Whatcha Bleedin' Watchin'?

[Dr. Insomniac]

as opposed to Black Mirror's "derr hur science is bad and thomas edison is a witch" hot takes.

Brooker's milked the Black Mirror formula dry. How many times can the show say "Wouldn't it be spooky if your mind was in a computer?"

Right. I did enjoy the first couple of seasons, but I don't think that I even finished the first Netflix run. I think that Brooker has said everything he needs to say by now.

You can tell even Brooker's tired of his own formula. Black Museum was a pisstake at the show itself for example. Really, Black Mirror has difficulty catching up with the viewer. It knows the viewers expect a horrific dystopian ending with a dark message. It opened on an episode that ended with the message "some politicians are so horrible that bestiality could improve their standing with the public" and never stopped. But then it got tired, and we ended up with "is it really gay if you want to fuck your best friend's avatar?" or "Did you know Miley Cyrus hated being Hannah Montana?"

Speaking of, I played Bandersnatch recently, long after everyone else did. The Choose Your Own Adventure shit's fun, but once you get past that, it has nothing much to say beyond "How dare you control someone's life?!" And that message doesn't work either because the episode scolds you for making the wrong moves, and all the endings are bad ends. The Netflix ending was pretty funny though.

[Avaitor]

Watching Upload is almost like seeing Greg Daniels try to make his own version of The Good Place.

Well, they do have different goals- The Good Place is more about morality, and what by definition makes us a good person, and if we can change. Upload explores this a little, but it's more focused on how death can affect your loved ones and your legacy. I have to admit that I wasn't as interested in Nathan's story as I was seeing some of the other characters in here. We don't learn a whole lot about Luke, but it's implied that he doesn't have anyone checking on him from Lake View, and he only got accepted there due to his military status. That and the kid who struggles to see his friends grow up on earth while he stays perpetually twelve stuck to me.

I wasn't as impressed with the Nathan-Nora-Ingrid love triangle, and really didn't care for the murder mystery subplot. It kind of feels like these were added to justify the need to binge the show, and give it a serialized format. Neither element really works all that well IMO. They were already selling me with the show's concept of the afterlife. You don't need to keep trying to sell yourself further.

While Michael Schur's shows tend to be too unreasonably nice and sweet for their own good, Daniels isn't afraid to make his characters bastards, and mostly stay that way during the show. After struggling to truly love The Good Place, and having no use for Brooklyn Nine-Nine, I do appreciate the shades of darkness in Nathan, and how unpleasant Ingrid and Luke could be. I'll admit that at the same time, I don't really love any of these characters, but I'm curious to come back when season 2 comes out.

[Dr. Insomniac]

Watched the first episode of Dark. Very atmospheric show with a lot to take in. Not sure if I want more though. I've heard really good things about it, but not sure it's my kind of thing, even if I do like dark time-travel shit.

[talonmalon333]

as opposed to Black Mirror's "derr hur science is bad and thomas edison is a witch" hot takes.

Brooker's milked the Black Mirror formula dry. How many times can the show say "Wouldn't it be spooky if your mind was in a computer?"

Right. I did enjoy the first couple of seasons, but I don't think that I even finished the first Netflix run. I think that Brooker has said everything he needs to say by now.

You can tell even Brooker's tired of his own formula. Black Museum was a pisstake at the show itself for example. Really, Black Mirror has difficulty catching up with the viewer. It knows the viewers expect a horrific dystopian ending with a dark message. It opened on an episode that ended with the message "some politicians are so horrible that bestiality could improve their standing with the public" and never stopped. But then it got tired, and we ended up with "is it really gay if you want to fuck your best friend's avatar?" or "Did you know Miley Cyrus hated being Hannah Montana?"

Speaking of, I played Bandersnatch recently, long after everyone else did. The Choose Your Own Adventure shit's fun, but once you get past that, it has nothing much to say beyond "How dare you control someone's life?!" And that message doesn't work either because the episode scolds you for making the wrong moves, and all the endings are bad ends. The Netflix ending was pretty funny though.

