Animation Revelation Forum

What are some of your favorites? Least favorites? Which ones have you actually beat? Let's discuss this time sink of a genre.

As for JRPGs, I've honestly never been able to get too into that genre, but the only 2 games that I completed more than half of within that genre are Final Fantasy IX and Chrono Trigger, and of those 2 I only ever managed to get close to the end of the latter.

As for WRPGs, I used to be big on the genre but after playing the overly-praised Oblivion I started to realize how long, tedious, and repetitive a lot RPGs were starting to feel to me. That said, there are some exceptions to the rule, and I'll honestly say that BioWare's KOTOR games are brilliant. The Star Wars license is irrelevant to their overall quality, as they simply just well-made adventure games with some RPG elements thrown in there (which is a good thing for me since I often feel like I'm playing and adventure game more than an RPG). I also really liked Jade Empire for what it was, and similarly to KOTOR if felt more like a good action and adventure game with the right amount of RPG elements thrown in there. I will say that I did indeed enjoy Mass Effect, but I also felt that it had a habit of being really dragged out at certain portions, and the side-quests were pretty boring for me. Also, I feel that people really overrated the game's story, as it didn't really get interesting at all until towards the end of the game. Still, it was a well-made experience for what it was. I still need to play Mass Effect 2, and I'm kind of interested in Borderlands now that it has probably come down in price.

Never been much of a JRPG man, really. Persona 2 and 3 (especially 2) are ace, though. Same with Valkyria Chronicles 1 and 2, Final Fantasy 4 and 6, and the Ys series. The Yakuza games are also fucking badass if you count those as RPGs.

On the other hand, I love my WRPGs. Deus Ex (first one is amazing, second one is eh, third one looks epic), Baldur's Gate series (the PC games AND the PS2 games), Diablo 1 and 2, Borderlands, The Witcher, Mass Effect 1 and 2, KOTOR 1 and 2, Fallout 2 and New Vegas (not a big fan of the other two), the Elder Scrolls series (never played Arena, though), the list goes on. Two Worlds 2 actually looks like it'll be pretty cool, surprisingly enough. I know a lot of people say it sucked, but I really want to play Alpha Protocol.

I pretty much hate all MMORPGs. Vindictus held my attention for all of 2 weeks: the longest I've ever been interested in a single MMO.

Quote from: Ensatsu-ken on January 25, 2011, 04:23:58 PM
Still, it was a well-made experience for what it was. I still need to play Mass Effect 2, and I'm kind of interested in Borderlands now that it has probably come down in price.

Borderlands GOTY Edition (which contains all the DLCs on the disc except for the newest one, which is a download voucher) is $30 new last time I checked. I, personally, love the single-player, but I know a lot of people don't (and co-op IS better). If you have a friend to play it with, pick it up for sure (it supports both online and split-screen).

You know, while I have never been big on WRPGs, I fucking LOVE loot whore games. PSO, Diablo, Borderlands... Especially if it has randomized levels and multiplayer. I'm not quite sure why, but dungeon crawling while getting cool loot and also doing it with some friends is just awesome.

There really aren't enough of those games out there.

There really aren't. Loot whore RPGs are the best kind, IMO.

I enjoy pretty much anything by Bioware that I've ever played. One of the many reasons I envy you 360 people is that you get Mass Effect and Wii don't.

I'm also partial to Chrono Trigger and a couple of older Final Fantasys.

I'm more of a fan of Pokémon, & Dragon Quest series. Persona 4 is growing on me, whenever I get the chance to play it. The only Final Fantasy game I seem to care about is Final Fantasy 9.

Mass Effect is like the only WRPG that I enjoy. I tried to enjoy FallOut 3, but I got bored so freaking fast, it wasn't funny. Dragon Age felt like a chore to play, so I didn't finish that.

I did hear that Steam has this neat little RPG called Rececttear: An Item Shop's Tale, and I did put it on my wishlist recently.

Quote from: Daxdiv on January 25, 2011, 09:42:01 PM
Dragon Age felt like a chore to play, so I didn't finish that.

I hated Dragon Age. The combat was incredibly boring, the story was hardly engaging, it was keyboard-smashingly frustrating to play unless you made the main character a Mage or set it to Easy mode, and the world was fairly barren in terms of interesting things to do. And let's not forget the NPC that tells you to quest to the Warden's Keep, even if you don't have the DLC installed, prompting you to then buy additional content that was purposefully cut out of the game so that they could sell it later for extra $$$. Oh, and the awesome memory leak that they never fucking fixed.

I love BioWare and all, but godDAMN.

My favorite turn based RPG is Final Fantasy VIII.

I thought I'd just copy and paste my post from the RPG topic on TZ over here since its relevant to this thread:

QuoteThere was once a time when I was into WRPGs, what with all of the customization and long campaigns and whatnot, but honestly, sometime in the middle of playing Oblivion and realizing how boring and padded out and repetitive it felt after a while, I quickly and steadily started to lose my interest in the genre. First of all, I have never been able to get into MMOs, so my experiences with the genre are mostly from single-player experience. Honestly, the only WRGPs that I still ever find myself enjoying are BioWare games. Personally I had a lot of fun with the KOTOR games, Jade Empire, and while I think the first Mass Effect is considerably overrated (I "liked" the game, BTW, but felt it was far from perfect as so many people made it out to be; the 2nd one looks like a huge improvement over the 1st in that regard) I still had more fun with it than most other WRPGs. I never bothered trying Dragon Age, though, as even though its a BioWare game it always looked to me like the type of RPG that I wouldn't enjoy playing, personally.

That said, I have never been into JRPGs, myself. I know a ton of people love it, but to me its one of the most boring genres in gaming ever. I just don't get where any of the fun comes from. Most of them get really repetitive in about an hour, and I don't like how so many of them center around turn-based combat systems. The Pokemon games are among the only few games in which I actually kind of enjoy that sort of combat system. Personally, I have never been able to finish a single Final Fantasy game without dropping it out of boredom, and to me it seems that the JRPGs have to rely a lot more on telling a good story to keep a player interested, which is fine, but the problem is that when it comes to story, most games in general fail to impress me all that much in that regard, and JRPGs don't exactly strike me as that much of a better effort from most that I have seen. I will say that the only JRPG that I have ever almost fully completed all of the way through, and enjoyed relatively well, is Chrono Trigger (the SNES version, since I don't know of the PS1 or DS versions have any differences between them). I also managed to make it to disc 3 of Final Fantasy IX before dropping that game, so I at least found it a tad bit interesting to keep playing up until that point.

Overall, though, you could say that I don't really care for most RPGs in general, whether they are from the West or from Japan. I used to be big into the genre, but honestly now I'm more of an action gamer, and of course I also love the attention that 2D platformers are getting these days. My favorite sub-genre of action games is probably hack n' slash and beat-em-up games. While many might not view games like Ninja Gaiden, Devil May Cry, Bayonetta, God Hand, and various other games as being nearly worth as much as the expansive world of an RPG, those shorter (but IMO, sweeter) experiences have always appealed to me far more and are usually more replayable to me than any RPGs that I have ever played.

That's just the way that I personally feel about the genre, though. I don't necessarily think its a bad genre, but rather a genre that I have never been fully able to get the appeal of (well, I understand the appeal, to be more precise, but very few games have actually appealed to me in the intended way that an RPG would to most people, honestly).

Yeah, give me a good beat 'em up, stealth action game, or FPS over any kind of RPG any day. I think that's one of the reasons why I love Deus Ex and Mass Effect, since I opt to play the former as a stealth game and the latter as a shooter. Obviously, games like Yakuza and Borderlands have more in common with these aforementioned categories than they do with traditional RPGs, thus furthering my enjoyment of them.

The problem with games like Oblivion is that you have to make your own fun. That doesn't really effect me, since I love running around murdering
shopkeepers and stealing their stuff, but if you want to follow the main quest line/plot, it becomes dreadfully boring. That said, the Dark Brotherhood quests were fucking awesome.

The Witcher actually has a really cool and engaging story, though, if you ever get a chance to try that one out.

Well, that's partially why I enjoy Action RPGs like Ys or Brave Fencer Musashi more than normal RPGs. It still has the leveling and stat building aspect, but the combat is more hands on and more fun. That's also why I like Valkyria Chronicles and the Mario RPG battle systems, because you have more options. The same with hybrids like Yakuza or River City Ransom.

Fallout 3 bored the piss out of me because there was nothing of interest going on.

If there were a game that could incorporate the customization level of an RPG in terms of leveling up and whatnot with the combat system of the 3D Ninja Gaiden games (specifically NG2's combat system) and the enemy AI from those games as well (specifically NGB's enemy AI), then it would be the best game ever. I'm dead serious.

I think Yakuza is as close to what you're thinking of (and Ys in more of a traditional sense) though their combat is more simple in execution.

I'll give both games a try if I ever get the systems to play them on. I don't mind simplistic combat as long as its still fun to execute (the perfect example of a game using this type of combat would be Batman: Arkham Asylum).

You can easily find downloads and English patches for the Ys PC games, which will run on just about any computer. I bet you own a PC. ;)

Speaking of Ys, I finally found the english translated version and download it on my phone.

