Yu Yu Hakusho

[Spark Of Spirit]

Cliches are cliches for a reason. The difference with YYH is that he uses them as a starting point to go forward with instead of sticking with them the whole time.

For one, Yusuke becomes less fight-happy the further the series goes where by the end he's done and finished. Kuwabara starts out wanting to beat Yusuke but learns there's more to life than fighting and removes himself from the fray. Hiei is very chatty and even steps out of Chapter Black (after going out of his way to help Yusuke, by the way) only to return and do the right thing when he's truly needed. Kurama is a strategist who pays attention to his surroundings, which eventually leads him to understand other people and merely wanting to set peace with those he wronged in his past. It's why I enjoy the series so much.

[talonmalon333]

When we learned about the eye and how it can take control of the user if they aren't sufficiently prepared. Though I think the hint came when we learned the eye drained a ton of his power on top of it. It's a bit of a conceit, but it makes sense so I just go with it.

I still don't remember this. Do you remember any quotes?

As for the discussion you guys had earlier, that Yusuke was too trusting of Hiei right away... all I can really think of is that Yusuke has these weird relationships with foes and people he works with. He knows that Hiei is essentially working with them as a prison sentence, and as they say, he'll need all the help he can get.

[talonmalon333]

In the end, I think my main problem with Hiei in his first appearance is his drawing. He just looks pretty poorly drawn to me.

Maybe it's just the eyes. They seem so wrong at first.

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[Dr. Ensatsu-ken]

Once again, that's nothing really surprising. A lot of older long-running shows like this would have dirt-cheap budgets to work with during their initial production. If they survived along enough through popularity, than their budget would raise by a little bit (but only a little), and they could afford better art design and animation for the show. In this case, a lot of the early episodes of YYH had pretty crappy art and animation, which gradually got better as the series progressed.

[talonmalon333]

Once again, that's nothing really surprising. A lot of older long-running shows like this would have dirt-cheap budgets to work with during their initial production. If they survived along enough through popularity, than their budget would raise by a little bit (but only a little), and they could afford better art design and animation for the show. In this case, a lot of the early episodes of YYH had pretty crappy art and animation, which gradually got better as the series progressed.

I know, but I just think that Hiei design not only looks bad, but wrong. The early episodes did work with a cheaper budget, but Kurama's design was still right, even if it improved later on.

[Spark Of Spirit]

The early episodes in most anime have that problem, but they eventually get most of them ironed out. The direction in YYH gets better and better as the series goes to the point where it actually saves the last arc from the source material. It's quite impressive, in my opinion.

[gunswordfist]

Hiei's actual reason for helping out Yusuke in the Saint Beasts arc made sense, in that both he and Kurama basically either had the choice of working for Koenma to redeem themselves for their crimes, or face other-worldly punishment. Obviously they'd pick the option that allowed them to actually do shit, even though in Hiei's case its not like he really wanted to help out Yusuke at that time.

The thing that didn't make sense was how Yusuke was so easily trusting of Hiei, when they had been clear enemies in their last encounter, and Hiei even went as far as to kidnap Keiko and attempt to turn her into a demon. It just never made sense that Yusuke would completely forget about something like that. With Kurama, it at least made sense that he got along with the team right away since he was already established to be a good guy in the first arc he appeared in, when he helped out Yusuke.

At any rate, both Hiei and Kurama became awesome characters in their own right as the series progressed, but I do still feel that their inclusion was a bit shoe-horned in during the Saint Beasts arc, and while it still makes sense from a story standpoint,  I do think that there should have been a bit more hostility between Hiei and the rest of the group (aside from Kurama who had a better understanding of him), and some time should have been spent on them having trust issues with one another, rather than Hiei pretty much feeling like a regular team member within just a single arc.

Yeah, I was thinking about how Yusuke trusted Hiei with his and the others' lives during that falling ceiling trap part right when they first entered the castle. That made no sense.

