DC Direct To Video Animated Films

[Foggle]

Mark Hamill being back is great news, but I really don't trust the people who made Flashpoint Paradox, Assault on Arkham, and Son of Batman to do The Killing Joke justice. (I know some of the DC animated films have apparently been good, but I haven't yet seen one of those firsthand.) That said, should they decide to base the color scheme off of John Higgins' original coloring job, I'll watch it without question.

[gunswordfist]

Mark Hamill is back as the Joker!!!

I haven't seen any of these besides the ones I mentioned previously, but this is something that I could get behind.

Me too!

[LumRanmaYasha]

I'm always glad to hear Hamill's Joker. But like Foggle, I have my doubts that this film will be much good with DC's recent track record with their dtvs, especially since I already find the comic itself a bit indulgent with some of it's more "shocking" content (I still like/respect it though, don't get the wrong idea).

That said, should they decide to base the color scheme off of John Higgins' original coloring job, I'll watch it without question.

This.

[Avaitor]

I do have to admit, I'm not a big fan of how The Killing Joke has influenced this more recent "shock value for the sake of shock value" mentality in modern comics, or at least how many of today's writers in this regard use it as a template. Of course, this could also be traced back to Watchmen, but even that was a little smarter and more tasteful in that regard.

[Spark Of Spirit]

If it's as amazing as this scene, then I could be interested. It's better than anything the comics have ever done with the character.

I honestly don't give a flip about modern comics obsession with grimdark and gore. I want to watch heroes being heroes and villains being villains now. Is that so much to ask?

[Foggle]

I already find the comic itself a bit indulgent with some of it's more "shocking" content (I still like/respect it though, don't get the wrong idea).

I agree with this, though only in hindsight. Between Alan Moore himself saying that he thought he went too far, the much less surreal/creepy recolored version, and DC's obsession with having their cake and eating it too in regards to Barbara Gordon, I've been soured on the story a bit. But, if read with the proper context and original John Higgins coloring, it's definitely one of the greats.

I do have to admit, I'm not a big fan of how The Killing Joke has influenced this more recent "shock value for the sake of shock value" mentality in modern comics, or at least how many of today's writers in this regard use it as a template. Of course, this could also be traced back to Watchmen, but even that was a little smarter and more tasteful in that regard.

Yeah, most of my problems with modern Batman stem directly from this comic, but that's mostly just due to bad writers and stupid editors trying to recreate TKJ's success. The shock value worked in this particular instance for multiple reasons - this kind of thing hadn't really been done before, the character of Batgirl had been retired years before its publication, the surrealism in the art and coloring - but what DC did to Stephanie Brown a decade ago was unconscionable, and Arkham Knight has some of the most pathetic writing I've ever seen from the franchise.

I honestly don't give a flip about modern comics obsession with grimdark and gore. I want to watch heroes being heroes and villains being villains now. Is that so much to ask?

Check out Batman '66 and the most recent Batgirl run. That shit is dope.

[Avaitor]

Don't forget Sue Dibny.

[Spark Of Spirit]

I don't mind raised stakes or blood in action stories, but there just is a point where I'm rolling my eyes and getting sick of seeing the same hyper-violence and ultra-seriousness that reminds me of the stuff of recent shonen like Seraph of the End that I have no interest in.

Don't forget Sue Dibny.

How appropriate that it started one of the worst things DC has ever done.

[Foggle]

I don't mind raised stakes or blood in action stories, but there just is a point where I'm rolling my eyes and getting sick of seeing the same hyper-violence and ultra-seriousness that reminds me of the stuff of recent shonen like Seraph of the End that I have no interest in.

Oh, I completely agree. To me, Batman will always be Adam West and The Animated Series. I don't mind the darker or more violent stories, but only if they still have some semblance of heart or character to them. Grant Morrison, Chuck Dixon, Kelley Puckett, and Gail Simone were/are all really good at that.