And today I finally downloaded working copies of the translated version of Sweet Home and Mother 1 (Earthbound Zero) Can't wait to play those. Anyone know of any other good Japan only RPGs?

Seiken Densetsu 3, Treasure Hunter G, Live A Live, and Bahamut Lagoon are pretty popular online.

I meant to say on the NES but I'm going to be using emulators on my cousin's PSP so thanks!

EDIT: Shit, I forgot to mention, I'm hooked on Sweet Home now. I've been playing it like a mad man. Trying to get through the mansion is addictive and there hasn't been any frustatrating puzzles yet.

A few minutes before midnight, I finally beat Sweet Home. Easily my favorite NES RPG...okay, that goes without saying since it's the very first one I've beaten and I've only played a handful of other NES RPGs. It's kind of like Resident Evil (minus the shooting of course) meets the end of Final Fantasy VIII.

I finally figured out what is and how to get to the final section. There's no randomized enemies there, just very creepy bosses. The last boss reminded me how tough my characters are. They took damage for like 10 minutes and I only had to heal my weakest character in my current party. It took me a while to figure out how to kill the final boss and I had to do a lot of guessing but I did it.

Then a minute before midnight, I played a little bit of Earthbound Zero/Mother 1. Interesting graphics that game has.

I was never a fan of the first Dragon Age, and it looks like I made the right choice in deciding not to pick up the sequel...

Huge picture

(https://animationrevelation.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg806.imageshack.us%2Fimg806%2F4527%2F1300164773898.jpg&hash=4b50af9744c742b32add1dcd476016e8490bf274)

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ACTUAL QUOTE FROM A BIOWARE DEV:

"Every time you push a button, something awesome should happen."

Don't you just love how linear shooters are trying to invade every genre now? I eagerly await KOTOR of Duty next! Ugh, BioWare.

I honestly don't get the massive hate for BioWare. I've never played any Dragon Age game, and I never plan to (I'm sure that they suck), but its not like that's the only thing BioWare has ever made. Both of the KOTOR games were actually extremely good (and I mean good games in general, not just good licensed properties), and while I felt Mass Effect was highly overrated, it had its merits (and I'm sure that the 2nd one is even better), so its not like BioWare is some notoriously bad RPG developing company. At the very least, as someone who really isn't into WRPGs (I'm not into JRPGs either, for the record), BioWare makes some of the only few that I can tolerate (and on top of that some of them are actually fun to play, who would have guessed :sly: ). Honestly, if any company should get a lot of flak for their RPGs, its Bethesda. What exactly is in any Elder Scrolls or Fallout game that is even remotely fun? Sure, both games are big and massive, but there's hardly anything fun to do in either of them, unless tedious and repetitive quests are supposed to be considered fun (then again, considering that that's pretty much what makes up the entire RPG genre for both WRPGs and JRPGs alike, I suppose I can see how RPG-fans would be into that sort of thing :thinkin: ).

Fallout 3... Man, I just want one person tell me what about that shit is fun. I honestly try to give WRPGs a shake and while I like some of them, shit like that just puts me to sleep.

But the whole shitstorm over DA2 is that the first game was a very Baldur's Gate style throwback with a 100 hour play time that scored high, sold well, and made BW a mint.

Then they made DA2 which is a 20 hour game (sidequests are basically the same thing repeatedly with the same 7 dungeons on loop), a linear story with less options, environments are reused all over the place (sometimes even within the same mission/sidequest) and the first 10 hours basically consists of nothing but sidequests. Oh yeah, and the battle system is supposedly not very good.

I was never very interested in the game, but reading about how they and EA basically tried to make the game appeal to the casual shooter crowd instead of their audience is trange considering how well their games already do. Which is fine in theory, but this was clearly rushed to market. (I heard it was in development for less than 2 years)

Hmmmm....EA must have cut some deals with the critics then. What the fuck is up with all of these 8's and occasionally even higher in the game's ratings? of course, it wouldn't surprise me if something like that was going on, since I haven't found any reason to trust gaming critics for over half a decade now. Greg Kasavin who formerly worked for Gamespot was probably the last good and honest one that I can remember.

Game reviewers are just terrible nowadays. They still give Contra games negative points for being hard, they still hate survival horror games for controlling "badly" (I don't know how the hell they're supposed to control), and they still think handheld games and 2D games are inferior to even the worst console games.

Oh yeah, and then there's IGN's 3.0 Godhand review. (I think they even later included it on a best of the PS2 list or some shit? Hilarious.)

Quote from: Ensatsu-ken on March 15, 2011, 01:36:48 AM
What exactly is in any Elder Scrolls or Fallout game that is even remotely fun?

Robbing people/assassinating them stealthily is literally the only good thing about those games. Of course, I've gotten at least 30 hours out of each just doing that...

I got 40 hours out of Oblivion, but to be honest that was just me being extremely patient waiting for something interesting to happen....yeah, also I never even bothered to try finishing the main quest. I still own the game, though.

Quote from: Foggle on March 15, 2011, 11:20:41 PM

Quote from: Ensatsu-ken on March 15, 2011, 01:36:48 AM
What exactly is in any Elder Scrolls or Fallout game that is even remotely fun?

Robbing people/assassinating them stealthily is literally the only good thing about those games. Of course, I've gotten at least 30 hours out of each just doing that...

Couldn't you basically get the same feeling from Thief? (Note: I have not played Thief)

Quote from: Desensitized on March 16, 2011, 07:23:35 AM

Quote from: Foggle on March 15, 2011, 11:20:41 PM

Quote from: Ensatsu-ken on March 15, 2011, 01:36:48 AM
What exactly is in any Elder Scrolls or Fallout game that is even remotely fun?

Robbing people/assassinating them stealthily is literally the only good thing about those games. Of course, I've gotten at least 30 hours out of each just doing that...

Couldn't you basically get the same feeling from Thief? (Note: I have not played Thief)

Yes, and every Thief is ten times better than anything by Bethesda in literally every way. But there hasn't been a new Thief game since 2004 and the first one is a bitch to get working properly on newer version of Windows.

As one of only two Phantasy Star IV fans on the internet...

Phantasy Star IV is the real greatest 16-bit rpg ever.

Only 2!?! That game's pretty sweet.

Quote from: Desensitized on March 18, 2011, 12:09:19 AM
Only 2!?! That game's pretty sweet.

Fck you! I'm the 2nd Phantasy Star IV fan.  :sly: Anyway, it's my favorite 16 bit RPG...so far. I've only beaten Breath Of Fire 1 and 2 and Shining Force 1 and 2. Yeah, shocking, I've beaten more Genesis RPGs than SNES ones. Hell, I have Sonic's UGC and never owned a SNES, what can I say? Which also reminds me, Sweet Home is the only 8 bit RPG I've ever beat. I'm stuck on Dragon Warrior and Final Fantasy.

I am on what I assume is the final boss of Mother 1 though. I'm sure I won't actual go for a full week of failing that battle...

Hey Bison, have you played Trails in the Sky yet?

I'm liking the interesting strategy RPG meets turn based style battle system, and the story and characters are quite good from what I've played so far.

I've been playing it in between bouts of Mortal Kombat, and it really is a grand little RPG. Here's hoping we get the follow up sooner than later, I want more.  8)

Speaking of RPGs, I've FINALLY gotten around to playing all the Mario RPGs one by one, including the games I never beat previously.

Super Paper Mario has an amazing story. No kidding, one of the best stories I've seen in gaming. I actually like it better then the first Paper Mario because of that.

Bowser's Inside Story is great. Like the other M&Ls, it had an excellent final battle. I still think Partners in Time is better though. It didn't have those tedious mini games, and I loved the teamwork between the adults and the babies.

They are all good though. But I would actually put all 3 Paper Marios a full step above all 3 Mario & Luigis.

Breath of Death VII: The Beginning and Cthulhu Saves The World are now available on Steam in a bundle pack for $3 total ($2.69 if you buy it in the first week!). These are some of the best comedy games ever made, and are actually quite fun as throwback JRPGs (certainly better than every Final Fantasy since 9). The price can't be beat, and I'd be surprised if your computer couldn't run them, so you should pick them up!

You can also get them separately from the Xbox Live Indie Games store for slightly more overall $$$ (about 5, I think) in Microsoft Banana Points, if you'd rather. Anyone with even a passing interest in JRPGs should pick these up and support Zeboyd so they can continue making awesome games!

Quote from: Desensitized on April 22, 2011, 10:27:47 PM
Hey Bison, have you played Trails in the Sky yet?

I'm ashamed to say I've never even heard of it. But you're description matches Fire Emblem and Valkyria Chronicles, and that can only mean good things.

Also, you've played Radiant Historia, would tracking it down be worth it? I had my eyes on it when it was coming out, but I never picked it up because I didn't have spare money and no GameStops around here had it at all.

Quote from: Rosalinas Spare Wand on July 14, 2011, 09:37:55 PM

Quote from: Desensitized on April 22, 2011, 10:27:47 PM
Hey Bison, have you played Trails in the Sky yet?

I'm ashamed to say I've never even heard of it. But you're description matches Fire Emblem and Valkyria Chronicles, and that can only mean good things.

Also, you've played Radiant Historia, would tracking it down be worth it? I had my eyes on it when it was coming out, but I never picked it up because I didn't have spare money and no GameStops around here had it at all.