Black Mirror is a bit hit or miss, for me. San Junipero was honestly one of my favorite episodes of television in the modern era, and I also loved a few other episodes (like Nosedive). However, aside from those select few episodes, I mostly find myself enjoying episodes, chewing on them for a minute or two afterward, and then never coming back to them. I wonder if we will get another season out of it.

Watching Upload is almost like seeing Greg Daniels try to make his own version of The Good Place.

Well, they do have different goals- The Good Place is more about morality, and what by definition makes us a good person, and if we can change. Upload explores this a little, but it's more focused on how death can affect your loved ones and your legacy. I have to admit that I wasn't as interested in Nathan's story as I was seeing some of the other characters in here. We don't learn a whole lot about Luke, but it's implied that he doesn't have anyone checking on him from Lake View, and he only got accepted there due to his military status. That and the kid who struggles to see his friends grow up on earth while he stays perpetually twelve stuck to me.

I wasn't as impressed with the Nathan-Nora-Ingrid love triangle, and really didn't care for the murder mystery subplot. It kind of feels like these were added to justify the need to binge the show, and give it a serialized format. Neither element really works all that well IMO. They were already selling me with the show's concept of the afterlife. You don't need to keep trying to sell yourself further.

While Michael Schur's shows tend to be too unreasonably nice and sweet for their own good, Daniels isn't afraid to make his characters bastards, and mostly stay that way during the show. After struggling to truly love The Good Place, and having no use for Brooklyn Nine-Nine, I do appreciate the shades of darkness in Nathan, and how unpleasant Ingrid and Luke could be. I'll admit that at the same time, I don't really love any of these characters, but I'm curious to come back when season 2 comes out.

I loved The Good Place. Might just be different tastes, but for me, it was one of those shows where just everything worked from start to finish. Do you think I should give Upload a shot?

[Avaitor]

I like The Good Place alright, but I struggle with Schur's shows. This is the best explanation as to why that I can think of, especially towards the bullshit that is Brooklyn Nine-Nine. His stuff is just too nice for its own good, to the point where it seems like it hurts him to add conflict to any of his characters. There's no punch, no fire.

Upload is alright. I think I wanted something different from it than what Greg Daniels and co wanted to do with it, but it's worth checking out.

[talonmalon333]

I like The Good Place alright, but I struggle with Schur's shows. This is the best explanation as to why that I can think of, especially towards the bullshit that is Brooklyn Nine-Nine. His stuff is just too nice for its own good, to the point where it seems like it hurts him to add conflict to any of his characters. There's no punch, no fire.

Upload is alright. I think I wanted something different from it than what Greg Daniels and co wanted to do with it, but it's worth checking out.

By the way Avaitor,, over the course of this pandemic, I finally saw Community when it went to Netflix. It's a good show, but I think for me it showcases why Schur and Daniel are my favorites in the sitcom business. I find that it comes off as kind of mean spirited very often. This, coupled with Chevy Chase being Chevy Chase in a show that's so hindered by him and his character, contrasts with something like The Office, which can be a downer at times but I rarely find to come off as unlikable (its first season being a noteworthy exception).

[Avaitor]

I like The Good Place alright, but I struggle with Schur's shows. This is the best explanation as to why that I can think of, especially towards the bullshit that is Brooklyn Nine-Nine. His stuff is just too nice for its own good, to the point where it seems like it hurts him to add conflict to any of his characters. There's no punch, no fire.

Upload is alright. I think I wanted something different from it than what Greg Daniels and co wanted to do with it, but it's worth checking out.

By the way Avaitor,, over the course of this pandemic, I finally saw Community when it went to Netflix. It's a good show, but I think for me it showcases why Schur and Daniel are my favorites in the sitcom business. I find that it comes off as kind of mean spirited very often. This, coupled with Chevy Chase being Chevy Chase in a show that's so hindered by him and his character, contrasts with something like The Office, which can be a downer at times but I rarely find to come off as unlikable (its first season being a noteworthy exception).

It's funny, I can't stand The Office in any capacity, but it's not quite semblatic of Schur's other works, mainly since he wasn't in charge of it. Besides just not clicking with the show's sense of humor, I grew instant apathy for the cast. I think this one comes down to humor being subjective. What I find funny won't be the same for everyone else.

