is happening until after The Defenders. Daredevil season 3 will probably be out before it.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on July 21, 2016, 11:20:02 PM
Luke Cage trailer! (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ymw5uvViqPU) It's out in September!

Iron Fist teaser! (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QCSPda7xQ3s) Coming soon!

Defenders teaser! (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wBZtM8q2Z1g) Coming 2017!

Marvel X Netflix sizzle reel! (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Jyd8MeKOgg)

Wow, that was a lot of stuff.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on July 22, 2016, 09:50:39 AM
Okay, I missed this.

Daredevil season 3 teaser. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pBedwWhp6to) It says "coming soon" as well.

Looks like we won't be waiting two years for season 3 after all.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on July 28, 2016, 09:23:02 AM
Oh, man. (http://screencrush.com/jessica-jones-daredevil-punisher-2018-defenders/)

Quote
Speaking from the TCA press tour, Netflix boss Ted Sarandos confirmed that where Luke Cage would premiere on September 30, both Iron Fist and The Defenders will occupy the two slots in 2017. Jessica Jones Season 2 was said to film back-to-back with The Defenders, with The Punisher starting production sometime thereafter, but Jones, Castle and the newly-announced Daredevil Season 3 will all wait until at least 2018.
The Defenders better be worth all this wait.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on August 09, 2016, 07:18:56 PM
Another Luke Cage trailer. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hfJvnb4H3TE&feature=youtu.be)

Really liking the look of this.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Insomniac on September 30, 2016, 03:21:57 AM
First episode of Luke Cage was cool. Especially liking the added literary allusions to this. The nod to Justin Hammer was cute too, even if this show's still just as tip-toey about referencing superheroes like Jessica Jones was.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on September 30, 2016, 08:02:08 PM
First episode was fucking awesome! The soundtrack is so perfect. Everything else was great too - on par with if not better than Daredevil and Jessica Jones IMO - but goddamn, the music. For that alone, this will probably end up being my favorite Marvel TV thing... until they make a Power Man & Iron Fist series.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on September 30, 2016, 10:11:00 PM
I'm three episodes in and loving it so far, but I have to say, I'm actually starting to understand (aside from just business semantics) why the MCU is resistant to crossing over with the Netflix shows. They are just way too tonally different. Movies like Guardians of the Galaxy, Age of Ultron, and Civil War work because despite being so fantastical, they embrace that nature all of the way. They don't try to be realistic or establish hard, grounded rules, so they can work as stories the way that they are. Meanwhile, the Netflix shows keep the really out there elements to a minimum, and try to tell stories that are grounded and realistic enough to almost be able to work without any superheroes at all (minus Daredevil season two, which did gradually stray further into comic book territory throughout the course of the season).

There is also the fact that while the MCU films are particularly good at being well-made, family-friendly experiences, the Netflix shows tend to tackle more mature themes, and thus the characters and stories are written around those.

My point in this being that while I can buy characters like Frank Castle and Luke Cage existing in the same Universe together, I can't imagine those characters ever interacting with a talking raccoon or magic hamner-wielding demigod in the same Universe as well. I feel like the tones of these two Marvel entities wouldn't mix, and you wouldn't be able to have these characters featured in the movies as anything other than cameos without significantly altering who their characters are in order to fit a tone that they clearly weren't written for.

As someone who genuinely loves both the darker and more adult Netflix shows but am also not an anti-fun buzz-kill and enjoy a lot of MCU films just as much for different reasons, I do think that it may be best if the only interconnectivity between their Universes stays at the level of someone in Daredevil or Luke Cage occasionally referencing an Avenger in passing.

Although....perhaps I could see the entertainment value in Wilson Fisk violently removing an alien's head with a car door....:thinkin:
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on October 01, 2016, 09:04:03 PM
Just finished the seventh episode....

OK, I definitely didn't see that coming. Totally subverted my expectations way more than anything in Daredevil or Jessica Jones. :huh:
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Peanutbutter on October 01, 2016, 10:23:55 PM
Just finished the seventh episode....

OK, I definitely didn't see that coming. Totally subverted my expectations way more than anything in Daredevil or Jessica Jones. :huh:


I just finished Episode 3. Saw quite a bit of buzz about Episode 7. TVTropes calls it the Seventh Episode Twist for a reason.



Can't wait to see it tomorrow!
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on October 02, 2016, 08:19:58 PM
DUDE episode 3 had a fucking fight scene set to Wu-Tang Clan. This is officially the most awesome superhero adaptation ever!
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on October 02, 2016, 09:41:45 PM
I just finished the season. Goddamn that second half was just so addicting. I haven't been so compelled to binge-watch a series since the first four seasons of Game of Thrones.

The ending, once again, completely subverted my expectations.

Spoiler
Mariah actually wins, or at least doesn't go down this season. She gets away scott-free for all of the terrible things that she did, and Luke goes to prison. And while it makes sense that a TV series can do this since it has future seasons to continue the plot with, I still wasn't expecting such a cliffhanger for any of the Marvel stand-alone series before The Defenders. I mean, yes, the evidence to absolve Luke of his crimes is recovered by his friend at the very end, but it still leaves a bitter taste in your mouth that someone as despicable as Mariah gets to walk free. It's a very untraditional and ballsy ending to the season, even by the standards of the Netflix shows, and leads me to anticipate that future seasons of all of these shows will be far less predictable.

So now I'm just wondering if Daredevil season three will happen before The Defenders and Luke Cage will play a supporting part in it (like he did in Jessica Jones), or if certain plot points from this season will bleed over into The Defenders, since it seems that they kind of have to as this stuff just can't be ignored until Luke Cage season two.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on October 02, 2016, 10:15:25 PM
Pretty great season. I'd put it second only to Daredevil. Luke was an excellent hero, and his villains were some of the best in the entire MCU. Particularly Shades and Mariah. Not to mention the story was engaging from start to finish with a pretty good twist in the middle. Though I do wish Luke would have gone for calling Claire's "attorney friend" at the end. All in all, I wonder how Iron Fist will be able to stack up to this.

The Defenders is looking mighty good right about now.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Peanutbutter on October 02, 2016, 10:16:59 PM
Just saw "Manifest" the show's seventh episode.


Spoiler
Holy Toledo were they ever not kidding about this episode! Cottonmouth being killed I actually wasn't shocked by, just that it was Mariah that killed him and not Shades. Didn't see Luke getting shot with the Judas Bullet right the end too, I saw that sniper and immiedately I was like, "Oh no, here it comes....". Great episode. The final five are going to be insane!


Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on October 02, 2016, 10:22:17 PM
So now I'm just wondering if Daredevil season three will happen before The Defenders and Luke Cage will play a supporting part in it (like he did in Jessica Jones), or if certain plot points from this season will bleed over into The Defenders, since it seems that they kind of have to as this stuff just can't be ignored until Luke Cage season two.
Next is Iron Fist, and then Defenders. JJ season 2 and DD season 3 are after them.

I don't think it would be out of the realm of possibility for Defenders to cover the ending of this season in order to bring him into the fold. They do have to get all four of them together, and right now three of them are very closely related. It's all about where Iron Fist falls into it next.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on October 03, 2016, 01:51:57 AM
It's really hard for me to not just binge through all of Luke Cage right now, but I will be strong. So far Marvel is 4 for 4 with their Netflix output as far as I'm concerned. Each series has its own unique appeal that makes it among the most engaging material on TV to me:

Daredevil - Damn good gritty superhero epic. Like the prevailing modern interpretation of Batman but way cooler.
Jessica Jones - Relatable horror story about emotional abuse and overcoming trauma. Bizarre but accurate.
Luke Cage - Neo-blaxploitation without the exploitative bits. Groovalicious soundtrack is integral to every scene.

I'm going to be incredibly disappointed if Iron Fist isn't some ridiculous dragon-punching kung fu masterpiece now. They keep raising the bar every damn time. :cry:
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on October 03, 2016, 08:14:16 AM
I'm sure it is being saved for last because of the mystical elements, but I really hope they match the old school kung-fu feel for it. They nailed the atmosphere for the others, but Iron Fist needs the mysticism in order to work.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Insomniac on October 03, 2016, 08:17:54 AM
I'm still on the fence in regards to Loras from Game of Thrones playing Iron Fist, but I'll probably watch regardless. Need to know how they'll follow up on that Madame Gao subplot from Daredevil.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on October 03, 2016, 08:52:45 AM
I also feel like Iron Fist could afford to be at least a little bit more lighthearted than the other series. We have three series that are already pretty dark and gritty, plus with The Punisher getting his own series down the line, that'll make four. It almost feels necessary to have Iron Fist be that one series in The Defenders lineup that feels a bit more hopeful, while still being relatively grounded compared to anything in the movies. I think that following the general tone of the Ed Brubaker run would be a perfect fit for it.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on October 03, 2016, 10:59:22 AM
Yeah, I hope Iron Fist is more lighthearted than the other shows. I'm not too familiar with him outside of his team-up comics with Luke Cage, but it seems like he tends to add levity to situations despite being a serious character himself. I'd be so happy if his series resembled a classic Bruce Lee movie in terms of tone and style.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on October 03, 2016, 08:46:41 PM
Just finished episode 10 of Luke Cage. Things are starting to heat up again and I will see if the 2nd half is inferior to the first.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on October 04, 2016, 07:39:20 AM
So, I just found out that Alfre Woodard who played Mariah in Luke Cage also played a minor role in Civil War. Either that's meant to set up some hardcore theory-crafting, or the Marvel film and television departments just messed up on coordinating their casting to avoid any overlap.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on October 04, 2016, 08:39:18 PM
Finally just finished Luke Cage. Good lord, watching almost 13 hours when your last day off was the weekend BEFORE last takes forever. I might like this show even more than Daredevil season 1. Like DD Season 2, it's second half is weaker but it is still better than that. They couldn't really top what they did with Stokes. Luke's long recovery process and Misty being benched was tge worst part of the series. Also, I cannot stand Mariah Dillard. It's like having a boring, evil talk show host for a villain.

As for the good, Stokes, Shades and Diamondback are all better than Kingpin and Kilgrave. Especially Shades. He is my favorite right hand man villain ever. Even moreso than Mad Dog from Hard-Boiled. He was intelligent, intimidating, had a great presence and he even has a bit of honor with how he felt about the Pop situation. Stokes was a damn good crime boss. He was never annoying or a pretentious manbaby like season 1 Fisk. I like Diamondback even more because I am a sucker for super corny Blaxploitation/70s/80s style Big Bad. I can't believe they had the balls to have someone say so many nutty lines. "Bye, Felicia."

They nailed Luke Cage perfectly. I truly like him now since it's not comic book writers trying to write hip hoo dialogue but instead a cool, intelligent flawed man. And I am thoroughly impressed with how freaking much Claire Temple got to do. I thought Risario was just going to cameo but she ended up being the most helpful non-superhero Marvel Netflix character and she had a lot of good moments.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on October 04, 2016, 08:59:55 PM
Shades was the most surprising character. I was actually relieved when he got away from Zip and his men because I really want to see more of him. Diamondback and Stokes were great villains, but Shades' cool and calculating planning and code of loyalty was refreshing considering the number of backstabbers there were in the story. His joy of "discovering" Mariah's dark side was really sinister, and I'd really like to learn more about him.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on October 04, 2016, 09:14:33 PM
Completely agreed. I rewinded him surviving lame ass Zip's assassination attempt when I watched it today. I am also happy he didn't go on to kill Diamondback or vice versa. I hope to see much more of both.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Peanutbutter on October 05, 2016, 10:00:34 AM
Shades was the most surprising character. I was actually relieved when he got away from Zip and his men because I really want to see more of him. Diamondback and Stokes were great villains, but Shades' cool and calculating planning and code of loyalty was refreshing considering the number of backstabbers there were in the story. His joy of "discovering" Mariah's dark side was really sinister, and I'd really like to learn more about him.