Desen can't shut up about that game. You might as well go get it because he'll just convince you to do just that.

Anyway know of any good turn based RPGs this gen? Games with a basic, nongimmicky battle system and a world map would namely be the ones I would want to play

Finally. (http://www.gog.com/en/gamecard/anachronox) For only $6, this is worth everyone's time!

Hey Foggle, Ys Oath In Felghana and Origins are coming to Steam. You better not miss out!

I already have Oath on the PSP, but I'm extremely excited for Origins. Day 1 buy, no questions asked. Though as much as I love my PC gaming, I really wish it was coming to the PSP, as well. Since 4 and 5 will no doubt eventually come to the Vita, it'll be kind of strange to have every game except the prequel on a portable system.

Decided to revive this thread, cause I'm curious about more RPG opinions.

Pokemon used to be my favorite. But I'm considering otherwise now. Cause man, Chrono Trigger is addicting.

As someone who doesn't really like JRPG's (or just RPGs, for that matter), Chrono Trigger is the only traditional JRPG that I could be bothered to play up to the end. I didn't actually beat it, but I got up to right before the final battle with Lavos. I do like the characters because they aren't overly-obnoxious like in other JRPGs, and the plot and design of the game has a very "fun" sort of vibe to it, and it can seem like a big and epic quest without ever taking itself too seriously to the point of being pretentious. Its basically the only exception to me in the JRPG genre.

That said, I like Pokemon far more for its deeper combat (particularly with its multiplayer component), and its addicting gameplay. This is the only JRPG that I've ever bothered to complete, though I don't count it as a "traditional" JRPG.

You should try Phantasy Star IV.

I want to play Blue Dragon because I hear it has a world map, which is something modern RPGs have apparently abandoned.

Know what RPG I want to play?

(https://animationrevelation.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fupload.wikimedia.org%2Fwikipedia%2Fen%2Fb%2Fb7%2FSecret_of_Mana_Box.jpg&hash=b9d970efee363e9334efc7161ac5a5b45d9834cb)

RPG with fast-paced action akin to 2D Zelda, plus multi-player is a recipe for awesomeness.

Yeah, that's a good game; right up there with Square's best during their "golden years" (personally I like it better than the majority of FF titles myself). Like most things SNES, it's not cheap though; looks like it'll you cost at least $50 for a copy nowadays.

Did it ever get a re-release (VC, etc.)?

Quote from: Kiddington on August 22, 2012, 07:38:52 AM
Yeah, that's a good game; right up there with Square's best during their "golden years" (personally I like it better than the majority of FF titles myself). Like most things SNES, it's not cheap though; looks like it'll you cost at least $50 for a copy nowadays.

Did it ever get a re-release (VC, etc.)?

Yep, it's on VC. And with that, a far more convenient means of doing 3-player coop (instead of having to get a SNES attachment). ;)

Hope we don't mind thread necromancy.

I'm not real big on rpgs for the most part, but I do enjoy the Mass Effect series (I do hate Dragon Age: Origins though. Gameplay is awful, but I hear DA2 improves on it). As a matter of fact I would say Mass Effect set the new standard for me when it comes to rpgs, whether it's jrpg or wrpg. My issues with jrpgs is that they do nothing to keep me interested or they become too draggy for me to make me not want to finish them. Tales of the Abyss was the last jrpg that I played and finished, and I think I actually spent over 100 hours on my first playthrough, and unfortunately, that caused me to not even want to bother with anymore because I just lost any desire to play them. Dungeon crawling just seem so tedious in jrpgs these days. I've watched the Shin Megami Tensei games played, and my God, that's some tedious stuff to sit and playthrough.

Even then we have the leading character always starting off with a sword. I wouldn't mind it so much if it weren't for the turn-based combat, or having combat that's actually the same as everything else. I think this is why I enjoyed Dragon Quest 8 so much, considering you could switch between 3 different weapons (4 if you count fisticuffs). But even that was plagued by the long dungeons. I think out of all the JRPGs I've played (which is not much) I enjoyed Final Fantasy 8 the most, and I would still play that today (I'd also go back and play FF4. Characterization in that game is beastly). I like the draw and junction system. I also like the fact that the enemies level up along with you, but at the same time FF8 may be the easiest out of all the FF's due to being able to have access to strong magic very early in the game, and you can just stroll around like "come get some".

Let me think, FF4, 7, 8, 10 (I HATE THIS ONE), DQ8, KH1&2, CT, and TotA are all the JRPGs I've played, and by the time I finished TotA, like I said, I was burnt out, which made my intro to Mass Effect feel even more refreshing because it just felt so good to play a rpg that didn't require you to press X and wait, or to mash square or triangle forever.

If there's 1 thing I'd like to see when it comes to the genre, it's a collaboration of both j/wrpgs. Take the wrpgs style of creating your own character and make that character whatever type of class you want, and combine that with the jrpgs character design. I don't mind the anime look. If there's one thing I didn't care for in Mass Effect, the character models would probably be it (although the outfits are pretty cool), and then go about how you see fit about character interaction and exploration.

So I'm hearing this game is good.

(https://www.blauemedien.de/images/product_images/original_images/71pf-rpjzkl._aa1500_.jpg)

Discuss.

I'm downloading the demo. With the speed of Sony's servers... I'll be playing it next year.

How big is the file anyway?

Quote from: Daxdiv on January 22, 2013, 09:21:57 PM
How big is the file anyway?

2628mb

I'm at 20%!

I was checking to see if there was any new info out about Persona 5, and then I remembered that Persona 4 was released in 2008, and I pre-ordered it.

That hits me really hard for some reason.

rpgs a ganre i dont really like that much i mean i dont hate all rpgs but there are alot of them that i hate (i usualy buy them for collection purposes) but again there are some that i like i dont completely not care for the ganre i just dont like them as much as sandbox games or platformers or hack n slash titles


heres some of them that i did enjoy

pokemon obviously i mean i grew up with pokemon series my fav will always be silver gen 2 rules sadly im getting abit tierd of all these new pokemon i mean x and y where good games dont get me wrong but how many pokemon do we really need

kingdom hearts 1.5 remix i never played this series as a kid but i did wanna so since i was getting some new ps3 games anyway i decided to pick it up and its a pretty good game the graphics are very colourful the music was great the gameplay was pretty fun the only issues i had is the story which i didnt care for atall and the characters didn't really interest me all that much (although the disney characters where pretty cool) so yeah i like it

dragon age series: i played origins and i actualy liked it i liked customising my character i liked the different dialog options i liked the graphical style i liked the atmosphere i just liked it its not something id play alot but i like it

dragons dogma: same as dragon age i like the game its fun to play i think i prefer it to dragon age alittle bit though


some others that i enjoyed

anything from vanillawere

mana series

persona 3 and 4

ff7(for the most part)

atelier totori and mana khemia(i find them guilty pleasures)

disgaea series

chrono trigger

mother series

grandia

and thats pretty much it for jrpgs i liked (unless e.v.o search for eden counts i loved that overlooked snes game) i dunno jrpgs and wrpgs are my 3rd least fav ganre but theres some good ones out there

Quote from: Foggle on January 25, 2011, 05:00:59 PM
Never been much of a JRPG man, really. Persona 2 and 3 (especially 2) are ace, though. Same with Valkyria Chronicles 1 and 2, Final Fantasy 4 and 6, and the Ys series. The Yakuza games are also fucking badass if you count those as RPGs.

On the other hand, I love my WRPGs. Deus Ex (first one is amazing, second one is eh, third one looks epic), Baldur's Gate series (the PC games AND the PS2 games), Diablo 1 and 2, Borderlands, The Witcher, Mass Effect 1 and 2, KOTOR 1 and 2, Fallout 2 and New Vegas (not a big fan of the other two), the Elder Scrolls series (never played Arena, though), the list goes on. Two Worlds 2 actually looks like it'll be pretty cool, surprisingly enough. I know a lot of people say it sucked, but I really want to play Alpha Protocol.

I pretty much hate all MMORPGs. Vindictus held my attention for all of 2 weeks: the longest I've ever been interested in a single MMO.

Quote from: Ensatsu-ken on January 25, 2011, 04:23:58 PM
Still, it was a well-made experience for what it was. I still need to play Mass Effect 2, and I'm kind of interested in Borderlands now that it has probably come down in price.

Borderlands GOTY Edition (which contains all the DLCs on the disc except for the newest one, which is a download voucher) is $30 new last time I checked. I, personally, love the single-player, but I know a lot of people don't (and co-op IS better). If you have a friend to play it with, pick it up for sure (it supports both online and split-screen).

persona in general is awesome and this is coming from someone who hates long dialog boxes (seriously im glad persona 4 golden gave us a option to skip dialog) mainly because the combat is actualy fluent and dosent get to boring like other jrpgs do and are usualy pretty fast

and i like the characters (ive only played 3 and 4 so yeah i might play 1 and 2 sooner or later) there usualy quite entertaining and make the games more enjoyable for me

oh and the tales games are alright but mainly the combat though the storyline in them (except xillia that had a ok story) are weak and i dont care for the artstyle (because i dont care for anime) but there fun to play i guess

Quote from: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on August 19, 2012, 08:08:51 PM
As someone who doesn't really like JRPG's (or just RPGs, for that matter), Chrono Trigger is the only traditional JRPG that I could be bothered to play up to the end. I didn't actually beat it, but I got up to right before the final battle with Lavos. I do like the characters because they aren't overly-obnoxious like in other JRPGs, and the plot and design of the game has a very "fun" sort of vibe to it, and it can seem like a big and epic quest without ever taking itself too seriously to the point of being pretentious. Its basically the only exception to me in the JRPG genre.