[Dr. Ensatsu-ken]

To be fair, the circumstances made it so that he kind of had no choice but to trust Hiei. Even if Hiei stayed to hold the wall up, they all would have been crushed eventually after they ran out of strength. At the time, Hiei was the fastest member by far, and the only one who could possibly reach the switch to stop the trap in time, so it was either a choice between trusting Hiei or death. That said, it would have worked better in that scene if it showed Yusuke carefully considering whether he should trust Hiei with that responsibility or not, and perhaps think back to how they were previously enemies, or at least show him begrudgingly asking Hiei to go for the switch. The way he asked him, it felt like he had complete faith in Hiei, and didn't even show a sign of considering that he was his enemy just a little while before that point, which to me was pretty strange.

[talonmalon333]

I don't know. Yusuke gave his reasoning for believing Hiei would pull the switch, and I kind of liked it.

[gunswordfist]

To be fair, the circumstances made it so that he kind of had no choice but to trust Hiei. Even if Hiei stayed to hold the wall up, they all would have been crushed eventually after they ran out of strength. At the time, Hiei was the fastest member by far, and the only one who could possibly reach the switch to stop the trap in time, so it was either a choice between trusting Hiei or death. That said, it would have worked better in that scene if it showed Yusuke carefully considering whether he should trust Hiei with that responsibility or not, and perhaps think back to how they were previously enemies, or at least show him begrudgingly asking Hiei to go for the switch. The way he asked him, it felt like he had complete faith in Hiei, and didn't even show a sign of considering that he was his enemy just a little while before that point, which to me was pretty strange.

Yeah, the last sentence is what I am talking about. Yusuke smiled at him and said he trusted him. That made no sense.

[talonmalon333]

To be fair, the circumstances made it so that he kind of had no choice but to trust Hiei. Even if Hiei stayed to hold the wall up, they all would have been crushed eventually after they ran out of strength. At the time, Hiei was the fastest member by far, and the only one who could possibly reach the switch to stop the trap in time, so it was either a choice between trusting Hiei or death. That said, it would have worked better in that scene if it showed Yusuke carefully considering whether he should trust Hiei with that responsibility or not, and perhaps think back to how they were previously enemies, or at least show him begrudgingly asking Hiei to go for the switch. The way he asked him, it felt like he had complete faith in Hiei, and didn't even show a sign of considering that he was his enemy just a little while before that point, which to me was pretty strange.

Yeah, the last sentence is what I am talking about. Yusuke smiled at him and said he trusted him. That made no sense.

Well... alright. I just made a post addressing that, but okay.

[gunswordfist]

Yeah, I know Yusuke had no choice and all but he seemed to genuinely trust a guy who attacked his girlfriend a few months ago with a sword. That's what's weird.

Also, it's funny how Hiei was like the most 1-dimensional villain in the series.

[Dr. Ensatsu-ken]

Yeah, I know Yusuke had no choice and all but he seemed to genuinely trust a guy who attacked his girlfriend a few months ago with a sword. That's what's weird.

It was just 2 weeks ago at that point, actually. The dub screwed up when it said that Yusuke had trained with Genkai for 6 months. He only trained with her for about a week. And that was pretty much the only gap of time that separated the Three Artifacts arc from the Saint Beasts arc.

[gunswordfist]

Yeah, I know Yusuke had no choice and all but he seemed to genuinely trust a guy who attacked his girlfriend a few months ago with a sword. That's what's weird.

It was just 2 weeks ago at that point, actually. The dub screwed up when it said that Yusuke had trained with Genkai for 6 months. He only trained with her for about a week. And that was pretty much the only gap of time that separated the Three Artifacts arc from the Saint Beasts arc.

Whoa...It's retarded that Yusuke could get that much stronger in a week. I can see why they changed it, even though 6 months seems too long. I swore they said it was like 2 months.

[Spark Of Spirit]

Yusuke wasn't very smart before the Dark Tournament arc. He made a lot of dumb mistakes.