Not including Cage, Shades was the best character in this series aside from Pop. Cottonmouth was good, Diamondback was even better, but Shades was awesome. I don't know if he's from the comic or an original character, but they caught lightning in a bottle when they put him in. Can't wait to see more of him.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Avaitor on October 05, 2016, 10:30:33 AM
I just finished this last night, and holy shit, it was great! I definitely preferred it to the second season of Daredevil, and probably even the first. I'm not sure about Jessica Jones, but also keep in mind that I seem to be in the minority on here in preferring that to Daredevil.

But wow, the cast was perfect.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on October 05, 2016, 10:39:02 AM
I just finished this last night, and holy shit, it was great! I definitely preferred it to the second season of Daredevil, and probably even the first. I'm not sure about Jessica Jones, but also keep in mind that I seem to be in the minority on here in preferring that to Daredevil.
I liked Jessica more than Daredevil as well. :) I'm on episode 8 now, and Luke Cage continues to be my favorite. It's got so much style and substance, excellent acting, great writing, brilliant musical decisions, etc. Can't wait to watch the rest!
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on October 05, 2016, 12:04:32 PM
I still say that the first Punisher story arc which was covered in the first four episodes of Daredevil season two are still by far the best, strongest, darkest, and most emotionally-driven piece of entertainment to ever come out of the MCU. On its own it arguably makes for a great 4-hour stand-alone movie. That said, season two as a whole kind of suffered from having everything that came after that point feel disjointed. The other problem was that they basically showed us all of their best material in the beginning to the point where nothing afterward could compare, even if it was mostly good stuff in its own right.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on October 05, 2016, 02:54:01 PM
The first arc of Daredevil season 2 is amazing. As a whole, it was my least favorite Marvel Netflix season, but that first arc by itself might be my favorite bit from everything so far. It was so, so good.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on October 05, 2016, 02:57:22 PM
Honestly, I still like Daredevil season two a lot. It's easily the most flawed season, and like I said the first four episodes far overshadow the rest of it, but there is still a ton of really good stuff in the rest of the season. It just had the huge misfortune of having to follow-up material that was nearly perfect.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on October 05, 2016, 03:01:20 PM
Oh, the whole thing's definitely great. Every season of Marvel Netflix so far has been sublime IMO.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Avaitor on October 05, 2016, 06:11:14 PM
My problem with Daredevil season 2 is basically everything that doesn't involve the Punisher, give or take some of Matt and Foggy's stuff. I wasn't a big fan of Elektra, the Hand, Matt and Karen's relationship, Karen's arc, etc.

But that might just be the best use of Punisher that I've ever seen, and I loved all of his stuff.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on October 05, 2016, 08:06:36 PM
I enjoyed everything in DD season 2, but I felt Matt himself didn't get nearly as much focus as he did in season 1. When it wasn't about Frank, it was about Foggy, Elektra, or Karen. When season 3 comes around I hope that changes.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on October 05, 2016, 08:36:42 PM
Hmmm, I guess Matt didn't get a lot of attention in season 2. And I agree that DD Season 2's first half is really strong if not MCU Netflix's best arc. I think Elektra should have started out as a villain instead of giving Matt all those annoying lies, like I have saud before.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on October 05, 2016, 09:08:46 PM
I enjoyed everything in DD season 2, but I felt Matt himself didn't get nearly as much focus as he did in season 1.
Yeah, I think this was my main problem. Matt is an extremely likeable and compelling character, and when he wasn't the main focus of season 1, Fisk was, and he was equally engaging. I don't hate Karen and Foggy like some people do (even if the latter can be grating at times), but I enjoyed the idea of Elektra's character more than the execution (her actress was great, though) and the Punisher fell a little flat for me after he escaped from prison. The major villains of the later arcs also didn't have the presence of characters like Kilgrave and Cottonmouth, which is a shame because the antagonists are a big part of what makes these Netflix shows so good. Overall, it was a little scattershot, but Luke Cage has proven that Marvel TV can do stories with multiple main villains and arcs well, and I have complete faith in Daredevil Season 3/Iron Fist/The Defenders.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Insomniac on October 05, 2016, 11:06:14 PM
I was thinking up comparisons between The Wire characters and Luke Cage characters, and so far I've got
Shades:Slim Charles
Cottonmouth:Stringer with shades of Marlo
Mariah:Clay Davis with a little Brianna Barksdale
Luke Cage:Cutty
Misty Knight:McNulty
Pops:Blind Butchie
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on October 06, 2016, 07:08:56 PM
I enjoyed everything in DD season 2, but I felt Matt himself didn't get nearly as much focus as he did in season 1.
Yeah, I think this was my main problem. Matt is an extremely likeable and compelling character, and when he wasn't the main focus of season 1, Fisk was, and he was equally engaging. I don't hate Karen and Foggy like some people do (even if the latter can be grating at times), but I enjoyed the idea of Elektra's character more than the execution (her actress was great, though) and the Punisher fell a little flat for me after he escaped from prison. The major villains of the later arcs also didn't have the presence of characters like Kilgrave and Cottonmouth, which is a shame because the antagonists are a big part of what makes these Netflix shows so good. Overall, it was a little scattershot, but Luke Cage has proven that Marvel TV can do stories with multiple main villains and arcs well, and I have complete faith in Daredevil Season 3/Iron Fist/The Defenders.
Elodie Yung is great. The Punisher didn't have as much focus in the second half so of course he didn't come off as great as before.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on October 09, 2016, 12:04:50 PM
I finally finished Luke Cage and it was definitely one of my favorite TV shows ever. GOD I am so excited for Iron Fist and The Defenders now.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on October 09, 2016, 10:23:55 PM
http://youtu.be/Pqc5GEwO7OQ :joy:
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on October 10, 2016, 10:36:11 AM
Wow, they didn't waste any time with this trailer. I'm already sold.

If this is out in Spring like it seems to be, then the Defenders can't be too far away.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on October 10, 2016, 11:48:46 AM
Iron Fist is already confirmed to be releasing in March next year. We'll most likely be getting The Defenders in the Fall season if Marvel follows suit with how they've handled the release schedule of the Netflix series' so far.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Peanutbutter on October 11, 2016, 10:05:09 PM
Still think its a bad idea to rush out Defenders so fast at the expense of Daredevil's third season or Jessica Jones' second.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on October 11, 2016, 11:07:52 PM
Still think its a bad idea to rush out Defenders so fast at the expense of Daredevil's third season or Jessica Jones' second.
I think the cliffhangers at the end of DD season 2 and JJ will be resolved in The Defenders. Everything is building up to that crossover, even more so than the Phase 1 films were.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on October 12, 2016, 10:35:43 AM
Still think its a bad idea to rush out Defenders so fast at the expense of Daredevil's third season or Jessica Jones' second.
I think the cliffhangers at the end of DD season 2 and JJ will be resolved in The Defenders. Everything is building up to that crossover, even more so than the Phase 1 films were.
The end of Luke Cage, too.

I wouldn't be surprised if the end of Iron Fist does the same thing.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Insomniac on October 12, 2016, 01:53:10 PM
Another day, another 500 tweets and articles over how a white guy playing Iron Fist is the worst thing to happen to Asians since Nanking. Jesus, I almost want Marvel to recast him so everybody can shut the fuck up about it. I hate how every Marvel or Disney thing is now surrounded by so much debacle over racial politics, like casting one white guy in a Mulan movie or Luke Cage's actor having a white wife is a bigger travesty than the Syrian refugee crisis.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Peanutbutter on October 12, 2016, 06:50:53 PM
Another day, another 500 tweets and articles over how a white guy playing Iron Fist is the worst thing to happen to Asians since Nanking. Jesus, I almost want Marvel to recast him so everybody can shut the fuck up about it. I hate how every Marvel or Disney thing is now surrounded by so much debacle over racial politics, like casting one white guy in a Mulan movie or Luke Cage's actor having a white wife is a bigger travesty than the Syrian refugee crisis.



Its really stupid because having Iron Fist played by an Asian plays into the "Asians all know Karate and Kung Fu". They're just nitwits looking for something to be offended by.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on October 12, 2016, 07:27:30 PM
Luke Cage's actor having a white wife is a bigger travesty than the Syrian refugee crisis.
This is the one that gets me. I saw a surprising amount of people talking about how the show and its creators can't be pro-black because Mike Colter's wife is white. Complete nonsense.

I hadn't seen anyone complain about Iron Fist before you pointed it out, but I haven't really been looking either. A simple Google search of his name, though... :-\
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on October 12, 2016, 08:13:13 PM
There's always something to whine about.

Marvel hasn't flubbed with a single casting decision for these shows yet. I have no reason to believe they did here, and the trailer only solidifies that they did right again.

In other news, Daredevil is finally coming to Blu-Ray this November. I'm not sure how many of these shows I'll double dip on, but Daredevil is a no-brainer.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on October 12, 2016, 08:24:36 PM
I will probably buy all of them. :el_cry:
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on October 12, 2016, 09:07:54 PM
They better leave Mike alone.  >:(
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Avaitor on October 13, 2016, 06:39:17 PM
I do think Tilda Swinton was a bad call for The Ancient One, but if I had my choice, the character wouldn't have been used for the movie at all.

And it doesn't look like there will be any bonus features on the Blu, which would be my main incentive to buy it. But I have been wanting to collect the non-AOS Marvel shows, anyway.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on October 13, 2016, 08:29:36 PM
Ugh, her casting is even worse than I thought then.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Insomniac on February 08, 2017, 11:29:02 PM
So Legion's first episode was mesmerizing. Very interested where Noah Hawley will go with this.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on February 09, 2017, 01:07:44 AM
Iron Fist trailer. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f9OKL5no-S0)

March 17th! Can't wait!
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Insomniac on February 09, 2017, 03:50:04 AM
Thinking about it, Legion's premiere felt more experimental than those of the Netflix Marvel show's. Definitely more camera tricks and effects used, that's for sure. All the shots where Legion uses his powers are cool to see. A lot of scenes to slowly confuse you and make you think this is all just magic realism, all in a crazy guy's head who just happens to be more articulate than other crazies, and then boom. You're reminded this is X-Men.

I heard when Noah Hawley was asked to do an X-Men show, he was given the choice of doing either Legion or the Hellfire Club. Wonder what the latter would've been like. And I am interested as to how this connects to the X-Men films, because producer comments have been ambiguous as to whether they're connected or not.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Avaitor on February 09, 2017, 01:28:37 PM
Yeah, the premiere for Legion sounds pretty badass. When I catch up with other things, I hope to get to it.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Avaitor on February 12, 2017, 06:52:34 PM
Legion's off to a great start. It feels different than other comic book shows, even something like Preacher, and in a good way.

We need something like this.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Avaitor on March 09, 2017, 01:19:00 AM
So the reviews for Iron Fist are in and... it's looking like a dud. I don't think I've heard a single good thing about it yet.