That said, I like Pokemon far more for its deeper combat (particularly with its multiplayer component), and its addicting gameplay. This is the only JRPG that I've ever bothered to complete, though I don't count it as a "traditional" JRPG.

chrono trigger is one of those games you dont need to be to much of a jrpg fan to enjoy since the combat is so fast paced and quick and it didnt suffer from to many jrpg cliches (my fav char us frog btw ^^)

its kinda like the mana series or kingdom hearts where you can play it even if your not a jrpg fan

Quote from: talonmalon333 on August 21, 2012, 09:28:59 PM
Know what RPG I want to play?

(https://animationrevelation.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fupload.wikimedia.org%2Fwikipedia%2Fen%2Fb%2Fb7%2FSecret_of_Mana_Box.jpg&hash=b9d970efee363e9334efc7161ac5a5b45d9834cb)

RPG with fast-paced action akin to 2D Zelda, plus multi-player is a recipe for awesomeness.

you should play the sequal seiken densetsu 3 (theres a fan translation for it dont worry) that improves upon secret of mana in every way possible


dont get me wrong secret of mana is awesome but seiken 3 is way better (to bad it only got released in japan and we got secret of evermore)

mother is my favorite rpg series. it kind of is by default since it's the only rpg series i've completed.

What do you guys think of Final Fantasy Origins, Final Fantasy Anthology, and Final Fantasy Chronicles for the PS1?

I only have the one that includes Final Fantasy 4 and Chrono Trigger (two of Square's best games, IMO), and aside from the somewhat annoying load times, it's fantastic.

Slow loading kills them. I prefer the GBA versions.

I've seen this contrast before. :P

Also, I love Dawn of Souls' rendition of Prelude. But for most of the GBA versions, I don't love their lower sound quality. What do you think is the best version of the classic games?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JUPTPQaSE0g

I was never a huge fan of the FMV cutscenes they added into Chrono Trigger, with the exception of the opening and ending scenes. Every other one literally just repeated things that were already shown in the in-game sprites. Plus, they contrasted too much with the rest of the game. But that game gave the option to turn them off, so I can't complain.

The SNES versions are the best of all of them. Except for V for not having an English translation. Otherwise I prefer the GBA versions of I & II over any other version and the DS version of III.

I wish they would have remade III in 2D. The characters look like pears in the remake.

As for the original FF, I do have to say that it is, sadly, one of the many NES RPGs that doesn't hold up at all.

Also, what do you think is the best version of Chrono Trigger?

ff 1 is unplayable to me.

I beat FF1. It's fun to play the GBA version because of the dropped difficulty. That makes it a relaxing RPG to just play through. Also the bonus dungeon is pretty unique.

Quote from: talonmalon333 on February 13, 2015, 06:19:59 PMAlso, what do you think is the best version of Chrono Trigger?

Probably the SNES version. Cinematics do nothing for me and portability could go either way.

Quote from: Spark Of Spirit on February 13, 2015, 06:35:16 PM
I beat FF1. It's fun to play the GBA version because of the dropped difficulty. That makes it a relaxing RPG to just play through. Also the bonus dungeon is pretty unique.

I wonder if there are any people who think the GBA version is "dumbed down".

I know Dragon Warriors also got a similar remake for GBC. They really need to re-release that because I'd like to play it. The NES version is just as unplayable as the NES Final Fantasy.

Quote from: Spark Of Spirit on February 13, 2015, 06:35:16 PM

Quote from: talonmalon333 on February 13, 2015, 06:19:59 PMAlso, what do you think is the best version of Chrono Trigger?

Probably the SNES version. Cinematics do nothing for me and portability could go either way.

Like I said above, though, I do like the opening and ending cinematics. The last cinematic in particular is a nice new scene that gives the characters more closure. Next time I play Chrono Trigger, I'm going to turn off the FMVs until I get to the end, and then turn them back on before I beat the final boss.

Also, I prefer the streamlined touch controls and translation from the DS version. But I still want to see that Wii U "definitive version" port that combines the superior technology from the SNES version with the features added to the DS version.

It would be nice, but apparently the guy behind Dragon Quest hates re-releases. So we might not ever get a re-release of the GBC versions of 1, 2, and 3 anytime soon. That and we still haven't gotten the recent Dragon Quest VII remake despite the high demand and IX and Bravely Default's success. I would like the GBC games, though.

lol, i wanted to say that dw1 is unplayable as well. i played both ff 1 and dragon warrior 1 around the same time and i have never given up on two games so closely in time.

How would you rank the classic Final Fantasy games?

EDIT:

Actually, feel free to throw the PS1 games in there, as well.

I'll even list my preferred version next to the game.

Final Fantasy VI (SNES)
Final Fantasy IX (PS1)
Final Fantasy IV (SNES)
Final Fantasy I (GBA)
Final Fantasy V (GBA)
Final Fantasy VII (PS1)
Final Fantasy III (DS)
Final Fantasy II (GBA) - It's still broken, but actually fun in this version.
Final Fantasy XII (PS2)
Final Fantasy VIII (PS1)
Final Fantasy X (PS2)
Final Fantasy XI (PS2) - Online-only bias.
Final Fantasy XIV (PC) - Online-only bias.
Final Fantasy X-2 (PS2)
Final Fantasy XIII (PS3)
Final Fantasy XIII-2 (PS3)
Final Fantasy XIII-3 (PS3)

My favorites are pretty obvious, anyway.

Hardcore Gaming 101 updated their article on Suikoden! (http://www.hardcoregaming101.net/suikoden/suikoden.htm)

If you want a better description of what makes this series so good, I recommend reading that.

will do, later.

Does anyone else think Nintendo should make a turn-based RPG starting various Nintendo stars?

Quote from: talonmalon333 on February 20, 2015, 07:31:38 PM
Does anyone else think Nintendo should make a turn-based RPG starting various Nintendo stars?

Yes.

I've been wanting a Smash Bros. RPG since forever.

Quote from: Spark Of Spirit on February 20, 2015, 07:53:17 PM

Quote from: talonmalon333 on February 20, 2015, 07:31:38 PM
Does anyone else think Nintendo should make a turn-based RPG starting various Nintendo stars?

Yes.

I've been wanting a Smash Bros. RPG since forever.

I was thinking of some potential ideas for it, if it were to happen (which it probably won't).

- It would be 2D and released on the 3DS. I wouldn't have any issue with it being on the Wii U. I just have a feeling it would be handheld.

- There would be seven characters you would get, with up to three at a time being usable. Mario, Donkey Kong, Kirby, Link, Pikachi, Samus, and Star Fox. I tried keeping it to only the most recognizable characters from long running franchises. No franchise gets double billing, but I wouldn't be totally against throwing Luigi in there. I'm fine with him having the same role as he did in Paper Mario 64, though.

- You would start the game as Mario, and would recruit the other characters along the way. However, I don't necessarily imagine him as the main character. It's more like they are all equally important even though you don't get them all right away. Basically, Mario doesn't have to be locked into the main 3-person party. The game would begin in Mushroom Kingdom/Toad Town and you would make your way from there to Hyrule and other places.

- The main characters wouldn't have dialogue (but NPCs would, of course). Of those characters, the only one who consistently talks in their own franchise is Fox, so I think it would be best that the whole team is silent because it would be kind of awkward if he talked but no one else did. They would interact with each other with actions and their typical yelps and whatnot (and, in the case of Mario and Pikachu, their catchphrases). I believe Nintendo could convince us of a bond between these characters without any dialogue.

Feel free to comment on my ideas.

If we're talking dreams here, I would have Yoshitaka Murayama as the lead designer and base the basic party system on Suikoden.

By the way, I'm not saying it should be a clone of Suikoden, but being able to recruit dozens of Nintendo characters to your party as well as have them do things like build shops and get better items for you to buy would be the best way to go. That way you can have a giant selection of Nintendo favorites in the game without missing any.

Of course, you would start the game as Mario and move on from there. I would have him be the only character without dialogue except for the ones who traditionally don't talk either. Everyone else would speak.

I'd have the battle system itself be a mix between Mario and Luigi's button actions and Paper Mario's straightforward menus.

That's me spit-balling.

That reminds me that I always use to want a "Paper Mario & Luigi", a collaboration between the two teams. It would be pretty interesting and would do something for two sub-series' that have been run into the ground by now.

Quote from: Spark Of Spirit on February 20, 2015, 09:33:22 PMexcept for the ones who traditionally don't talk either.

Who would that include? Fox? :P

Quote from: talonmalon333 on February 20, 2015, 09:46:28 PMWho would that include? Fox? :P

Yoshi, Donkey Kong and other Kongs, Kirby, and the Pokemon. Others like those.

I just imagined a scenario where the party hires Kyle Hyde from Hotel Dusk to track down rumors to give hints to the player. Stuff like that would be great.