I do like Community, though. Pierce and Chang are pretty unlikable, I'll admit, and the show wouldn't have been worse to drop either character earlier than they did (I know Chang never leaves, but bare with me here). I think the show did a good balance of adding introspection to the characters, allowing for their faults to make for good jokes and stories, but it wasn't THAT meanspirited. It's hardly Always Sunny, but as far as I'm concerned, that's better at what it does than any of these shows.

[Dr. Insomniac]

The Good Place was a weird watch. I didn't exactly like the jokes, but I was way into the characters and the lore. Particularly surprised by how much philosophy and theology was in this, an NBC sitcom. Wouldn't describe it as overly nice and sweet considering some of the plot twists, though I wouldn't describe his other shows as overly saccharine. When I think "overly nice" shows, I think stuff like Full House or 7th Heaven. Shows like that.

Wouldn't think of Community as that mean-spirited either. Has its moments, but certainly not as pessimistic as Dan Harmon's other show.

Anyway, I watched a couple episodes of Umbrella Academy, and it's a show I absolutely know I would have loved when I was 16. But now, it's fine. I think you can cut out 10-20 minutes out of each episode and get a tighter narrative out of them. Also a little distracting to see Ellen Page play the Jean Grey role. She's good in it, but kind of intrusive to see someone who played an X-Man in the movies show up in what is basically Gerard Way's X-Men.

[talonmalon333]

Wouldn't think of Community as that mean-spirited either. Has its moments, but certainly not as pessimistic as Dan Harmon's other show.

I mostly think Pierce was too unlikable. Writing a villain is one thing, but at the end of the day, I feel like the writers wanted me to like him which was just impossible.

[Avaitor]

Wouldn't think of Community as that mean-spirited either. Has its moments, but certainly not as pessimistic as Dan Harmon's other show.

I mostly think Pierce was too unlikable. Writing a villain is one thing, but at the end of the day, I feel like the writers wanted me to like him which was just impossible.

I can see that early on in the show, but by the end of its run, I think the show started to recognize that Pierce, and Chevy Chase as a whole, wasn't worth redeeming.

Although that's from what I recall, because I'll admit that it's been a while. But I could've sworn that his memorial episode wasn't exactly a celebration of the character.

[talonmalon333]

Wouldn't think of Community as that mean-spirited either. Has its moments, but certainly not as pessimistic as Dan Harmon's other show.

I mostly think Pierce was too unlikable. Writing a villain is one thing, but at the end of the day, I feel like the writers wanted me to like him which was just impossible.

I can see that early on in the show, but by the end of its run, I think the show started to recognize that Pierce, and Chevy Chase as a whole, wasn't worth redeeming.

Although that's from what I recall, because I'll admit that it's been a while. But I could've sworn that his memorial episode wasn't exactly a celebration of the character.

If I remember correctly, his memorial episode didn't condemn him, but you're right that it didn't celebrate him, either. I thought it was a better show without him, but unfortunately Troy left the show not much later.

[Foggle]

I adore Brooklyn Nine-Nine and don't think Community is mean-spirited at all, especially compared to Dan Harmon's other work. I also share the sentiment of Full House being my concept of an "overly nice" sitcom.

[Dr. Insomniac]

While I liked Pierce in a sitcom nemesis way, and Chase's real life disdain for the show added to his character in a way, I do think maybe the show should've had someone like Mike from Breaking Bad from the very beginning instead of all the way into season 5. Or Keith David's character.

[Avaitor]

I'm kind of surprised that Chevy Chase still gets as much work as he has over the years. From every account I can gather, he's one of the biggest assholes in the industry. The only cast he ever seemed to remotely get along with was the Vacation family. He's a good actor, but hardly worth the trouble, especially when you hear about the bullshit he instigated during his time on Community.

I still prefer Pierce to Chang at the end of the day, though. Pierce at least works as a foil, even if his shtick grew old by the end of his run. But on the other hand, they really ran out of things to do with Chang after the first season, and he became about as unlikable in no time.

[Dr. Insomniac]

Finished watching Umbrella Academy's second season. While it never shakes off the "Wait, this is just X-Men for the My Chemical Romance crowd" flavor, I had fun. It's a pretty whimsical show that takes great joy in its soundtrack and fight scenes.