Ah well. I'll still watch it just to see if it lives up to the legacy, but I'm more excited to order the Immortal Iron Fist collections instead.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Insomniac on March 09, 2017, 03:35:29 AM
Yeah, I've been pretty unhyped for Iron Fist overall. I still think all the talk about how the show is Orientalist or whitewashing is bullshit (even if they did cast an Asian guy to play Danny Rand, I still probably wouldn't be enthusiastic), but hearing how the show doesn't really do anything new compared to the other Netflix shows hasn't really lured me in.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on March 09, 2017, 03:42:10 AM
I was hyped until I heard about this. Ugh, I still hope it's great. It sucks that the superhero I was looking forward to coming to live action the most is getting a bad start.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Insomniac on March 09, 2017, 03:55:43 AM
The most attention I've put into Iron Fist recently was when some crazy lady on Twitter bitched at Finn Jones and temporarily bullied him off of the site by calling him a whitesplainer. Like people know he's just the actor, right? And the people telling him to quit the role, they expect someone to decline all that Marvel money and let the general public know them forever as Loras from Game of Thrones instead?
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Avaitor on March 09, 2017, 02:49:14 PM
Danny Rand has always been white. On one level, I can see why casting a Chinese actor could be a good thing, but on the other,knowing today's climate and the industry's mixed success with writing for Asian roles, I feel like we'd still get some gross Yellow Fever tropes in the show if they did. Not to mention how it could easily build on the stereotype that all Chinese people know marital arts.

Basically, from what I understand, whitewashing is not one of the show's problems.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Peanutbutter on March 09, 2017, 04:46:17 PM
I don't know, most of the reviews seem to focus too much on the supposed "whitewashing" as opposed to actual flaws being explained.



Though this was supposed to be done by the people behind the final seasons of Dexter. Never watched that show, but I remember the rumors about how goofy the final episodes are. So to me, this is up in the air. I'll wait until tomorrow after I've watched it to state if its good or not. I will say that I still think they rushed this out way too fast when they could have done another season of Daredevil or Jessica Jones. Or at the least give a different hero a shot. I really don't get the hype of this Defenders project they want out so bad.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on March 09, 2017, 05:00:10 PM
I'll watch it either way. All I want is an entertaining show.

After this I hope they just merge Luke Cage and Iron Fist into one show, though. These limited Netflix slots are pushing too many shows out of the way. Lets get Defenders out already so we can start getting Daredevil yearly.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Avaitor on March 09, 2017, 05:19:26 PM
I don't really see the point of the Defenders being made. These aren't heroes who shouldn't really be teaming up like this, and frankly, I'm not sure what direction it's going to go in. The thing with these shows is that they start off strong when they're grittier and more down-to-earth than the MCU films, but when they start to embrace more comic book-like plots in their latter halves, they start getting less enjoyable, so if it gets supernatural, I'll probably get bored.

Also, I'd rather the Defenders monkier be used for the films, since we already have Doctor Strange and Hulk. If Marvel could just get the Surfer back...
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on March 09, 2017, 05:45:40 PM
Thing is, it's already being filmed right now. What I want is to get it over with so we can start getting season releases on a regular schedule. Waiting an extra year for DD season 3 is asinine.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Peanutbutter on March 09, 2017, 08:46:19 PM
Thing is, it's already being filmed right now. What I want is to get it over with so we can start getting season releases on a regular schedule. Waiting an extra year for DD season 3 is asinine.


Yeah this is how I feel too, basically. They want to do it, its one of the main reasons they set all these shows up in the first place. It's going to happen whether some of us have reservations or not. As long as Defenders is good (even if Iron Fist turns out to be bad), I can be satisfied. I don't mind the paranormal stuff since they're going to have to do it if there's any hope of letting them gel with the movies. With the right script, I think seeing the Netflix Marvel gang interact with the outer edges of the universe would be fun to see.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on March 11, 2017, 03:17:44 PM
Wait, Iron Fist is out? Fuck, these shows sneak up on me.
Anyway, I am excited about The Defenders. Avengers but possibly by people who have done shows (the Netflix series) better than most of the MCU movies? Sold!
Iron Fist and Luke should not be merged. Cage did his own thing too well for a team up. I hear The Defenders won't be in Infinity Gauntlet. Hopefully they show up in Infinity Gauntlet Part 2, possibly as backup since I suspect at least one Avenger will die by the end of Part 1.
Also, when's The Punisher coming out? If it's all at least as good as Frank's DD2 episodes then it could become my favorite anything ever.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Avaitor on March 11, 2017, 05:15:26 PM
Iron Fist isn't out yet- it will be up this coming Friday.

And I thought that we're getting Punisher after season 2 of Jessica Jones, but I haven't really been keeping track of the show's schedules. I would much rather have the Punisher show than season 3 of Daredevil, myself- if we get more of that knock-off Legion of Shadows stuff that plagued DD's second season, I'm not sure if I'll stick around for that.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on March 12, 2017, 08:24:51 PM
The Hand is kind of integral to DD's story. Hopefully next season Marvel won't squeeze in more characters to take away from Matt, but I still really liked season 2. And I would much rather a season 3 to Daredevil than literally anything coming up.

Having to wait two years in between seasons is crap, honestly.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Peanutbutter on March 13, 2017, 04:47:12 AM
The Hand is kind of integral to DD's story. Hopefully next season Marvel won't squeeze in more characters to take away from Matt, but I still really liked season 2. And I would much rather a season 3 to Daredevil than literally anything coming up.

Having to wait two years in between seasons is crap, honestly.



Yeah it really is. I'm hoping the critics are just full of crap about Iron Fist because I'm going to be angry if Daredevil had to be delayed for a project that couldn't even be kept together.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Insomniac on March 13, 2017, 06:45:47 PM
I hope Iron Fist isn't as bad as what the critics are saying, but the showrunner did work on the seasons of Dexter where this happened.

(http://images.buddytv.com/articles/dexterfeels.gif)
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on March 13, 2017, 08:22:01 PM
 :D :D :D :D
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on March 13, 2017, 08:34:56 PM
I hope Iron Fist isn't as bad as what the critics are saying, but the showrunner did work on the seasons of Dexter where this happened.

(http://images.buddytv.com/articles/dexterfeels.gif)

Never understood the massive hate for Dexter's later seasons, myself. It's clearly one of the best TV comedies of the past decade. Just about every episode had me rolling with laughter.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Insomniac on March 13, 2017, 09:05:08 PM
I'm just amused by how controversial the series finale (that the Iron Fist showrunner co-wrote) was, that the president of Showtime had to step in and tell people to chill.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: LumRanmaYasha on March 17, 2017, 02:27:29 PM
I just finished the first episode of Iron Fist. It was the stupidest and most hilariously bad thing I've watched in a while. And I saw Sword Art Online: Ordinal Scale last week.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on March 17, 2017, 02:47:03 PM
In all seriousness it's a shame that Iron Fist is such a train-wreck. I'm still going to watch it in full just to get to The Defenders, but for as much as I love Daredevil, Jessica Jones, and Luke Cage, they are so dark and depressing that I felt as though Iron Fist was a chance for Marvel to add a much needed bit of levity to this particular side of their Universe. This could have been the fun show to balance out the heavy drama of the others, similar to CW's The Flash. But with the hugely negative reception to what we just got, I can't help but feel like Marvel's response will be to double down on making shit as dark as possible, which might get a bit tiring for me if I'm to be perfectly honest.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Avaitor on March 17, 2017, 06:41:44 PM
I agree. I'd prefer a lighter series, or even something akin to Agent Carter for Netflix. The other show's tones work well for the most part, but there isn't much variety between all of the darkness.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: LumRanmaYasha on March 17, 2017, 06:55:04 PM
If the show had a lighter tone and didn't take itself so seriously, it might have been salvageable. But it takes itself very seriously. And what it's taking seriously is seriously stupid.

To wit, I've watched through episode 4 so far. The biggest problem of the show is Danny himself. It's no wonder why people in the show think he's a lunatic, because he constantly makes idiotic decisions and says things no sane person would take seriously. And for a superhero, he certainly hasn't been very heroic so far. None of the other characters are particularly likable or interesting either, except for Harold who has charisma and personality, which the other characters sorely lack. When it isn't being contrived the show is extremely dull with poor excuses for fights that leave no impression and drawn-out sequences that go nowhere and make the episodes feel longer than they already are. It's really hard to believe that the show is as ill-conceived as it is.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on March 17, 2017, 07:15:58 PM
I don't quite agree with that being its problem. The thing is, we've already seen lots of this mysticism and such in Daredevil season two with the Nobu arc, and that took itself very seriously as well but wasn't laughably bad at all. I'll grant you that it has a bit of a mixed tone that constantly flip-flops since some actors seem to be playing it straight while others ham it up to the extreme, but at least so far thst hasn't been too out of the ordinary for this genre. The CW DC shows tend to do that a lot more, actually, and those are part of their charm.

The problem with Iron Fist, at least in my eyes (based only on the first two episodes, to be fair), is on two fronts. One is that it takes way too long to get to the point of anything. For example, everything that happened in the first episode could have easily been covered in twenty minutes, and it's pretty clear to see where the story is going, leading to frustrating segments where you know exactly what will happen and there is nothing of interest to distract you from the predictability aside from the occasional fight scene (and that wire-fu is hilariously bad every time Danny has to do any parkour or acrobatic jump). The other, and arguably bigger issue is the writing. Specifically the dialogue. Let's just say that this is a show that most definitely could have used the Joss Whedon touch, because holy fuck are these some of the most stilted and over-expository lines that I've ever seen in a show.

Despite that I kind of find myself able to continue the show as a guilty pleasure of sorts if only because I think some of the idiotic writing is actually unintentionally entertaining in the same sort of way that a show like Dexter was.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: LumRanmaYasha on March 17, 2017, 07:31:58 PM
I wasn't referring to the mysticism, but the plot of the show itself. How Danny tries to reconnect with Joy and Ward and their attempts to keep him out of the picture is ill-thought out and incredibly questionable. I get he's been away for a while and is out of touch with social norms, but did Danny seriously expect he could walk into a high-profile corporate building dressed the way he was and with no proof he is of who he says he is and convince Joy and Ward he's alive? He thought that admitting he broke into Joy's apartment and locked her dog in a closet was going to convince her he wasn't a psycho? Ward thought assassinating Danny was a smarter move than having him arrested when he had perfect grounds to because Danny literally put his life in danger when he almost drove the car off the roof? The writers thought the scene where Danny's mother flies out a hole on the roof of the plane looked anything but hilarious? That's the stuff I can't take seriously.

But yeah, the show is tediously slow and the dialogue is painfully basic. With the exception of Harold, who can be fun in his aloofness, everyone else is written as their archetype and feel like nothing more. It doesn't help that the first three episodes are pretty much pointless since Danny gets his share of the company at the beginning of episode 4 and only then does the actual plot feel like it starts to start. They really could've abridged the first three episodes into one and had where episode 4 began be the beginning of the second episode.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on March 17, 2017, 08:48:43 PM
I wasn't referring to the mysticism, but the plot of the show itself. How Danny tries to reconnect with Joy and Ward and their attempts to keep him out of the picture is ill-thought out and incredibly questionable. I get he's been away for a while and is out of touch with social norms, but did Danny seriously expect he could walk into a high-profile corporate building dressed the way he was and with no proof he is of who he says he is and convince Joy and Ward he's alive? He thought that admitting he broke into Joy's apartment and locked her dog in a closet was going to convince her he wasn't a psycho? Ward thought assassinating Danny was a smarter move than having him arrested when he had perfect grounds to because Danny literally put his life in danger when he almost drove the car off the roof? The writers thought the scene where Danny's mother flies out a hole on the roof of the plane looked anything but hilarious? That's the stuff I can't take seriously.