Quote from: Spark Of Spirit on February 20, 2015, 09:51:41 PM

Quote from: talonmalon333 on February 20, 2015, 09:46:28 PMWho would that include? Fox? :P

Yoshi, Donkey Kong and other Kongs, Kirby, and the Pokemon. Others like those.

Those fit into the catchphrases I mentioned.

Mario: "Let's go!" "Mario!"
Kirby: "Hiii!"
Donkey Kong: "Yeeeeah!"
Pikachu: "Pikachu!"
Yoshi: "Yoshiii!"

When I said they wouldn't have dialogue, I envisioned them retaining these phrases with their typical voice acting.

I get what you mean about Kyle Hyde, though.

Quote from: talonmalon333 on February 20, 2015, 09:56:13 PM

Quote from: Spark Of Spirit on February 20, 2015, 09:51:41 PM

Quote from: talonmalon333 on February 20, 2015, 09:46:28 PMWho would that include? Fox? :P

Yoshi, Donkey Kong and other Kongs, Kirby, and the Pokemon. Others like those.

Those fit into the catchphrases I mentioned.

Mario: "Let's go!" "Mario!"
Kirby: "Hiii!"
Donkey Kong: "Yeeeeah!"
Pikachu: "Pikachu!"
Yoshi: "Yoshiii!"

When I said they wouldn't have dialogue, I envisioned them retaining these phrases with their typical voice acting.

I get what you mean about Kyle Hyde, though.

Oh yeah, I get what you mean now.

On the other hand, figuring out how to recruit Captain Falcon, Ness, Little Mac, Ice Climbers, or Marth, would definitely be rewarding to any Nintendo fan looking for ways to expand their party options. Especially if they can throw in nods to characters like Geno, Mallow, or the Paper Mario partners.

I do like that idea. The idea I was going for with my 7-hero team was more of a smaller, personal thing. Kind of reminds me of the classics, like Chrono Trigger, where the team was relatively small, but you got the sense that there was a bond between them. I feel like there would be a level of satisfaction seeing these big Nintendo characters uniting as teammates and friends, and a bittersweet feeling when the game reaches its end and they all return to their home worlds/lands.

I just recently learned that the early Final Fantasy games were released on PSP. Is anyone here familiar with those versions?

They're not as good versions of the GBA games, IIRC.

In what ways are they downgraded?

I believe they have slightly higher resolution graphics but horrific load times.

Quote from: Foggle on February 26, 2015, 04:01:43 PM
I believe they have slightly higher resolution graphics but horrific load times.

That and I think they're missing the extras from the GBA versions. Or at least some content.

Again, it's been awhile.

Quote from: Spark Of Spirit on February 26, 2015, 04:08:02 PM
That and I think they're missing the extras from the GBA versions. Or at least some content.

Again, it's been awhile.

"Again"? Wait, when did you say this before to warrant that word usage? :P

Quote from: talonmalon333 on February 26, 2015, 04:18:32 PM

Quote from: Spark Of Spirit on February 26, 2015, 04:08:02 PM
That and I think they're missing the extras from the GBA versions. Or at least some content.

Again, it's been awhile.

"Again"? Wait, when did you say this before to warrant that word usage? :P

He said "IIRC" the first time that he responded to you about the FF games on the GBA.

A better question is why are you nitpicking such a minor detail? :thinkin:

Quote from: Dr. Ensatsu-ken on February 26, 2015, 04:29:22 PM

Quote from: talonmalon333 on February 26, 2015, 04:18:32 PM

Quote from: Spark Of Spirit on February 26, 2015, 04:08:02 PM
That and I think they're missing the extras from the GBA versions. Or at least some content.

Again, it's been awhile.

"Again"? Wait, when did you say this before to warrant that word usage? :P

He said "IIRC" the first time that he responded to you about the FF games on the GBA.

A better question is why are you nitpicking such a minor detail? :thinkin:

Just be be a nuisance. Nothing more to see here. :sly:

I heard the GBA version of FFIV has game breaking bugs in its combat. Is this true, Spark?

Quote from: talonmalon333 on February 26, 2015, 05:26:41 PM
I heard the GBA version of FFIV has game breaking bugs in its combat. Is this true, Spark?

I've never met them. I made it up to the final dungeon in that version of the game.

Apparently, the game occasionally grants you multiple turns in a row, and sometimes will skip your turn altogether.

I bought all the GBA Final Fantasies, but I also bought the "Complete Collection" version on PSP so that's probably going to be the version I go back to when I get the chance.

That Complete Collection doesn't include V and VI though, right?

By "complete", it just means that FF4 and FF4: The After Years are together in one package. I really wish they had given 5 and 6 a similar treatment though.

Only I, II, and IV were released on the PSP. I believe IV is the best of the bunch.

It seems like everyone says the PSP versions of the games are the best.

4 is definitely best on PSP (ignore The After Years though, ugh), but 1 and 2 haven't really held up well enough to warrant purchasing separately. It'd be wiser going for the double pack on GBA or PS1.

After Years contains modern Square writing. It was doomed before it came out.

If you're looking for something to play on your PSP, I highly recommend Ys: The Oath in Felghana instead of one of Square's disappointments.

Crisis Core is also really good if you want a PSP-exclusive Final Fantasy. And grab Persona 2: Innocent Sin if you want a traditional JRPG.

In other news, Einhander is a boss in Final Fantasy XIV:

(https://animationrevelation.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2F6xW2NIo.jpg&hash=a5c2b8d0f143e9d2ad424fa4c9f6c6c20b4a431f)

Of course it doesn't really mean anything. Square has so many good franchises not doing anything.

(https://animationrevelation.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fabload.de%2Fimg%2Fsquareenixfuytssn.gif&hash=04d04304f0a57ec51096f7ed9d9d6cc95715ccf8)

Ys Seven is also fairly fantastic.

I'm just hoping we finally get to see Anachronox 2 and Fear Effect Inferno one of these days...

Quote from: Nel_Annette on February 26, 2015, 11:00:35 PM
Ys Seven is also fairly fantastic.

Yes, it was pretty great. Story was fairly predictable, but the gameplay was so good.

That reminds me, has anyone here heard anything about the one for Vita? The remake of Ys IV? I was wondering if that was any good.

I want to play the Ys IV remake, but I just really don't want to buy a Vita.

As for Seven, as predictable as the story was, I'm embarassed to admit that the twist as to who the main villain was genuinely got me. I mean, the person I thought would be the main villain turned out to be second-in-command, but I really liked that twist, it surprised me and I loved it.

Ys 4 remake is getting a PC version in China I think. I'm sure Xseed will bring that one over eventually, and the next game is getting a PS4 version, so we'll never have to buy Vitas (thank god). ;)

The one game I wish they would translate (but don't have the rights to, I actually asked XSeed about it once) is the Turbografx-16 version of Ys IV. The TG16 versions of I & II are still the definitive versions (to me) and I keep hearing that that version of IV is even better. Sure the story is not considered canon, but I hardly care. I'd really like to give it a go.

I also own both the DS and PSP versions of Ys 1 & 2. It's a double-edged sword. On the DS, the graphics are fugly and the soundtrack is synthed to hell and back, but there's an actual sword button, and as a Zelda fan that appealed to me. The PSP version has a fantastic remastered version of the soundtrack and utterly gorgeous artwork all around, but they kept the "run diagonal at an enemy to damage it, take damage if you ram it head on" gameplay and I find it extremely awkward. If the PSP version had the option for that attack button, it'd be god-tier to me.

The run to attack stuff works excellently on the TG16 version. It's simply too awkward in Chronicles. The TG16 version is also just much more roundly solid as a game, actually, despite the not quite as good translation.

But that soundtrack. TG16 wins hands down there.

Falcom soundtracks are always in the realm of greatness.

I'd also have recommended Trails In The Sky, but the Steam version is better, and at least the sequel is coming to that. I love that game, it's just a shame it took us seven years to get it after Japan, and that it's taking so long to get the sequel that the rest of the series will probably never come out here.

If I didn't get a PSP for Portable Ops, I'm not getting a PSP. :P

Without giving any spoilers..in fact, just be vague, what RPGs have the best party members?

Nier, Persona 2: Innocent Sin, Persona 3, Mass Effect 2 & 3, Drakengard 3, Planescape: Torment, Kingdom Hearts (it's Donald and Goofy!)

You mean characters you just like using for being awesome?

Final Fantasy VI: Sabin (even if I can't get blitz moves right)
Chrono Trigger: Frog
Breath of Fire III: Rei
Super Mario RPG: Geno
Suikoden II: McDohl
Ys Seven: Adol (of course) and Dogi
Persona 3: Shinjiro
Mega Man X Command Mission: X and Zero

EDIT: Oops, I read that wrong. Oh well.

I think I really just meant character that are well written and/or interesting. Probably in this order for me:

Phantasy Star End Of The Millennium
Mass Effect 1 & 2 - Just like in 2 (except for Jack) I could care less for all the non-Goliath humans but the combo of Wrex and Garrus in 1 makes it about even to 2 to me.
Golden Sun 1 and The Lost Age - I just love how energetic the characters are during dialogue. Makes most others look stiff. I still need to beat the game though.