[Spark Of Spirit]

I don't mind raised stakes or blood in action stories, but there just is a point where I'm rolling my eyes and getting sick of seeing the same hyper-violence and ultra-seriousness that reminds me of the stuff of recent shonen like Seraph of the End that I have no interest in.

Oh, I completely agree. To me, Batman will always be Adam West and The Animated Series. I don't mind the darker or more violent stories, but only if they still have some semblance of heart or character to them. Grant Morrison, Chuck Dixon, Kelley Puckett, and Gail Simone were/are all really good at that.

If you haven't seen Under the Red Hood or The Brave & The Bold, you totally should. They manage both sides of the character really well without indulging in a lot of the stupidity of retcon punches or "Stupidest Boy Dead" that DC was rolling in before they decided to burn it all down with the New 52.

[Foggle]

I've really been meaning to watch more Brave & The Bold. I read some of the comic tie-in a few days ago, and it's just so good. Exactly what I want from a superhero series.

Is Under The Red Hood really that good? I've always tried to avoid stories featuring Jason Todd whenever possible...

The New 52 was such a bad idea. At most, it should have been a separate line like Marvel's Ultimate universe. It's not even a full reset either; something like 50% of the old universe is somehow still canon, and it's almost impossible to know what. Why would they throw out nearly 70 years' worth of character development and continuity just like that...?

[gunswordfist]

Court Of The Owls is pretty much, if not the only thing I want to check out in New 52.

[Foggle]

Scott Snyder is a damn good Batman writer. Animal Man, Batgirl, and pre-lineup change Batwoman are also really good.

[Spark Of Spirit]

Some good things have come out of the New 52, no doubt.

I've really been meaning to watch more Brave & The Bold. I read some of the comic tie-in a few days ago, and it's just so good. Exactly what I want from a superhero series.

It's on Netflix and really, really, cheap on DVD. Give it a shot. I'm pretty sure you'd really like it if you like '60s Batman and BTAS. John Dimaggio's Aquaman is the only version of the character that is any good, IMO.

Is Under The Red Hood really that good? I've always tried to avoid stories featuring Jason Todd whenever possible...

It's the only good portrayal of the character. It gives him a better death and revival, clearer motivations, less obnoxious personality (just watch the clip), and actually manages to be sympathetic and at least willing to become something more than an anti-hero if he could surpass his demons. This is the version of the character I enjoy and only wish he had been seriously pursued instead of the pure gimmickry his revival was used for as just another grimdark antihero in the comics.

My only issue with the movie was that it should have been longer and was missing Tim Drake as the current Robin. Otherwise, it was the best of the animated films I saw.

The New 52 was such a bad idea. At most, it should have been a separate line like Marvel's Ultimate universe. It's not even a full reset either; something like 50% of the old universe is somehow still canon, and it's almost impossible to know what. Why would they throw out nearly 70 years' worth of character development and continuity just like that...?

This is what came of endlessly spinning your wheels with serious stories. The Golden Age and Silver Age worked because they were always standalone or arc stories. The Bronze Age and up were ongoing stories that repeatedly killed people and brought them back, retconned things over and over, and was obsessed with event stories that nobody wanted in the first place. It became a mess.

The thing is, with the New 52 they basically just did the same thing again and are going to run into the same problems. If you want a story with a beginning, middle, and end, you have to commit and go the whole way. That's how we got Kyle Rayner and Wally West. But since they can't do that, we just end up with stories that endlessly spin their wheels and go nowhere instead.

Basically, I'm a fan of episodic series and stories that tell a complete tale and come to an end. Comics used to be the first one, and I don't mind if they want to be the latter. But they haven't shown they can do it yet. At least, Marvel and DC have problems with it-I still ignore anything Spider-Girl after the original series ending. They even had to try and grimdark that universe up with the Spiderverse idiocy.

[gunswordfist]

Scott Snyder is a damn good Batman writer. Animal Man, Batgirl, and pre-lineup change Batwoman are also really good.

You don't have to tell me that. I'm having a love affair with American Vampire.

Also, did they take BTBATB off Netflix? Either way, watch it. It's my current favorite cartoon.