Quite frankly, there wasn't even enough plot from what I saw for their to be that much in the way of story issues from the first two episodes of the show. But as for the points that you mentioned, I believe you already kind of explained the first question that you brought up. He's been away from social norms for the majority of his life, and he was only ten when he left that society, so of course he's completely oblivious to the fact that people won't trust who he is simply because he says the truth. And yes, his attempts to get them to believe him come off as idiotic and creepy, but once again, this guy was raised by both an ancient and literally other-worldly place for most of his memory. They make it a clear point that he doesn't think like normal people do. I do agree with the point that you mentioned about the Mitchum's stupid attempts to eliminate Danny, but I chalk that up more to bad character writing, myself.

And don't get me wrong, I'm not defending the show, and wouldn't be surprised to see it succumb to bad plotting the further that I get into it given that these are the same people behind a show like Dexter which was full of that particular issue. I'm just chalking its problems from the two episodes that I've watched up to writing more than anything else, with the key difference between writing issues and story issues being that the latter has to do with the overall picture being overly inconsistent and not adding up or making a whole lot of sense, while the former is the specific issues of things like character motivations not making sense of overly idiotic and contrived ways of certain events that unfold in-between major story points, or as I elaborated on earlier, that dialogue.

Quote
With the exception of Harold, who can be fun in his aloofness, everyone else is written as their archetype and feel like nothing more. It doesn't help that the first three episodes are pretty much pointless since Danny gets his share of the company at the beginning of episode 4 and only then does the actual plot feel like it starts to start. They really could've abridged the first three episodes into one and had where episode 4 began be the beginning of the second episode.

No joke: Harold and that intern kid are my favorite characters from this show so far. They are so laughably goofy that they just chew up the scenery where they are present in all of the delightfully wrong ways. That conversation that he has with his son in episode two when discussing what to do with Danny is hilarious. It's clearly supposed to be taken as him seeing the bigger picture and his son being the close-minded nitwit, but it comes off as Harold being a delusional mental case whereas his son is son has a "I have no idea what the fuck is even going on right now" sort of look on his face. If the rest of this show was better written I'd chalk it up to clever humor, but as it stands it's clearly more of that unintentionally funny writing that actually kind of makes the show not boring to watch when it isn't completely dragging out the story.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Peanutbutter on March 17, 2017, 09:24:28 PM
I finished the pilot just now. Some of the dialogue is a bit basic, but I haven't any problems with Danny. Being away for so long since being a kid explains why he thought he could return as if it were nothing. I didn't find Joy or Ward boring. In fact I enjoyed Ward's scene with his dad near the end. That was the best part of the episode.


The only thing "laughably bad" to me was Danny's Mandarin and car jump. Both of those were goofy, but they didn't take me out of the story. I severely disagree with Danny's mom getting sucked out somehow being funny. The real problem in that part was the bad line reading by the dude playing his dad. That aside, the pacing of the pilot was good. Each scene flowed right into the next and nothing felt dragged out. I am very surprised to be in the minority on this.



I'm definitely going to watch more. From what I've heard the show gets really good after episode 6. I don't think this had any bigger flaws than DD's first season.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: LumRanmaYasha on March 17, 2017, 10:07:31 PM

Quite frankly, there wasn't even enough plot from what I saw for their to be that much in the way of story issues from the first two episodes of the show. But as for the points that you mentioned, I believe you already kind of explained the first question that you brought up. He's been away from social norms for the majority of his life, and he was only ten when he left that society, so of course he's completely oblivious to the fact that people won't trust who he is simply because he says the truth. And yes, his attempts to get them to believe him come off as idiotic and creepy, but once again, this guy was raised by both an ancient and literally other-worldly place for most of his memory. They make it a clear point that he doesn't think like normal people do. I do agree with the point that you mentioned about the Mitchum's stupid attempts to eliminate Danny, but I chalk that up more to bad character writing, myself.

And don't get me wrong, I'm not defending the show, and wouldn't be surprised to see it succumb to bad plotting the further that I get into it given that these are the same people behind a show like Dexter which was full of that particular issue. I'm just chalking its problems from the two episodes that I've watched up to writing more than anything else, with the key difference between writing issues and story issues being that the latter has to do with the overall picture being overly inconsistent and not adding up or making a whole lot of sense, while the former is the specific issues of things like character motivations not making sense of overly idiotic and contrived ways of certain events that unfold in-between major story points, or as I elaborated on earlier, that dialogue.

That's a fair distinction to make. But we can both agree the character writing is bad, and I personally can't take Danny as a character seriously because even though I understand why he might be acting the way he does he's still behaving like an idiot and I don't find any reason to actually like him or sympathize with his plight. If the show had started with him performing some act of heroism, at least then it would give a sense of why Danny's worth rooting for. But all we have to go on in the first couple of episodes is that his parents died when he was a kid and he's trying to reconnect with his past and he has to defeat The Hand for... reasons. I'm just not sure why I'm supposed to care about him when all he's done so far in the show is endanger the people around him and makes bad decisions that only make him seem more like an irrational psychopath.

Quote
No joke: Harold and that intern kid are my favorite characters from this show so far. They are so laughably goofy that they just chew up the scenery where they are present in all of the delightfully wrong ways. That conversation that he has with his son in episode two when discussing what to do with Danny is hilarious. It's clearly supposed to be taken as him seeing the bigger picture and his son being the close-minded nitwit, but it comes off as Harold being a delusional mental case whereas his son is son has a "I have no idea what the fuck is even going on right now" sort of look on his face. If the rest of this show was better written I'd chalk it up to clever humor, but as it stands it's clearly more of that unintentionally funny writing that actually kind of makes the show not boring to watch when it isn't completely dragging out the story.

The show clearly wants us to think of Harold as eccentric but well-intentioned, at least from how far I've gotten, but like you said, he's amusing because of how random his thought process is and how hillariously passive aggressive he is to Ward, who - stupid decisions to off Danny aside - at this point I'm honestly sympathizing with as the most rational-minded person in the show.

I severely disagree with Danny's mom getting sucked out somehow being funny.

It came out of nowhere and looked goofy, as if she was being pulled up through the holes by wires. I was watching this with Vlord and a friend and all three of us laughed out loud. All I can say is that if I was supposed to feel sad about Danny's mom dying, there were way better ways to shoot and execute that scene more effectively.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on March 17, 2017, 10:27:06 PM
DD's first season was the best season of any of these shows so far.

I haven't watched this yet, but I've been rapidly losing my interest in these as they go along. JJ was filled with characters I hated and some strange leaps of logic, and Luke Cage had all kinds of pacing problems and an ending that just made me shrug. At this point I'm wondering if I'll even bother with the Defenders. DD is the only one I've legit liked all the way through.

And having to wait until 2018 to see what I really want to see isn't making me want to bother checking any of these out either.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on March 17, 2017, 10:28:05 PM
For what it's worth, one thing that I will say in defense of the show is that all of the racial controversy about it is fucking stupid. The show has plenty of issues, but that certainly doesn't strike me as one.

I especially have to laugh at how some reviewers call it white-washing (despite the fact that Danny is caucasian in the comic books) to be displayed as a martial arts master instead of an Asian person. For one thing, that criticism is itself in incredibly ironic racial stereotype, as there are a number of individuals of non-Asian descent who have studied and mastered various forms of martial arts not indigenous to their regions, but secondly is that the idea that a martial arts master has to be Asian is in itself in insane ratisl stereotype. I can't stand the insinuation that shows like Jessica Jones and Luke Cage were better simply because they didn't feature a white male as a protagonist. Those shows were better because of good writing, directing, and acting. Not because of the gender or race of their leads.

And I'll also throw a bone to Finn Jones. Quite frankly I believe that the critics are giving him way more flak than he deserves. While I'm not too keen on the Danny Rand character from the first few episodes that I've seen, I don't see it as him turning it a bad performanceor him not being a fit for the character. The problem is the weak material that he has to work with. And the reason I say this is because, for all of the bad parts about this show (and there are a lot), there are some legitimately good moments. I think that the plot about him teaming up with Hogarth to legally regain his company is legitimately well done and contains some of the better acted scenes in this show, and particularly the parts where he explains the philosophy which he holds on things involving martial arts and his roots in Kun-Lun are some of the more interesting aspects of this show, and he does actually sell me on the character in those moments. Had the show been focusing more on those elements, it could have been a much better product, IMO. As it stands it currently stands it's like an unintentionally funny dramedy with some cool martial arts mixed in. Not a good product, but at least somewhat entertaining as a time-waster.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on March 17, 2017, 10:30:07 PM
For what it's worth, one thing that I will say in defense of the show is that all of the racial controversy about it is fucking stupid. The show has plenty of issues, but that certainly doesn't strike me as one.

I especially have to laugh at how some reviewers call it white-washing (despite the fact that Danny is caucasian in the comic books) to be displayed as a martial arts master instead of an Asian person. For one thing, that criticism is itself in incredibly ironic racial stereotype, as there are a number of individuals of non-Asian descent who have studied and mastered various forms of martial arts not indigenous to their regions, but secondly is that the idea that a martial arts master has to be Asian is in itself in insane ratisl stereotype. I can't stand the insinuation that shows like Jessica Jones and Luke Cage were better simply because they didn't feature a white male as a protagonist. Those shows were better because of good writing, directing, and acting. Not because of the gender or race of their leads.

And I'll also throw a bone to Finn Jones. Quite frankly I believe that the critics are giving him way more flak than he deserves. While I'm not too keen on the Danny Rand character from the first few episodes that I've seen, I don't see it as him turning it a bad performanceor him not being a fit for the character. The problem is the weak material that he has to work with. And the reason I say this is because, for all of the bad parts about this show (and there are a lot), there are some legitimately good moments. I think that the plot about him teaming up with Hogarth to legally regain his company is legitimately well done and contains some of the better acted scenes in this show, and particularly the parts where he explains the philosophy which he holds on things involving martial arts and his roots in Kun-Lun are some of the more interesting aspects of this show, and he does actually sell me on the character in those moments. Had the show been focusing more on those elements, it could have been a much better product, IMO. As it stands it currently stands it's like an unintentionally funny dramedy with some cool martial arts mixed in. Not a good product, but at least somewhat entertaining as a time-waster.
So, you're saying it's basically a martial arts b-movie?
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on March 17, 2017, 10:38:49 PM
As to Spark's post, while I agree that Daredevil is easily my favorite of these shows, I disagree about JJ and LC being weak shows. I legitimately found JJ to be great. It had issues, but I still came out of it pretty impressed. I agree that LC has some serious pacing issues, but it had a good deal of emotional weight to its characters to carry me through the experience.

And I'm kind of surprised that I'm apparently the only person on this board looking forward to The Defenders. While I agree that I'm much more excited for a third season of Daredevil, I really do legitimately want to see these characters cross over and play off of each other. I can manage to wait an extra year to see more DD. It's getting rather annoying to see The Defenders written off as worthless just because it doesn't fit evey person's personal little idea of what THEY think is best for the Marvel Netflix-verse.

Honestly, even with the relatively poor quality of Iron Fist, I'm still excited for The Defenders because I love these street level heroes and their very personal conflicts, and moreso than even The Avengers I feel that it'll be really interesting to see these individual chsracters clash and interact with one another. But I suppose that makes me the weird one out in this case.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on March 17, 2017, 10:42:36 PM
So, you're saying it's basically a martial arts b-movie?

Pretty much. I mean, it's no Ong-Bak, but it's more entertaining than say a crappy DTV 80's American martial arts flick.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on March 17, 2017, 10:50:59 PM
I'm mostly overexaggerating. I actually did like Luke Cage outside of those things. I didn't think it was amazing, but I did enjoy it.