Whoops, forgot my actual favorite party: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2QeNwQl1J6g&t=13m47s (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2QeNwQl1J6g&t=13m47s)

If i get Suikoden on a disk and suikoden II for PSN, can i still carry over data between them?

I would assume so, since they both need to use a virtual PS1 memory card to save on the PS3.

Quote from: talonmalon333 on March 21, 2015, 02:16:32 PM
If i get Suikoden on a disk and suikoden II for PSN, can i still carry over data between them?

The save data is the only thing that matters to connect them, so I'd say so.

What are you guys ' top favorite RPGs?

We talking all genres and regions? I'll only list five for now.

1. Nier
2. Deus Ex
3. Mass Effect 2
4. Valkyria Chronicles
5. Demon's Souls

Are we including traditional only or can I add action RPGs in there?

Quote from: Spark Of Spirit on March 23, 2015, 03:45:44 PM
Are we including traditional only or can I add action RPGs in there?

If we can't include action RPGs, my entire list is invalidated... :-[

Quote from: Spark Of Spirit on March 23, 2015, 03:45:44 PM
Are we including traditional only or can I add action RPGs in there?

You can include them if you want. Or don't if you want to invalidate Foggle's list.

Alright.

1. Brave Fencer Musashi
2. Paper Mario: The Thousand Year Door
3. Chrono Trigger
4. Suikoden I & II
5. Final Fantasy VI
6. Ys: Oath in Felghana
7. Mario & Luigi: Bowser's Inside Story
8. Valkyria Chronicles
9. Final Fantasy IX
10. Ys Book I & II

That's only off the top of my head, though. I'm probably forgetting something.

Let's see:

1. Phantasy Star The End Of The Millennium
2. Earthbound
3. Sweet Home
4. Mass Effect 2 and Marvel Ultimate Alliance 2
5. Mother 3
6. Shining Force 2
7. Shining Force
8. Breath Of Fire 1 and 2
9. Golden Sun
10. Mother

:) I like this list. Easier than I thought

What do you guys think of the Baldur's Gate games?

They're amazing. The PS2 Dark Alliance games are really good, too.

How about the recent enhanced re-releases?

The Legend of Zelda x Ys is still a crossover I think would work really well.

Especially with two-player co-op as Link and Adol. Zelda-style puzzles and Ys-style fast paced action RPG combat wrapped in one long quality adventure would be killer. Shame Falcom is just not big enough for it to be a potential seller.

Never played any Baldur's Gate games. I still need to beat Deus Ex.

Quote from: talonmalon333 on March 23, 2015, 04:47:21 PM
How about the recent enhanced re-releases?

Haven't played them.

How about the Mana games?

Quote from: Spark Of Spirit on March 23, 2015, 05:03:16 PM
The Legend of Zelda x Ys is still a crossover I think would work really well.

Especially with two-player co-op as Link and Adol. Zelda-style puzzles and Ys-style fast paced action RPG combat wrapped in one long quality adventure would be killer. Shame Falcom is just not big enough for it to be a potential seller.

God yes.

I still want to get into that series. Well, at least the games with actual attack animation. :oo:

Apparently the PSP Final Fantasy port, which has PS1 quality music, is being released on 3DS eShop. The reason I bring this up... I'm surprised the 3DS can handle CD quality music. The DS struggled to handle Chrono Trigger's SNES music and had to downgrade it.

The sound in the 3DS is excellent, honestly. Listen to the soundtracks in Rhythm Thief, Kid Icarus Uprising, and Steel Empire on the 3DS and be amazed at how good it sounds.

I don't doubt it. It's just an impressive leap.

Keep in mind that, like all handheld consoles, you must plug in headphones to ensure the games don't sound like ass. ;)

Being the sucker that i am, I'll re-buy Dark Souls 2 as the DX11 version when it comes out later this month...

On the plus side, I own the original on steam with all DLC, and that gives me a discount from the $50 to just $20... Yaywoo...
Now, I'll say right away that the PC version of the regular dark souls was superior as it is already, since it ran at 60FPS and just played beautifully compared to the ass of a port of DS1, and the only difference I'll probably really feel from the DX11 version will be the new enemy and item placement, and the more aggressive AI... I doubt the graphics are gonna affect me in any way, and since i already experienced the original game running at 60FPS, so that also won't wow me much...

Still, i'm a sucker for souls games, this little change they're making is also exactly what i need to kick myself back into the game, because i'm still playing the original, and the dullness is getting to me since  know the game in and out already...

I'll miss my ridiculously high level character though, dear Burd Libidodo, I'll make your son in this version <3

By the way, Foggle, do you remember when we were having that discussion on FFVII?

Quote from: Foggle on March 21, 2015, 01:32:21 AM
I don't hate the game or anything, but I find the character writing to be a bit lacking and the gameplay to not have aged particularly well. I think FF 4-6 and 9 hold up much better as far as classic Final Fantasy games go. 7 is certainly worth playing for fans of the series and genre, but I believe that its quality has been a bit exaggerated due to it being the first RPG a lot of people played as kids.

The bold part is the part that, when we were having this discussion a month ago, I mainly wanted to address. But I somehow ended up responding to every part of this post except that bold section, and then the conversation just went from there. So now I ask, in what way do you think FFVII's gameplay hasn't aged too well?

Scatterbrain.

IIRC it moves a lot more slowly than the other games and is extremely easy.

Not as slowly as VIII. :P

Yeah, 8 is worse in both regards from what I remember.

I hate you all.

What would you guys call the best PS2 RPGs?

I don't think I've ever played a good one. :sweat:

Quote from: gunswordfist on April 18, 2015, 11:43:14 PM
I don't think I've ever played a good one. :sweat:

The PS1 was better in the RPG category.

Water is wet.

So as I continue to absolutely power my way through FFVIII (I'm really trying to give the game a chance, guys, I really am), am I the only one who thinks you can pinpoint this game as the reason JRPGs went so downhill for a while? Or, at least, why the series died? When you hear common complaints with the genre, you'll hear "They are joyless" or "They are so pretentious" or "They care too much about story and not about gameplay". These are all things that cropped up in FFVIII (even the use of FMV cutscenes, while used lightly, appear more than in VII and are advertised on the game's case as a reason to play it). I almost wonder if it all has to do with this game's success (which, quite frankly, probably is mostly because it's a sequel to FFVII, I mean I think they could have taken an empty soda can out of a dumpster and labeled it "Final Fantasy VIII" and make good money off of it), and the fact that IX, which went in a different direction, wasn't nearly as commercially successful.

Bad sequels tend to have the next game in the series sell badly. Like how MGS3 sold less than 2 (I think) because people were upset with 2.

Eh, I don't really think 8 hurt the overall series too much. Everything after it is way different, even if they do largely suffer from some of the same problems.

Quote from: gunswordfist on April 22, 2015, 02:57:53 PM
Bad sequels tend to have the next game in the series sell badly. Like how MGS3 sold less than 2 (I think) because people were upset with 2.

Yep, and Resistance 3 sold less than half as much as 2, even though a lot of people seem to put it up there with Crack In Time as Insomniac's best work.

Quote from: Foggle on April 22, 2015, 03:20:40 PM
Eh, I don't really think 8 hurt the overall series too much. Everything after it is way different, even if they do largely suffer from some of the same problems.

The gameplay is different, but then again that's the case with a lot of 3D FF games. I was mainly talking about the style and focus of it. And I wouldn't say it killed the series necessarily. But I do think it was the beginning of the end. The cracks started with it, and the snowball just got bigger and bigger until things hit rock bottom.

FFIX had several things going against it at the time.

• It came out after FFVIII which was considered a general letdown after FFVII by the market.
• It was deliberately made to go back to the roots of the franchise, being more familiar to FFIV and FFVI than the previous two entries.
• It was released when everyone was more interested in the next gen and were no longer paying attention to the current gen (Don't you hate that?)
• It had a stylized look instead of realistic (Which has ironically allowed it to age better than the other PS1 games)
• It wasn't grimdark enough to interest the general RPG market at the time.

All that said it has aged the best of the PS1 FF games and is still one of the series best entries. It's a shame they haven't let the director make a mainline FF game since.

Quote from: talonmalon333 on April 22, 2015, 03:23:49 PM
The gameplay is different, but then again that's the case with a lot of 3D FF games. I was mainly talking about the style and focus of it. And I wouldn't say it killed the series necessarily. But I do think it was the beginning of the end. The cracks started with it, and the snowball just got bigger and bigger until things hit rock bottom.

The problem is that FF is an anthology series, so the cracks seen in 8 don't really have any bearing on what came before or after. And regardless of what this forum may lead you to believe, most people love FF10 and 12. I personally thought Crisis Core and Type-0 were fantastic. FF15 looks to be excellent. The only truly bad games are the FF13 trilogy, and the sequels actually have good gameplay despite their stories being shit.

Square's biggest problem has been the writing, not the gameplay. It might not seem like such a big deal, but when you're sitting around with a group of characters for well over 30 hours, it's probably a good thing if they don't grate on you.

Quote from: Spark Of Spirit on April 22, 2015, 03:50:01 PM
Square's biggest problem has been the writing, not the gameplay. It might not seem like such a big deal, but when you're sitting around with a group of characters for well over 30 hours, it's probably a good thing if they don't grate on you.