And, sure The Defenders as a team up sounds pretty cool on paper. I guess I'm just skeptical about it since the only one of these series I devoured was Daredevil (yes, including season 2. I liked the Hand stuff a lot) and hearing it passed over for another year just made me a bit irritated, I suppose. At the very least he will be in The Defenders with the other characters (Will actually be glad to see Luke Cage again, honestly) so at least there's that.

In the future, however, I think they should merge some of these shows to both save on available Netflix slots and to avoid pacing issues by having more centralized focus on characters. Luke Cage and Iron Fist really should be Heroes For Hire next.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Avaitor on March 17, 2017, 11:07:25 PM
I think that JJ is my favorite of the shows thus far, but aside from Trish, I didn't like the supporting cast all that much. It was all about Jessica and Killgrave to me. And my big problem with Luke Cage, honestly, was Diamondback. The show brought a good amount of intriguing villains to the table, and was giving us something truly promising with Cottonmouth, and while I think what happened to him was a good twist, they ultimately spent too much time on by far the least interesting antagonist.

I'd say that the first season of Daredevil is probably the most consistent of them all so far, but at the same time, I think that I prefer the best parts of JJ and LC to it. And while I didn't like Elektra, the Hand, or Matt and Karen's relationship material in S2, I was all for the Punisher's stuff, even as someone who's never been a big fan of his character.

I'm going to check out Iron Fist later tonight, but I don't have high expectations. But I shouldn't say anything before I try it out.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Insomniac on March 17, 2017, 11:19:54 PM
Jessica Jones was interesting, even if they did the "Jessica captures Kilgrave only for him to get away because of reasons" plot one too many times. And her neighbor Robin was the worst. Any scene she was in made an episode feel like hours. I didn't hate any of Luke Cage's cast, but I do agree that Diamondback was a poor successor for Cottonmouth. We get this cruel criminal overlord who also has a code and moral values that puts him at odds with his position in the game, and he gets replaced by Luke's comically evil half-brother who's secretly responsible for everything bad in his life?

It's the same issue I've had with other Netflix shows like Stranger Things. They often don't have enough plot to fill their season, and since they're too serialized to utilize standalone episodes, they often give some bland at best annoying at worst character their own arc to fill another two or three episodes' worth of script. And while this at least gives even the minor characters something to do, it usually leads to unwatchable moments like Foggy just being such a jackass to Matt for the whole second season of Daredevil, or anytime Steve and his jock friends showed up in Stranger Things.

And speaking of Iron Fist's "whitewashing", I found another one of the people complaining, and they're seething with rage over how Charlie Cox isn't actually a blind guy (https://twitter.com/MsJayTeeRattray/status/842803225866723328). As well as accusing Supergirl of being ableist, racist, and misogynist for some reason. I wonder if these same people have freakouts because Patrick Stewart isn't disabled, or how Robert Downey Jr doesn't actually have shrapnel in his chest. With this along with that one Twitter who screamed at Finn Jones, these guys really need to cut it out with these Chris-chan level outrages over superhero shows. It's almost as bad as those tumblr users who ganged up on the kid who plays Will Byers in ST because he wasn't gay.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Avaitor on March 18, 2017, 12:37:04 PM
Yikes. People are fascinating.

Well, I watched the first episode and a quarter-ish last night. The connection went out during the second episode, but I wasn't feeling attached enough to it to give it another shot (it was also almost 5 am). It also looked like it was going into that tired "is the person in the asylum REALLY crazy" trope that shows have been doing forever, which even Legion didn't really nail when it tackled that this week.

I don't think this is the worst thing I've seen or even laughably bad, but... yeah, this is kind of dumb, and the weakest MCU Netflix show to date from even the little that I've seen. I'll get to more later tonight, and see if I feel anything different.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on March 18, 2017, 12:54:05 PM
For what it's worth, I'm up to episode six and while this show is by far the weakest one and riddled with issues, there have been more genuinely good things about it past the first 3 episodes (which, as Lum said, really could have just been condensed into one), and while I'm either annoyed or board by some sub-plots, the main story-line actually has some decent weight to it, IMO. Episode 6 in particular was really enjoyable as an homage to classic martial arts flicks like Game of Death. The writing and acting are still really clumsy, but when the show focuses on the elements of the Iron Fist mythology and that classic martial arts film mentality, it becomes genuinely more enjoyable, IMO.

So while I definitely agree with most people that it's not a very good show, I'm actually regretting calling it a train-wreck before seeing enough of it, because it's not nearly as atrocious as the RT score is suggesting that it is.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Peanutbutter on March 18, 2017, 07:51:03 PM
For what it's worth, I'm up to episode six and while this show is by far the weakest one and riddled with issues, there have been more genuinely good things about it past the first 3 episodes (which, as Lum said, really could have just been condensed into one), and while I'm either annoyed or board by some sub-plots, the main story-line actually has some decent weight to it, IMO. Episode 6 in particular was really enjoyable as an homage to classic martial arts flicks like Game of Death. The writing and acting are still really clumsy, but when the show focuses on the elements of the Iron Fist mythology and that classic martial arts film mentality, it becomes genuinely more enjoyable, IMO.

So while I definitely agree with most people that it's not a very good show, I'm actually regretting calling it a train-wreck before seeing enough of it, because it's not nearly as atrocious as the RT score is suggesting that it is.


So what I heard was right? Awesome! Unfortunately, I've gotten a bit busy with family related stuff so it might be tomorrow before I can watch more episodes. Can't wait to see them later!
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on March 19, 2017, 12:12:19 AM
Well, that's not exactly what I meant. I don't agree with the assessment that this show suddenly gets good after a certain episode. More so, it's that the first three episodes are brutally slow and messy in terms of writing. The other episodes are as well. It's just that when the main plot starts there are some genuinely good moments and developments in the story amidst all of the poorly handled material. That said, the bad stuff still outweighs the good stuff, IMO. I just wouldn't go as far as to say that it's a complete train-wreck is all. On the whole it's more just a standard-quality Network show than the level of quality that we've come to expect from the other Netflix Marvel shows.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Insomniac on March 19, 2017, 03:13:59 AM
Watched the first two episodes, and it was just this 2-hour interval where I alternated between getting ridiculously bored or laughing my ass off. Like the scene where Joy found out who Danny was because she gave him an envelope of M&Ms. Or how Danny decided the best way to prove he wasn't crazy was telling a doctor how he went to another dimension through China and was taught under warrior monks. The cast also had this weird lack of disbelief suspension, given they're living in the Marvel cinematic universe. Everyone's so skeptical about Danny being back even though it should be far from the weirdest event to occur in their lives, but I suppose Danny's bright idea to break into Joy's house and lock her dog up didn't help his case at all. Except maybe Colleen, none of the cast really grabbed onto me in terms of personality or charisma, but the worst of all was Ward. Ward just reminds me of a Disney Channel sitcom antagonist, to the point where he even pauses his dialogue on occasion as if a laugh track were supposed to play. He was just such a cunt in those two episodes. Not as bad as Robin, but I don't imagine watching more of the show if it means he's still a main presence throughout. Bringing up Dexter again, he was like Quinn. And nobody should ever possibly think of making a character like Quinn again.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on March 19, 2017, 11:04:15 AM
You haven't seen anything yet. Wait until the episodes that tackle Ward's drug addiction. His acting is hilarious.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Avaitor on March 19, 2017, 11:29:14 AM
I'm on episode 5, and between this and what I've heard of the later Dexter episodes, I seriously think that the showrunner doesn't know how regular people act.

Then I looked up and saw that he wrote the dog episode of Six Feet Under, and now I know that he's strongly disconnected from reality.

So between him, Jeph Loeb's continued involvement on it, and its likely ties to AOS, I think that I'm going to sit out Inhumans on ABC.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on March 19, 2017, 01:17:41 PM
Oh boy....so, do you guys remember back when Diamondback replaced Cotton Mouth as the main antagonist in Luke Cage and he was a far less interesting villain? Well, Iron Fist does something similar, except Madam Gao (who is legitimately one of the few interesting characters in this show) takes a backseat to Bukudo, and let's just say that this is one of the most over-the-top, hilariously bad performances that I've seen from any piece of media in a long time. Compared to this guy I could almost even take Harold seriously. It's that ridiculous.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on March 19, 2017, 05:10:58 PM
Well, just finished the season. Wow, now that was a mess. I'll stand by my comments saying that there were aspects of the show that I genuinely enjoyed in-between, but overall it was marred by really bad writing.

I have to say, though, the biggest overall issue that I had with this show was a serious lack of any character to feel any sympathy for or relate to. Particularly Danny himself had absolutely no character arc whatsoever. His stupidity and naivety in the beginning of the series could be justified by him slowly maturing from his child-like mentality over the course of the season, but he learns absolutely nothing by the end, and completely justifies all of the negative things that people say about him over the course of the series. When the last thing that Clair, an ally to him and the other Defenders, says to him that he's pretty fucked up and needs psychological help, and the line is actually completely justified in an unironic way, then you know that the writers has tremendously screwed up at trying to convey their hero as an actual hero. Matt, Jessica, and Luke all have their personal flaws and inner demons, and none of them are perfect, but that strengthens the relatability of these characters as they are constantly trying to do the right thing, and over time learn ways to improve themselves. Essentially, you see the hero within each of them emerging over time. In comparison, Danny is just an ignorant ass-hole from the beginning to the end. He's just flat-out unlikable with few, if any, redeeming qualities.

The thing is, all of the Marvel Netflix shows have writing and pacing issues. However it's compelling characters that pulled us through those. Iron Fist has no main lead that I really care about, making it much harder to ignore the writing flaws like I could for the other shows, and making my entertainment value that I got out of the show come from unintentionally funny villains and absurdly atrocious dialogue at times.

For what it's worth, the character is still getting a second chance with the Defenders, which has a different showrunner, so I genuinely hope that it works out with better overall material to present us with, but at this rate I wouldn't be surprised if Marvel just writes the character out after The Defenders.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Insomniac on March 20, 2017, 01:50:37 AM
What is this tweet talking about? (https://twitter.com/sam_kriss/status/843247319856414721) One of the reasons why those first two episodes of Iron Fist were such a bore was because they didn't have enough ninjas for me. This jackass thinks he's too good to watch goofy ninja fights?
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Avaitor on March 21, 2017, 12:02:09 PM
I still wouldn't really call it a good show, and Danny's still a bad character, but I do think that the series works a little better when it revolves around him, Colleen, and Claire. The latter two are actual characters with some sense of logic (still sticking around Danny aside), and they have their moments.

But I can't stand Joy and especially Ward. The latter's drug subplot is hilariously terrible.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Avaitor on March 22, 2017, 04:21:19 PM
I finished this last night, and I can say that unlike AOS, the ingredients for a good show are there. While Danny and the Meachums are broken characters with weak actors, there's something in each of them that, with some fine-tweaking, could be made into better characters. A better show runner would definitely help.

But as is, this isn't a good show. I can see if you like the show if you like to play contrarian for some reason, but on its own, yikes.