Definitely. RPG is perhaps the only genre where story is usually more important than gameplay. Which is probably why I like so few of them...

Quote from: Foggle on April 22, 2015, 03:55:15 PM

Quote from: Spark Of Spirit on April 22, 2015, 03:50:01 PM
Square's biggest problem has been the writing, not the gameplay. It might not seem like such a big deal, but when you're sitting around with a group of characters for well over 30 hours, it's probably a good thing if they don't grate on you.

Definitely. RPG is perhaps the only genre where story is usually more important than gameplay. Which is probably why I like so few of them...

It's probably why I tend to prefer action RPGs.

Same here, I can pretty much only play action RPGs and combat-light cRPGs at this point. I just don't have the patience for turn-based games anymore, unless it's SMT, Valkyria Chronicles, Parasite Eve, or Suikoden.

Quote from: Foggle on April 22, 2015, 03:29:01 PM
The problem is that FF is an anthology series, so the cracks seen in 8 don't really have any bearing on what came before or after.

Again though, I'm not talking about the gameplay changes made in each game. I mean the style. The 2D games struck a balance between story and gameplay (though the initial games were much more gameplay focused, which is perfectly fine) and in terms of time, they struck a balance between seriousness and fun. FFVII did the same, and I think Square got the impression that people loved it because of the drama (which did work, but mostly because it balanced those with more "fun" elements). They took that in mind and essentially drained all the fun out of VIII's tone. IX brought it back, but after it proved less profitable, it's approach was ditched and the games starting with X lost the original tone of the series good years. And it all started with VIII.

Quote from: Foggle on April 22, 2015, 03:29:01 PMAnd regardless of what this forum may lead you to believe, most people love FF10 and 12.

I know what people say about these games. I-VII and IX are liked by just about everyone (though II has a few naysayers), with VI being the fan favorite. VIII, X, and XII are well liked but, among fans, receive far more mixed feelings. XIII wasn't so well loved and XIV was so bad that Square had to make multiple apologies to the public. XI is the only one I know nothing about in terms of reception.

Quote from: Foggle on April 22, 2015, 04:18:34 PM
Same here, I can pretty much only play action RPGs and combat-light cRPGs at this point. I just don't have the patience for turn-based games anymore, unless it's SMT, Valkyria Chronicles, Parasite Eve, or Suikoden.

You're not a Chrono Trigger fan?

9 is about as divisive as 8, 10, and 12 from what I've seen. But I think the majority of fans like all or most of those games. The new version of 14 is incredibly well-received, though it really should not have been so bad when it first launched (great job with that outsourcing there, SE!). 11 is beloved enough that the servers are still running and expansion packs are still being made to this day.

I forgot about Chrono Trigger. That's another good one. The point was mostly just that I don't have the patience for those kind of games anymore, on the whole.

I do think the characters are my biggest problem with FFVIII. They go beyond cliches and are practically cardboard cutouts. Whiny Rinoa, valley girl Selphie, loud mouthed Zell, and more. But of course, the worst is Squall. Bad supporting characters are a serious flaw, but when you want nothing to do with the main character you're stuck playing as for 50+ hours, that's just fatal. They are what cause the story to crumble. And while I criticized the Junction system recently, I have a feeling I'd be far more willing to get into it if the characters didn't make me feel so unattached to the game.

Quote from: Foggle on April 22, 2015, 08:02:33 PM
9 is about as divisive as 8, 10, and 12 from what I've seen. But I think the majority of fans like all or most of those games. The new version of 14 is incredibly well-received, though it really should not have been so bad when it first launched (great job with that outsourcing there, SE!). 11 is beloved enough that the servers are still running and expansion packs are still being made to this day.

I forgot about Chrono Trigger. That's another good one. The point was mostly just that I don't have the patience for those kind of games anymore, on the whole.

I don't know. I see a lot of love for IX. Nowadays, it seems to get as much appreciation as VII. And I do think most people like games I-XII. I just see more love for I-VII and IX than I do for the others. They just seem less try hard than VIII and later games. Overall though, Final Fantasy is a little harder to pinpoint the "decline" point (if you're one who believes that even happened) than many franchises. With many franchises you can look at one game and say "After this, the series was never the same". Many people have conflicting opinions about FF. I just think the downward spiral began with VIII.

Also, if it means anything, I do see more love for VIII than I do for any game from the PS2 era onward.

The overall love for 9 only just started from what I can tell. A couple years ago I never saw anyone talk about it, let alone praise it. Nowadays it seems to be (rightfully) recognized as the best PS1 FF game by hardcore fans.

Quote from: talonmalon333 on April 22, 2015, 02:43:51 PM
So as I continue to absolutely power my way through FFVIII (I'm really trying to give the game a chance, guys, I really am), am I the only one who thinks you can pinpoint this game as the reason JRPGs went so downhill for a while? Or, at least, why the series died? When you hear common complaints with the genre, you'll hear "They are joyless" or "They are so pretentious" or "They care too much about story and not about gameplay". These are all things that cropped up in FFVIII (even the use of FMV cutscenes, while used lightly, appear more than in VII and are advertised on the game's case as a reason to play it). I almost wonder if it all has to do with this game's success (which, quite frankly, probably is mostly because it's a sequel to FFVII, I mean I think they could have taken an empty soda can out of a dumpster and labeled it "Final Fantasy VIII" and make good money off of it), and the fact that IX, which went in a different direction, wasn't nearly as commercially successful.

This is probably why people graviate toward Tales and Nippon Ichi games. The former actually strike a balance of darkness and light-heartedness, and the latter actively parodies stuff like FF and don't take themselves seriously most of the time.

Quote from: Foggle on April 22, 2015, 08:13:19 PM
The overall love for 9 only just started from what I can tell. A couple years ago I never saw anyone talk about it, let alone praise it. Nowadays it seems to be (rightfully) recognized as the best PS1 FF game by hardcore fans.

I'd say it started around 2007 around the youtube seen (back when several big name youtubers then called FFVII and VIII overrated), and only got more popular from there.

I think one way I could put it is that most Final Fantasy fans love every game from I-XII, while most RPG fans love I-VII and IX with differing opinions on the rest.

Quote from: Foggle on April 22, 2015, 08:13:19 PM
The overall love for 9 only just started from what I can tell. A couple years ago I never saw anyone talk about it, let alone praise it. Nowadays it seems to be (rightfully) recognized as the best PS1 FF game by hardcore fans.

It seems to have happened at the same time as VII's love slightly diminishing. People still consider VII a great game, but I remember, many years ago, people constantly debated what the best video game of all time was between Final Fantasy VII and Ocarina of Time. Now, people still make that claim for Ocarina frequently, while looking back on FFVII and saying "Yeah, FFVI was better after all".

Quote from: Rynnec on April 22, 2015, 08:15:27 PM
This is probably why people graviate toward Tales and Nippon Ichi games. The former actually strike a balance of darkness and light-heartedness, and the latter actively parodies stuff like FF and don't take themselves seriously most of the time.

Makes sense. I prefer Shin Megami Tensei (main series and offshoots) and Drakengard (plus Nier, minus 2) because they're extremely dark and bizarre, but without all the 90's edginess and teenage angst most JRPGs (especially FF7 and 8) are known for. They also have far better narratives and (sometimes) characters. Tales is great too, and a series I really need to start digging into, but I can't stand NIS games.

I wasn't too big on Tales of Symphonia, when I played it years ago.

The English voice acting is generally what stops me from playing Tales and NIS games. Some of the dubbing legitimately hurts my ears and makes me cringe.

Tales and NIS games have some of the best dubbing, IMO. Especially Vesperia and Symphonia. Square Enix games, by contrast, have some of the blandest voice acting I've ever heard.

I will fight you if you're implying that Symphonia has better acting than Nier or Drakengard 3. :bleh: Final Fantasy dubs are usually fairly bland, though, and Type-0's is straight up horrific. Auron and Sazh have awesome voices, at least.

Vesperia has an excellent dub, and Xillia's is okay, if only because of Alvin. That said, maybe it's not the acting so much as it is the voices themselves. Every character sounds squeaky and/or whiny as fuck in NIS games, to me; like a Sentai dub.

Quote from: Foggle on April 22, 2015, 08:48:28 PM
I will fight you if you're implying that Symphonia has better acting than Nier or Drakengard 3. :bleh:

:D

Quote from: Foggle on April 22, 2015, 08:48:28 PM
I will fight you if you're implying that Symphonia has better acting than Nier or Drakengard 3. :bleh:

From what I've seen, Drakengard 3's acting is about on par with Symphonia, which had a lot of good performances. Especially from Scott Menville and Cam Clarke.

As for NIS dubs, most seem to have normal sounding voices from what I've seen.

It could be worse.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BAtC1SzWSXg (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BAtC1SzWSXg)

Troy Baker will be remembered as many characters, but he'll always be Yuri Lowell from Tales of Vesperia to me. That game has one of the most all-over-the-place plots in the series but the cast is what made that game strong. The characters and their personal stories is great. And the way the game used cel-shading still makes it look like the best Tales game to me. Like, Graces, Xillia 1/2 and Zestiria are years later, and Vesperia still looks superior to me graphically.