And if you're skipping the show, check this out (http://uproxx.com/tv/iron-fist-defenders-guide/).
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Insomniac on March 23, 2017, 09:46:59 AM
On good Marvel show news, we finally have a confirmation that Legion's dad is Charles. And that the Shadow King is after them.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on March 25, 2017, 10:43:46 PM
Just started episode 9.
Spoiler
NO FUCKING WAY!! THERE IS NO REASONABLE REASON THAT HE HAS HIS FINGERS BACK! I call bullshit.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on March 25, 2017, 11:34:40 PM
Actually, severed fingers can be reattached if the operation is performed within a limited amount of time after they were cut off. The process is called replantation, and it has been around for quite a while.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on March 26, 2017, 09:47:28 PM
Spoiler
I'm not even sure where to start and I'm sure I'll forgot some thing I've been wanting to say. I will say that I don't think this show is bad even though I thought about giving up watching it a time or two. It was kind of fascinating to me for some reason. Anyway, I do like Finn Jones as Iron Fist, he just didn't have the best writing to work with. Also, I was going to say that Joy was less likable than her brother, who I kind of like, but the ending makes that go without saying. Also, what were the writers thinking by making her a villain? Her brother killed her father..again and she already knew he couldn't be trusted. Yet him dying...again, put her over the edge to set up a plan to kill her friend. I hope she dies a few episodes in during Season 2, if that season even ever happens. I also thought how they put Colleen in Danny's life was badly done (him bugging her to let him do lessons) and Claire because spouting lines she should have said, like when she comforted him on the plane while Wing did nothing. And how Claire showed up out of nowhere being trained by Colleen was forced. Of course I like her and I like Wing so this doesn't really matter. I thought it was dull that they made Harold the main villain. They gave him way too much screentime. I really liked Madame Gao. Too bad lowrent villains got in the way of her shining. Also, Danny is kind of a dumbass and so is Wing. They got so easily manipulated by Gao that it is not even funny. They literally were getting headaches from what she was saying and ended up doing some things she wanted them to do. I don't mind a villain that's smarter than the heroes but not when the heroes just look stupid a lot of the time.
Also, how about that RZA episode? The one with The Thunderer narrating and Danny fighting The Hand in that tournament. Easily the best part of the show. I wish the series was just Danny running around beating up The Hand. That would have been better than him whining about his parents. Also, they need to get RZA to do much more episodes. I am happy to see that he is a good director.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on March 26, 2017, 09:48:27 PM
Actually, severed fingers can be reattached if the operation is performed within a limited amount of time after they were cut off. The process is called replantation, and it has been around for quite a while.
Spoiler
So Harold performed surgery on himself while dead in a river?
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on March 26, 2017, 09:52:49 PM
Jessica Jones was interesting, even if they did the "Jessica captures Kilgrave only for him to get away because of reasons" plot one too many times. And her neighbor Robin was the worst. Any scene she was in made an episode feel like hours. I didn't hate any of Luke Cage's cast, but I do agree that Diamondback was a poor successor for Cottonmouth. We get this cruel criminal overlord who also has a code and moral values that puts him at odds with his position in the game, and he gets replaced by Luke's comically evil half-brother who's secretly responsible for everything bad in his life?
Honestly, it is safe to say that Robin is the worst thing out of any of the Marvel Netflix series.
Watched the first two episodes, and it was just this 2-hour interval where I alternated between getting ridiculously bored or laughing my ass off. Like the scene where Joy found out who Danny was because she gave him an envelope of M&Ms. Or how Danny decided the best way to prove he wasn't crazy was telling a doctor how he went to another dimension through China and was taught under warrior monks. The cast also had this weird lack of disbelief suspension, given they're living in the Marvel cinematic universe. Everyone's so skeptical about Danny being back even though it should be far from the weirdest event to occur in their lives, but I suppose Danny's bright idea to break into Joy's house and lock her dog up didn't help his case at all. Except maybe Colleen, none of the cast really grabbed onto me in terms of personality or charisma, but the worst of all was Ward. Ward just reminds me of a Disney Channel sitcom antagonist, to the point where he even pauses his dialogue on occasion as if a laugh track were supposed to play. He was just such a cunt in those two episodes. Not as bad as Robin, but I don't imagine watching more of the show if it means he's still a main presence throughout. Bringing up Dexter again, he was like Quinn. And nobody should ever possibly think of making a character like Quinn again.
:D :D :D Oh yeah!
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on March 26, 2017, 10:54:28 PM
Actually, severed fingers can be reattached if the operation is performed within a limited amount of time after they were cut off. The process is called replantation, and it has been around for quite a while.
Spoiler
So Harold performed surgery on himself while dead in a river?

I thought that he got his fingers reattached before he got killed off for the first time. In all honesty though I can't remember the specific details of what happened at what specific time. All your post mentioned was that you didn't believe it was possible for his fingers to be reattached and I was only pointing out that such a thing does exist in real life, without regard to how it happens in the context of the show, which quite frankly I don't care enough about to recall the specifics of those details.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Insomniac on April 03, 2017, 05:58:02 PM
Here's a review saying that Iron Fist champions the contradictions of capitalism, fights against the "rejectamenta of modern society", and is mere one chapter in the "fascist opera of our time" that is the Marvel Cinematic Universe. (https://thebaffler.com/latest/iron-fist-kriss)
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Insomniac on April 10, 2017, 03:07:04 AM
Watched the third episode of Iron Fist, and I'm still confused by Finn Jones being cast as Danny. Marvel could have cast an actor who was Asian to win easy progressive points, an actor who looked exactly like Danny Rand in the comics to appeal to the fans, or someone who was skilled at martial arts so at least he would be entertaining to watch. They did none of the above, resulting in a choice that appeals to nobody. Finn isn't particularly good at making Danny seem like an interesting character. If anything, I feel bad for Joy because she's between an asshat of a brother and a crazy childhood friend.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on April 10, 2017, 08:12:13 AM
To be fair, the bad action scenes have more to do with the rushed production schedule of this show, with Finn Jones having well under an hour to rehearse his choreography before they began shooting. Charlie Cox also didn't know any martial arts going into Daredevil, but they had the appropriate amount of time to work on choreography and shooting the action scenes. The scheduling of Iron Fist's production was handled incredibly poorly, though, mostly due to all of the delays that it faced in production.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Insomniac on April 10, 2017, 09:07:14 PM
I can understand if there was too little time to rehearse, but there are Japanese children's shows that have less time than Iron Fist does in shooting fight scenes, and they somehow do it better. In the third episode, there was a fight that had thirty camera cuts in ten seconds, like a sequence from Taken 3. If you have that little time for choreography, it would've been better to hire an actor who already knew martial arts so he could naturally slip into the scene rather than require extra hours for training and rehearsing. You probably could have hired Steven Seagal of all people, and he would've done a more fluid fight scene.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on April 10, 2017, 09:41:56 PM
I can understand if there was too little time to rehearse, but there are Japanese children's shows that have less time than Iron Fist does in shooting fight scenes, and they somehow do it better. In the third episode, there was a fight that had thirty camera cuts in ten seconds, like a sequence from Taken 3. If you have that little time for choreography, it would've been better to hire an actor who already knew martial arts so he could naturally slip into the scene rather than require extra hours for training and rehearsing. You probably could have hired Steven Seagal of all people, and he would've done a more fluid fight scene.

Once again, to be fair, those Kamen Rider shows usually cast actors who are already at least somewhat trained in martial arts, or who have at least had experience with stage-fighting/choreography.

It would have been better off if they gave Finn Jones a costume, though. They could have given him a more practical design like they did for Daredevil in season one of that show. The reason being that it would make it easy to have a well-trained stunt double slip into his place for the action scenes. Of course, shooting a good action scene is a lot harder than just having a good martial artist or stunt man, though. I do wish that more people would truly appreciate the hard work, planning, rehearsal, training, and extensive repetition that goes into shooting the incredible fights in something like The Raid or John Wick, or even the hallway or staircase fights from Daredevil. People always seem to tend to take those for granted and have a "see, what's so hard about that, why doesn't every show meet that level of quality for action" mentality; when the point is that they went above and beyond what most other film-makers would do in order to make their action scenes so stand-out good in the first place.

Not that I'm excusing Iron Fist for its poor fights; don't get the wrong idea. It's essentially a martial arts action show made by people with no experience in that field and who also didn't take the proper amount of time to get it right like the crew for Daredevil did. That said, it was poor decision making on the part of the higher-up Marvel TV producers who hired the entirely wrong crew to make this show in the first place, IMO. While I can agree with criticizing Finn Jones for a poorly done job overall, I don't feel that it's fair to give him and him alone all the blame for everything wrong with Iron Fist as an overall production.

Regardless, though, I just wish people wouldn't brush it off when other productions do get their fights done well. Even those Japanese kids shows have tons of hard work put into them relative to the amount of time and budget that they have to work with, and the people working on them have years upon years of experience with this kind of material and how to choreograph and shoot it. That can't be taken for granted.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Avaitor on April 19, 2017, 03:42:58 PM
Here's who will be in the New Warriors show (http://uproxx.com/tv/marvel-new-warriors-series-cast/).

Getting Squirrel Girl in alone will make this a hit. I really enjoy what I've read of her.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Insomniac on April 19, 2017, 06:28:07 PM
Meanwhile, here's a trailer for Marvel's Z-list superhero duo that few people have a strong opinion one way or the other. (https://twitter.com/Marvel/status/854788218117607424)
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Avaitor on April 20, 2017, 01:13:30 AM
I've read one or two stories, and I think Cloak and Dagger are okay, but don't really stick out to me.

This looks fine, though. I could give it a shot.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Insomniac on May 03, 2017, 09:53:12 AM
What are we, some kind of Runaways trailer? (https://twitter.com/JackRicofficial/status/859771894932926466)
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Spark Of Spirit on May 03, 2017, 12:34:46 PM
Defenders trailer (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4h3m7B4v6Zc)

August 18th.

Here's hoping this is as good as the trailer looks.

EDIT: Okay, DD's showrunners (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Defenders_(miniseries)) are behind this. Now I'm hyped.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Insomniac on May 04, 2017, 09:57:55 AM
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/C-_ZagnXcAIN3Ue.jpg:large)

I already hate the Inhumans.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Peanutbutter on May 04, 2017, 11:52:12 AM
Defenders trailer (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4h3m7B4v6Zc)

August 18th.

Here's hoping this is as good as the trailer looks.

EDIT: Okay, DD's showrunners (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Defenders_(miniseries)) are behind this. Now I'm hyped.



Thank God. Still want to watch the rest of Iron Fist, but I'd still prefer the DD crew over IF's people in regards to the fight scenes.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on May 04, 2017, 01:45:45 PM
Is that the Bastard of the Dreadfort that I spot on the far right?

Between, this, Iron Fist, and the X-Men franchise, I'm starting to see a strange correlation between Marvel-licensed films/television and former or under-used Game of Thrones actors....or it could all just be a strange coincidence.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Avaitor on May 04, 2017, 06:06:18 PM
Yeah, I'm not watching Inhumans.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Insomniac on May 04, 2017, 06:27:30 PM
I'll watch at least one episode out of curiosity.

But it's bizarre how Marvel can't seem to realize when a bad idea's a bad idea. With Inhumans and HydraCap, they keep pushing that shit no matter how much the fans, critics, and people working on the MCU alike say they're sick of it. Marvel's had an entire year of fans telling them turning Captain America into a HYDRA agent is a bad idea. And instead of listening, they make a big event out of it.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on May 11, 2017, 07:58:13 PM
They are trying to top everything terrible about the 90s.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Insomniac on May 15, 2017, 10:48:53 AM
The trailer for the new X-Men show is out. (https://youtu.be/qTzW9rMcbzk) I guess people who thought Legion didn't have enough action scenes will be excited, but I'm not sure about this one.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Insomniac on June 12, 2017, 04:13:53 PM
(http://i.imgur.com/hyq98mK.jpg)

The only people in that picture who don't look like they hate being there are Daredevil and Quake.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Insomniac on August 19, 2017, 10:12:03 PM
So, does anybody else think Sigourney Weaver's character was wasted? I was hyped to see what the show would do with an actress like her, and just which Marvel villain she would play, only for her to play an original character who
Spoiler
gets killed by Elektra who takes her place.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on August 19, 2017, 10:19:30 PM
Yeah, I was expecting more from her but she suffers from the same problems that most MCU villains do. In the end she just felt more like an antagonist than an actual character. To be fair, though, this was really more about having an excuse for The Defenders to come together, but getting an actress as high-profile as Sigourney Weaver really raises one's expectations.

On the brighter side of things, I really did enjoy seeing the core characters interacting with each other. Danny Rand was certainly a lot more tolerable playing off of the other heroes, especially Luke Cage.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on August 21, 2017, 04:08:26 PM
The Defenders was pretty damn fun! My only complaints are Alexandra was just evil, humorless Hogarth and I can't wrap my head around what Electra's intentions were.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on August 21, 2017, 04:30:38 PM
To add to that, I'm also not a fan of how they continued Danny's streak of being a moron. Like, I know that they are only feeding into what everyone already thinks of him from season one of Iron Fist, but I'd like to instead see them try and improve the character by making him learn from past mistakes instead of subjecting us to more of his stupid shenanigans. Like, when he was fighting Elektra and she needed him to activate his Iron Fist in order to use it as a key and couldn't kill him until he did that, literally all he had to do was not summon his Chi. Hell, he didn't even have to fight her, but even if he did he could just stick to normal martial arts like he started out doing and not actually summon the power in his fist that she could use to potentially destroy all of New York City. Even if he was getting his ass kicked he still couldn't be killed by her since she needed him alive, and he could have simply stalled her until help arrived. But, nope, he's just got to be as rash as ever and activate the one thing that he has complete control over and can also be used by the villains to achieve their goal. It's the kind of stupid that's incredibly frustrating to deal with as a viewer as opposed to being part of a well-written character arc.

Gripes like that aside, though, this was a lot of fun. It's not as good of a first time team-up as The Avengers was, but it does showcase how well these characters and their actors can play off of one another. In that regard, we can wait a few years before the next season of Defenders, and in the meantime it would be cool if each of these characters could have guest appearances in each others' shows, like Matt Murdock dropping by in an episode of Jessica Jones to help her solve a case, or Danny Rand teaming up with Luke Cage on a certain mission that ends up being a neat little homage to Heroes for Hire. That would be pretty cool to see, and would be quite reminiscent of what one would expect from an actual comic book involving any of these characters.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Avaitor on August 21, 2017, 04:52:11 PM
The show is sounding good, but I've had no real desire to connect to Netflix here to check it out. I probably won't get to that until BoJack Horseman starts back up.

I do wish that they could have taken the chance to improve on Danny's character rather than doubling down his worst traits, though. That sounds frustrating, and will only make Iron Fist feel like less of an afterthought than it should be.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on August 21, 2017, 04:56:03 PM
For what it's worth, his interactions with Luke Cage in this season were legitimately fun moments, and temporarily made you forget how annoying he could be. It was like Danny was a completely different character in those scenes. As in, a character that you actually want to watch, instead of one who actively infuriates you.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Avaitor on August 21, 2017, 05:01:17 PM
That sounds good.

I think Iron Fist worked best somewhere around the middle-to-late portion of its run, when Colleen and Claire join and share good chemistry with each other. Danny worked a little better there as well, but it was their show IMO.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on August 21, 2017, 05:18:47 PM
Interestingly, Colleen featured a lot more prominently in this season than I expected. In fact, she arguably has the biggest role of any of the supporting characters, even more so than Claire, which took me by surprise. Thankfully, being arguably the only character from Iron Fist that worked, she wasn't a hindrance in this show.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Insomniac on August 21, 2017, 05:29:23 PM
Yeah, Colleen was definitely the Pink Ranger of the team.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on August 25, 2017, 08:31:57 PM
Checked out the first episode of Defenders. I enjoyed it, but I can't say it gripped me like the first episodes of Daredevil, Jessica Jones, or Luke Cage did (I know a lot of people weren't big on any of the premieres, but I really enjoyed them). The scenes with Jessica were great and despite dragging a bit at times I thought the scenes with Matt were too. Luke wasn't bad but I felt his scenes lacked some of the authenticity from his own series. Seems like I didn't miss much by skipping Iron Fist. The villain (whose name I do not know) already seems quite a bit weaker than Fisk, Kilgrave, Cottonmouth, Punisher, etc. but I'll wait and give her a chance. Overall, definitely interested in checking out the second episode tomorrow, but not quite as excited as I hoped I would be.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on September 20, 2017, 09:53:16 PM
Prepare to be Punished: https://youtu.be/lIY6zFL95hE

I'm not going to lie, the Marvel Netflix shows have undergone a serious downward spiral in quality by making the same mistakes as the Berlanti DC shows (ironically enough) by stretching their resources too thin and producing too many shows at once in close proximity to each other in favor of quantity over quality. While The Defenders isn't anywhere near as bad as Iron Fist, it still shows signs of being rushed in its production just so that Netflix could have their "Avengers" show without gradually building up to it and earning it like the movies did. It really shows with how sloppy the writing was and how much lower the quality felt than what we're used to seeing from the show runner of Daredevil. I wouldn't be surprised to learn that most of the issues from these later shows came from the creative development period of these shows being severely limited in order to meet a release deadline, as it's easier to believe that than something like the writers of a show like Daredevil suddenly sucking at what they've proven that they could do extremely well before.

That said, I also have to admit that The Punisher still has me at least somewhat interested since The Punisher arc from season two of Daredevil is easily the high point of the entire Netflix MCU, and this show has the benefit of having a mostly clean slate and being largely separate from the rest of the Marvel Netflix shows in terms of both its content and cast.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Insomniac on September 21, 2017, 09:18:58 AM
I'm interested in how it seems to be a mish-mash of several Punisher eras. Like it will apparently do some of the darker comics like The Slavers, but include Micro and the Frankmobile.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Avaitor on September 22, 2017, 12:08:11 AM
I don't know how well that'll work, but I'm still very curious.

I'll probably still be keeping up with the Netflix shows unless we get a couple more Iron Fists, anyway.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Insomniac on October 01, 2017, 01:36:58 AM
I watched the Inhumans pilot for a laugh, and my God, that was bad in every way possible. Lame music for the soundtrack, actors who look constipated in every scene (especially Black Bolt and Karnak), a villain who makes so much of a good case for why the Inhumans are shit that you're wondering why he's the villain, and the goofiest ways they showed off their powers. (https://youtu.be/nmzNKeEBaUY?t=74)

Ever since Marvel has pushed Inhumans as the new mutants, I keep thinking "Why?" People like the X-Men because they're misfit underdogs who are given shit by society, have powers that hinder their life as much as it helps, and have complex, troubled lives, yet they try their best to do good regardless. While the Inhumans are weird moon royalty who still believe in eugenics and slavery. Why would anyone root for people like that over the likes of Cyclops and Wolverine?
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Daikun on November 09, 2017, 07:03:25 PM
Marvel originals are moving from Netflix to Disney's new streaming platform. (http://www.slashfilm.com/no-more-new-marvel-netflix-shows)
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Rynnec on November 09, 2017, 09:27:00 PM
This won't end well
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on November 10, 2017, 12:02:07 AM
Marvel originals are moving from Netflix to Disney's new streaming platform. (http://www.slashfilm.com/no-more-new-marvel-netflix-shows)
Guess I'll just wait for the blu-ray releases from now on!
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Peanutbutter on November 10, 2017, 01:12:12 AM
Guess they're blaming Netflix for the huge box office drops they've all been getting, since blaming piracy didn't work out so well.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on November 11, 2017, 04:23:34 AM
Marvel originals are moving from Netflix to Disney's new streaming platform. (http://www.slashfilm.com/no-more-new-marvel-netflix-shows)
(https://i.ytimg.com/vi/Rhw2rxuRPco/hqdefault.jpg)I'm so happy that I abandoned ship.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on November 18, 2017, 11:45:38 PM
I just finished binge-watching The Punisher. The reviews on this one have been pretty lukewarm, and in general Marvel's Netflix output has been pretty disappointing this year with Iron Fist being a dud and The Defenders being underwhelming in its overall mediocrity.

That said, in all honesty I really loved The Punisher. I'm honestly a bit surprised that the reviews for it aren't better than just alright with the general consensus. It does have some issues, but it's the same issues that literally ALL of these shows have, which is mainly the pacing (they really don't have to be 13 episodes long per season). Even then, though, I rarely found myself bored with the show and the acting was on-point here whereas all of the other shows, even Daredevil, had at least a few over-the-top or outright bad performances.

And unlike Luke Cage this show didn't have a major drop-off in quality in its second half. I'd even argue that it properly built up to its climax AND delivered on it in a way that most of these shows fail to do. And props to it having a real actual ending. While it leaves the possibility open for another season, it also wraps up all of its loose-ends in a way that could also make this a strong stand-alone miniseries with a fully realized arc and resolution. None of this bull-shit set up for future seasons that are overly crammed into every other Marvel show.

This is honestly one of my favorite comic book shows. Not really sure what everybody else was watching.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on November 18, 2017, 11:59:14 PM
I'll have to check this one out. I skipped Iron Fist and I've been dragging on The Defenders but what you're saying piques my interest. :D I didn't think the second half of Luke Cage was particularly bad; definitely weaker than the first half, but it was still my favorite of the Marvel Netflix series so far even though I found Daredevil season 1 more consistent overall and Jessica Jones' conclusion more satisfying.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on November 19, 2017, 01:33:50 AM
The second half of Luke Cage is damn good, just not as great as the first half.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on November 19, 2017, 01:45:01 AM
The second half of Luke Cage is damn good, just not as great as the first half.
The main problem is that Cottonmouth was one of the most likable characters and best villains in the entire MCU while Diamondback was only marginally better than the movie villains. The stuff involving the protagonists remained just as good IMO, and I absolutely love that they made Wu-Tang Clan canonically part of the Marvel universe. :il_hahaha:
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Avaitor on November 19, 2017, 07:34:25 PM
It still bugs me that Cottonmouth was a terrific antagonist, Shades was doing a lot of the lifting in a cool, unique manner, and Mariah was building herself up to be a worthy adversary, but the show decided to focus on a villain as mediocre as Diamondback. If the show's priorities were in better place, the show could have been a lot better.

tbh though, I've never understood the argument that the MCU's TV shows are better than their films. The movies are traditionally a lot more consistent imo.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on November 19, 2017, 09:54:46 PM
That was just early hype from Daredevil and Jessica Jones being much better than expected. Both first seasons set a bar that none of the other shows/seasons could quite match (except for The Punisher, IMO).