Aside from Chaos Wars, nothing could beat the laughing scene from FFX.

Isn't Cam Clarke the guy who voiced Liquid Snake from MGS? I haven't heard him in much, but I do have to say his Liquid performance was pretty bad. :P

He's also Leonardo and Kaneda. He's done a LOT of voices.

Yeah, I'm looking him up right now and am recognizing a lot of things he's been in that I'm familiar with. :P

Wait, THE Leonardo? Jesus...

I keep on forgetting that PS2 had more than one Final Fantasy. What's everyone's opinion on XII?

I haven't played it, but I don't think I'd like it, since it apparently has the same battle system as Xenoblade Chronicles, which puts me to sleep.

I've never played that either. :sweat:

On another note, I've barely played any Action RPGs. My favorite type of RPG is still JRPG, cliches and all.

So, having still been pushing my way through FFVIII, I must ask... did anyone else who played this game find it incredibly easy to just spam GF monsters on any enemy that's remotely tough?

I think I did that. Probably that, spammed my best magic and spammed Limit Breaks.

FFVIII is probably the easiest modern Final Fantasy game because the junction system is so broken. Contrast that with the dull as dirt characters and boring story and I've never bothered to beat it. I just couldn't muster the energy to do it.

Quote from: gunswordfist on April 27, 2015, 06:26:56 PM
I think I did that. Probably that, spammed my best magic and spammed Limit Breaks.

The magic spells are also easy to exploit because you can just been drawing them from enemies. But the GF's are so powerful and so risk free to use. So whenever I'm in a boss fight, I just find myself constantly using them, and since they have their own HP, they also make for good shields thus allowing my teams to get out of big fights without getting hurt much. I know Limit Breaks are activated when you take enough damage, but I haven't yet used a single one because I keep dominating fights.

Quote from: Spark Of Spirit on April 27, 2015, 06:32:24 PM
FFVIII is probably the easiest modern Final Fantasy game because the junction system is so broken. Contrast that with the dull as dirt characters and boring story and I've never bothered to beat it. I just couldn't muster the energy to do it.

I feel ya. I'm really trying to give this game a chance, but I feel like it doesn't want me to. I always feel like I need to force myself to turn it on and play it, whereas I should be wanting to play it. But as easy as the gameplay is, I do think the characters and story are the main issues. There are, at most, maybe two characters in the whole game that I almost like.

FFVIII should be more recognized as one of the biggest video game disappointments of all time, than it currently is.

I can say it was a disappointment for me, but FFIX more than made up for any disappointment I had. It's not that it was a bad game, I just don't think it stacked up to VII at all and wasn't even close to the greatness of VI or the other SNES RPGs Square was known for.

I should have caught it earlier when I got the demo disc for it when I bought Brave Fencer Musashi and didn't really care for it then, but I guess I just hoped Square would have really tried to top themselves after trying so hard for VII. The final game didn't really do much more for me, unfortunately.

I do think VIII feels like a game that tried hard to top VII, so it honed in on a few of VII's greatest strengths while forgetting everything else. At the very least, VIII's soundtrack is solid and the graphics are a clear step up from VII. The character models don't look at all bad, as dated as they are now.

I thought I was the only one here who liked FF VIII's character models.

Quote from: gunswordfist on April 27, 2015, 10:32:45 PM
I thought I was the only one here who liked FF VIII's character models.

I prefer the style of I-VII's characters, but to say that VIII's aren't technically superior to VII's would be foolish.

I prefer VII's style as well and I've only played the demo for the game.

GSF willingly played FFVIII but has only played the demo for VII. The jokes write themselves.

I got FF VIII because they didn't have VII at the store. Seriously.

Final Fantasy V has arrived on Steam.

http://gematsu.com/2015/09/final-fantasy-v-coming-pc-september-24
(September 24 was yesterday, for those who maybe lose track.)

This is great news, and should have gotten a bit more attention than it seemed to have. Final Fantasy V is a hard game to get a hold of these days, but now it's on a good platform, for a reasonable price, and it's apparently a good version of the game.

Also, for those disappointed that Square never did full remakes of Final Fantasy V and VI... they are disappointed, too. And they hope to remedy that.

http://mynintendonews.com/2015/06/17/nomura-wants-more-final-fantasy-remakes-this-time-from-the-nintendo-era/

EDIT:

Upon learning more, the Steam version of FFV is based on the iOS port, which apparently ruined the graphical style by trying to update it. So it's kind of a shame that we don't have a good re-release of FFV. However, I also found this link:

http://wiiudaily.com/2014/10/early-final-fantasy-games-could-head-to-wii-u-virtual-console/

Square admits that they hope to get the GBA version of FFVI onto Wii U Virtual Console. If that's the case, you can easily imagine FFV for GBA, which people seem to call the best port of the game, getting a Virtual Console release as well. From what I hear, Nintendo seems to be trying to finally get the ball rolling on its Virtual Console releases, and considering that Square likes re-releasing its classics, I can easily imagine this plan coming to be.

I think that, for the classic games, instead of doing full 3D remakes, they should just do remakes more in the style of the original games. You know, like the PSP versions of I, II, and IV. That way, the style and feel of the original game can be retained, while being updated with modern technology. Once you take an old, 16-bit game and recreate it with lavish, 3D graphics... you might as well just be making a new game altogether. I mean, we don't even have a 2D version of III available.

The way VII is being remade is fine. After all, that game was 3D from the beginning.

Agreed. I'd love to see III, V & VI given the same beautiful treatment the others got in their PSP ports.

I mean, whenever I hear people talk about the 3D version of IV, they say it's a very good video game, but not the true IV experience. In contrast, the PSP remake, which is a true update of the original 2D game, gets nothing but love from fans of the original game. Same with I and II's PSP releases.

I'm surprised I never posted here before. I'm also appalled at the amount of blasphemy here about FF8. Joking aside, FF8 will always have a special place in my heart because it was my 1st rpg and the 1st time I ever saw myself in a character from a game. Around that time I was going through something fierce (I don't want to call it depression, but I guess you could call it that. I'd rather say it was more of a "not giving a shit moment"). Also, I got into rpg's pretty late as well. By the time I got into FF8 was roughly 2003-2004-ish. Before all of that I was always playing fighting games or I was outside playing basketball or with my little clique chasing ass (Hell, I didn't get my PS2 until 2005-ish). Anyway, FF8 was what got me into characters in the first place. Be it games, anime, cartoons or whatever. I was always an action first kinda guy. This was also where my love for graphics came from as well. And before I forget, yes, I did like the junction system. It was the drawing of magic that I could do without because it was so time consuming. But once I learned that when you drew 100 of everything, and how to set your GFs up for everyone, it opened the gates to everything else for me. Beating the game at low levels felt so good.

Afterwards came FF7, and boy there's a story from transitioning from 8 to 7, but I'll save that for another day. Then I went to 10 and hated that immediately. Tidus and Blitzball basically ruined that one for me.

Like I said, got my PS2 around 2005-ish, and was introduced to a quite a few beastly titles. Dragon Quest 8, Chrono Trigger and Final Fantasy 4 (I had that Final Fantasy Anthology I think it was that that had both CT and FF4 together).

Fast forward a bit, the decline for JRPG's came when I got my hands on Tales of the Abyss. Great game but towards the end became a long drawn out process that carried over to Tales of Vesperia. Everything I'd ever want that was in a Tales title was there. A grown-up badass as a protagonist. Great story, characters, music, and graphics, but Abyss was too much and by midpoint of Vesperia I was drained.

It goes without saying that I also turned away from Persona 3 and 4 because the dungeons were so damn long and I just didn't want to go through anymore long drawn out dungeons anymore. I forgot when but somewhere in there I tried out Jade Empire. Anyway, after Vesperia was when I decided to try out Mass Effect and I'd say the rest is history. Before getting into Persona 5, Mass Effect 2/3 were the last RPG's I played and enjoyed (and the only WRPGs that were worth my time. I hated everything done by Bethesda, still do).

That said my favorites would be:

Mass Effect 2
Persona 5
Chrono Trigger
Final Fantasy 4
Final Fantasy 8
Dragon Quest 8
Final Fantasy 7 (After 8 it took a long time for me to even attempt to play this. Graphics mattered to me that much)
Mass Effect 3 (despite it's crappy ending)
Mass Effect 1


Speaking of Persona 5, I'm currently doing my 3rd playthrough as we speak. I think I said it before that I'd like to create my own character in a JRPG, especially in a game such as Persona. These preset characters are okay, but their mannerisms leave a lot to be desired. Some of the choices on what to say are not what I really want my character to say at all, and then on top of that, even though they or lets just say Joker is a quiet type, but he rubs his hand through his hair acting aloof or nervous. If these characters are to represent me, then that's not me nor is that what I want. I'd also like to be able to choose a personality trait or something of that nature. I like badasses and cutthroats (Dante and Vergil comes to mind). Let me put their personality in the game in some for or fashion. WRPGs have the create your character but their options are limited and butt ugly where I'd rather stick with the default option (Mass Effect) but JRPGs could do so much because of how wacky their culture is (no offense) with the different styles they could include.

Just a small tangent/rant.

Super Mario RPG remake hits Nintendo Switch on November 17.