They also happened to come out around the time that franchise fatigue was starting to set in for some people when it came to the MCU movies, so the new darker tone of the show was a breath of fresh air in a way that made them stand out more. Looking at it on the whole, though, the movies, while having a couple of duds in the mix, are generally a lot more consistent in quality.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on November 19, 2017, 11:26:58 PM
Honestly, I think Daredevil season 1, Jessica Jones, and Luke Cage are better than any of the MCU films I've seen except for maybe the first two Captain America films and Guardians of the Galaxy (still need to watch Vol. 2). But as a whole, are the shows better than the movies? After Iron Fist, Defenders, and especially Inhumans, I'd say definitely not.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Insomniac on November 20, 2017, 12:49:38 AM
Since Disney is taking all their Netflix shows and putting them on their own app, it leads to the amusing scenario of a small child playing on his iPad and accidentally clicking on The Punisher when they meant to search for Pixar films.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on November 20, 2017, 02:36:31 AM
Honestly, I think Daredevil season 1, Jessica Jones, and Luke Cage are better than any of the MCU films I've seen except for maybe the first two Captain America films and Guardians of the Galaxy (still need to watch Vol. 2). But as a whole, are the shows better than the movies? After Iron Fist, Defenders, and especially Inhumans, I'd say definitely not.
As someone who thinks Guardians 1 is laughably overrated, outside of having quite possibly the greatest climax ever, you gotta watch GOTG 2 dude.
I still stand by saying MCU's shows are better than their movies. I've missed Ant-Man, Ultron and haven't seen Ragnarok yet..damn, I watched more than I thought. Anyway, the tv shows only real hiccup is Iron Fist. While I don't think none of the movies are bad, there are a lot of disappointments...mostly Thor and Iron Man (even though I need to rewatch 3 without being distracted). While outside of Guardians 2 and what is my current favorite superhero movie, Winter Soldier, none of them have reached the highs I've gotten from Luke Cage, Daredevil, the first half of DD2 (probably my fav. part of any live action show) or The Defenders. Again, I need to do a lot of rewatching..which will probably mean me watching them on putlocker, but this is how I feel.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Insomniac on November 20, 2017, 02:58:58 AM
There are some parts of the MCU Netflix shows that the movies just can't outdo, like Wilson Fisk's arc, Jessica and Trish's relationship, the first half of Daredevil's second season, and Cottonmouth. But on the other side, the shows haven't yet accomplished that feel I got from watching Winter Soldier and Civil War.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Foggle on November 20, 2017, 03:00:01 PM
Yeah, the first half of DD season 2 is sooooo good. I kind of lost interest after that but the first half may be the best material the MCU has produced thus far. I will say that the Captain America films definitely have a unique and special feel to them that I don't think anything else in the MCU has captured, so I definitely agree there too.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on November 20, 2017, 03:18:31 PM
I liked Civil War when I first watched it, but as time has gone on I have developed a lot more issues with the movie. I still kind of enjoy it, but more so for certain scenes, characters, and aspects as opposed to the film as a whole. I also don't personally consider it to be a Captain America movie, no matter how Marvel wants to title it. If I'm to be honest, I kind of prefer Avengers: Age of Ultron, despite everyone giving that film way more shit.

The First Avenger on the other hand is an underrated tribute to golden age superhero tales and The Winter Soldier is one of my favorite comic book movies of all time, let alone the best MCU movie (IMO).

I'm also quite partial to Spider-Man: Homecoming. After re-watching it twice, I can say that it's actually a lot more well-constructed of a film than I initially realized (and I already liked it well enough on my first viewing). It also helps that Peter Parker/Spider-Man is a more naturally relatable character than most other comic book characters. I temporarily forgot about that with Sony's TASM films, but upon revisiting both this and the Raimi films, I was reminded of how compelling this character can be when done right. Also, it helps that this movie is basically a live-action take on TSSM (still my favorite super-hero related thing ever).

And yeah, The Punisher arc of Daredevil season 2 (the first four episodes in particular) is my favorite thing to come out of the entire MCU so far, period.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: gunswordfist on November 20, 2017, 05:16:37 PM
Yeah, the first half of DD season 2 is sooooo good. I kind of lost interest after that but the first half may be the best material the MCU has produced thus far. I will say that the Captain America films definitely have a unique and special feel to them that I don't think anything else in the MCU has captured, so I definitely agree there too.
I need to rewatch the Cap Trilogy. I still stand by loving The Winter Soldier for somehow surpassing the ludicrous hype I had for the film.
And yes, the first half of Daredevil S2 just might be that good. I don't think even John Woo's The Killer has pulled my heartstrings as hard as Jon's Punisher did, when it comes to badass characters.
Heh, I somehow forgot about Homecoming, you know, the last movie in theaters I've bothered watching. Everything else has been said so I'll just say that I love how tight the directing/camera work on that film is. Hell, it's my 2nd favorite MCU film. Probably current 1st since I owe TWS a rewatch just to be sure.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Avaitor on November 20, 2017, 07:58:20 PM
Yeah, I can't really argue about the first Punisher arc in DD season 2, or the high points of Jessica Jones and Luke Cage. But it's also hard to go against Winter Soldier or the first Guardians.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Insomniac on November 22, 2017, 02:50:51 AM
Watched the series premiere of Runaways. Parts of it are cool and feel like the comic, while other parts feel a little too ABC Family for my taste. Confused on what they're doing with Molly, since not only is she not a Mutant due to rights issues but
Spoiler
her parents are dead and Gert's parents adopted her.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on December 03, 2017, 05:42:58 PM
Since I've done it for the movies before, I figured that I'd quickly rank all of the Marvel Netflix shows from favorite to least favorite just based on my personal opinions right now:

1. Daredevil (Season 1)- This is still the bar by which all of these others shows are measured in terms of quality. It's not perfect, and it has its share of pacing issues like all the rest of these shows have, but it still genuinely holds up as good television.

2. The Punisher- I still insist that this one is a lot better than some people give it credit for. I love Jon Bernthal's portrayal of Frank Castle, and in terms of plotting, writing, acting, and directing, this is still the tightest season of any of these shows next to the first season of Daredevil, so far.

3. Jessica Jones- While it does have some bigger issues with pacing than the above two shows, the great moments present here really help it stand out. One thing I can definitely say about this one is that it manages to have highs without having any real lows. At worst it can just be kind of "meh" at times, but the high points really help bring you back into the experience.

4. Daredevil (Season 2)- As I've stated before, if we were to divide this up into arcs, The Punisher arc is so good that it's not only my favorite thing to come out of the Marvel Netflix TV shows, it's my favorite thing to come out of the entire MCU, period (yes, even above the first two Captain America films, which I have a strong personal love for). The rest of the season, however, is a mixed bag. I flat-out just don't like the Elektra, and I'm really not a fan of the actress portraying her in these shows. The final arc which sees Daredevil finally confront The Hand straight on has some good moments in it but also feels very victim to the MCU's bad tendency of trying to shoehorn in too much set-up into one story in order to set up another. I'd argue that this portion of Daredevil was an even worse offender of this trend than Avengers: Age of Ultron and Iron Man 2, which is really saying something in regards to the latter especially.

5. Luke Cage- I still maintain my opinion that the first half was excellent whereas the second half was a drop in quality. To be clear, I don't hate the second half, but I have more issues with it than just Diamondback being a weak villain. I also felt that the plot itself became less focused and more of a mess after the tightly paced and well-written first seven episodes.

6. The Defenders- After all of the build-up and hype for this, I think that everyone was really holding out hope for the Marvel Netflix shows to really come together and have their Avengers moment, and in all honesty we were really let down. On a surface level this is a perfectly competent show. However, beyond that, it never really rises above "just alright enough to not be bad." It's essentially high quality mediocrity, in that it's a show made by people talented enough to make good content, but only really succeeding at not making complete shit while not really doing anything to excel either. Even if these shows are supposed to be a bit darker and more down-to-earth and realistic than the movies, there still has to be an element of both high-stakes to incite the team-up, as well as some sort of feeling of grandeur to emphasize what a major event it is for these characters to be teaming up for the first time. Instead, what's supposed to be the biggest event in the MCU TV shows somehow feels like an even smaller deal than most of these shows do individually. For a point of comparison, while the CW DC shows aren't technically what you would call particularly great shows, if nothing else, they have a much firmer grasp on how to do an exciting and memorable crossover than this series. Basically, either go all-out, or don't even bother. That said, I still say that it would work much better if, just like in real comic books, we had characters from one-show crossover onto another for one or two episodes to establish that they inhabit the same Universe and occasionally work together, as opposed to just pretending that the other characters flat-out don't exist until the next season of The Defenders rolls around. Once again, even the CW DC shows at least get this much right.

7. Iron Fist- It's just not a very good show. For what it's worth, I'd still take even this dung-heap over Agents of SHIELD or Inhumans, but that's about the best thing that I can say about it, and it's not really much. I honestly don't have much to add beyond that. They're honestly better off just making Danny Rand a side character in the next season of Luke Cage (if they still intend to keep him around), than to give this show another full season. Essentially make him the MCU TV equivalent of what The Hulk is in the movies.
Title: Re: Marvel Live Action
Post by: Avaitor on December 09, 2017, 05:19:30 PM
1. Jessica Jones- I can't argue against the show's pacing issues, or its weak supporting cast. But this still resonates stronger for me than any of the other Netflix series. Besides how genuinely terrifying Kilgrave is, Jessica and Tish's friendship is easily among the strongest of the MCU, and the mystery direction works. And while the fight scenes are the least impressive here, I don't think that's a detriment, but rather fits with the story and characters. It might not be the strongest overall, but it's my personal favorite.

2- Daredevil season 1- Easily the most consistent season thus far, it did almost make #1, but I just really connected with JJ a bit more. But this is a tight super hero show that only occasionally got a little big for its britches. It's also anchored by a strong core cast, as Foggy and Karen work well with Matt early on, and Vincent D'Onofrio's Kingpin just about surpasses Michael Clarke Duncan's take on the character, which itself was easily the movie's strong suit.

3- The Punisher- I mostly enjoyed this one, aside from Madani being practically worthless. The action scenes were fresh and exciting, finally taking a break from the other shows constantly trying and failing to match that stairwell fight in Daredevil's second episode. Instead, we get some exciting shoot outs and some other brutal twists. It also helps that Jon Bernthal is fully committed to the character, and gets a great performance out of him. He also works well with Micro, and even Karen, who's less of a wet blanket here than she was in Daredevil's second season. I think of all the shows thus far, this is by far the most that I want more of, which speaks a lot to its quality.

4- Luke Cage- We've talked about what doesn't work about the series before, and there's not a big need to repeat most of that here. I think another problem that I had with the series is Luke himself; Mike Colter does well with action scenes, but when the show needs him to pick up big dramatic moments, he wasn't totally game for it, which especially becomes apparent with the wealth of talent in the cast. Besides that, I give it points for giving the most character to its location- I get a better feel for Luke's side of Harlem than I did for Hell's Kitchen, or pretty much any other MCU location aside from maybe Queens in Homecoming. And I am curious to see where they go with Mariah in season 2.

5- Daredevil season 2- I almost put this above Luke Cage for the first Punisher arc, which is absolutely wonderful. But I really do not like the show's take on Elektra or the Hand, which is a shame, since I really like her character in the comics. This is the second time she's been screwed over in media now. I also really got tired of Matt and Karen's bullshit, and I'm not sure if I'm looking forward to them having more scenes together in season 3.

6- The Defenders- I wasn't expecting the next Avengers, but I was hoping for something a little more notable. Or at least try to fix some of the flaws of certain characters, but the show only seemed to double down on Danny's stupidity and Elektra's annoyingness. When the heroes worked together, it could be entertaining, but on the whole, it's a strangely forgettable crossover.

7- Iron Fist- There were hints at a good show in the middle act, when Colleen and Claire showed surprisingly likable chemistry with each other. Davos was another decent addition, and I might like to see where his story goes in season 2. But Danny just fails every test of believability and likability, while the Meachums were no better. As annoying as the show got, I did think there was potential here, but Danny needs a serious overhaul, or these shows need more of a sense of humor to make it so we can laugh at him, not with.