The Legend of Zelda Series

[Dr. Ensatsu-ken]

I don't think that people have forgotten about the game. It's just that people on this board don't tend to talk about it that much since they don't care for it, whereas I still haven't played it yet.

At the end of the day, though, it tried something different, and even if it didn't pay off, at least Nintendo had the opportunity to experiment with the series rather than rehashing the same thing. It's the same thing with Zelda 2, in that even though I don't like that game, I still respect Nintendo for taking the risk in the first place.

Also, just for the record, the game has a Meta-score of over 90, and I do know that it has a solid fan-base, so it's not like it was anywhere near being a disaster or anything like that. It's more like a minor set-back for the series, at most.

[Nel_Annette]

You're not alone. Whenever people mention "the last 3D Zelda game", Twilight Princess is the first one that comes to mind. I doubt I'll ever finish Skyward Sword.

[talonmalon333]

I don't think that people have forgotten about the game. It's just that people on this board don't tend to talk about it that much since they don't care for it, whereas I still haven't played it yet.

At the end of the day, though, it tried something different, and even if it didn't pay off, at least Nintendo had the opportunity to experiment with the series rather than rehashing the same thing. It's the same thing with Zelda 2, in that even though I don't like that game, I still respect Nintendo for taking the risk in the first place.

Also, just for the record, the game has a Meta-score of over 90, and I do know that it has a solid fan-base, so it's not like it was anywhere near being a disaster or anything like that. It's more like a minor set-back for the series, at most.

It really wasn't that different. It's the traditional 3D Zelda style but with its own spin. Basically, it's not anymore different than Majora's Mask, Wind Waker, or Twilight Princess.

As for reception, it does seem to be the least liked 3D Zelda.

[Dr. Ensatsu-ken]

It went full on motion controls for the first time, and all of the gameplay mechanics were designed around that. That was a HUGE gamble on Nintendo's part. How is changing the way that you actually go about playing the game not that different?

Furthermore, you contradict yourself by complaining about design choices but then responding to me that the game is apparently not that different from the Zelda games that you like better. That doesn't make any sense. If what you meant to complain about with design choices were motion controls, then the answer is that Nintendo was just attempting to do something new to change the way Zelda games are played. It may have not gone well, but they made the effort to see if it would work or not in the first place. That's "what they were thinking." But if the complaint is about the game getting boring because of the formula, clearly it must be doing something different there as well, if it's not holding up as well as previous games. From what I've heard, they made the overworld far more streamlined and uniform than in past games, which I would consider a huge difference.

Also, as for reception: http://www.metacritic.com/game/wii/the-legend-of-zelda-skyward-sword

How exactly is a 9.3 average from critics and a 7.9 average from users considered weak reception? There are certainly Zelda games with worse scores than that. I've also seen people praise this game on other online communities, so while it might not be a fan-favorite Zelda, it definitely still has its share of fans. So where are you getting this universal hatred of the game idea, from? Honestly, at least half of the negativity that I've seen towards this game comes from this site alone. I've certainly run into plenty of other people who don't like the game either, but not any more than people who did actually enjoy it, so where exactly are you getting your general consensus from?

[talonmalon333]

All I said about reception was that it's the least liked 3D Zelda game. Nothing about weak reception or universal hatred. A Zelda game that's not as well received as its predecessors can still be considered a good game in its own right.

As for gameplay, you'd need to play the game to see what I mean. I didn't contradict myself. Like I said, it's "the traditional 3D Zelda style but with its own spin". It's firmly rooted in what Ocarina of Time established, just as every other 3D game is, but like them it does things that separate it. It does have its streamlined levels and motion controls, but the overall flow of the game is the same as before. To me it even feels like it's just going through the motions half of the time.

[Dr. Ensatsu-ken]

All I said about reception was that it's the least liked 3D Zelda game. Nothing about weak reception or universal hatred. A Zelda game that's not as well received as its predecessors can still be considered a good game in its own right.

You said "least well liked," but everything else in your posts paints the game out to be much worse than its actual reception really is. The whole point of you even brining up the game in the first place was to say how forgettable it was, but my point is that the game has its strong share of fans, so other than this board, it's probably not that forgotten.

As for gameplay, you'd need to play the game to see what I mean. I didn't contradict myself. Like I said, it's "the traditional 3D Zelda style but with its own spin". It's firmly rooted in what Ocarina of Time established, just as every other 3D game is, but like them it does things that separate it. It does have its streamlined levels and motion controls, but the overall flow of the game is the same as before. To me it even feels like it's just going through the motions half of the time.

You especially mentioned the "what we're they thinking" line, which indicates either broken or poorly designed gameplay, like having mechanics that flat out don't work but are necessary to get through the game, or having gameplay puzzles that are flat-out mops single to figure out unless you specifically had instructions for what to do (like in Simon's Quest). If the game has such issues, you should mention specific examples to highlight what you mean. Otherwise it just sounds like you're complaining about the general design of the game, which according to you is no different from previous games in the series.

[talonmalon333]

You said "least well liked," but everything else in your posts paints the game out to be much worse than its actual reception really is. The whole point of you even brining up the game in the first place was to say how forgettable it was, but my point is that the game has its strong share of fans, so other than this board, it's probably not that forgotten.

That might largely have to do with my disappointment of the game. I was excited about it but ended up getting a game that's just average. It's forgettable, but it's not actually bad. I even mentioned that it has sparks of greatness in my initial post.

I also noticed that it seems to be the only 3D Zelda that didn't have fans praising it everywhere. Twilight Princess was a huge deal, as was Wind Waker despite the initial controversy of its graphics. Majora's Mask wasn't as big at first but we know that game's popularity developed as the years went on. I just can't imagine Skyward Sword getting the same treatment as Majora's Mask, but maybe I'll be proven wrong.

You especially mentioned the "what we're they thinking" line, which indicates either broken or poorly designed gameplay, like having mechanics that flat out don't work but are necessary to get through the game, or having gameplay puzzles that are flat-out mops single to figure out unless you specifically had instructions for what to do (like in Simon's Quest). If the game has such issues, you should mention specific examples to highlight what you mean. Otherwise it just sounds like you're complaining about the general design of the game, which according to you is no different from previous games in the series.

My James Rolfe reference wasn't in response to the controls or world (even though I have a few problems with both). There is a huge amount of little issues that just add up to a lot of frustration. Some of them honestly seem like developer oversights. I'll take a few examples and try to explain it as best as I can, and I'll do so without mentioning anything spoiler-based. But overall, it really is a game you'd have to play to see what I mean.

There are various different kinds of treasures and insects that you can collect in the game. You know that Zelda tradition of, when you get an item, it plays that "You got an item!" five second tune, followed by a message box telling you about it? Skyward Sword does that for each treasure and each insect when you discover one of them for the first time, and after the message box, the game automatically brings you to your inventory to show the number for that treasure/insect being raised by one. And there are about 15-20 different kinds of treasures, as well as 15-20 different kinds of insects. So you have to sit through this every time you discover one. The process of "obtaining" a treasure/insect takes about 10 seconds because of this, but that adds up because, combining the treasures and insects together, that makes for 30-40 pointless ten second intervals.

Now, that alone would be a minor nuisance. However, to top that, any time you stop playing and turn the game off, the game "forgets" that you discovered any of those treasures/insects (even though they are still in your inventory). So, every time you reload your game, you have to sit through these again and again. Now that ten second process really adds up because you are constantly discovering items every time you reload the game. There was a similar oversight in Twilight Princess, but it only applied to rupees (which wasn't nearly as annoying since there are only, like, five different types of rupees, and the typical green rupee wasn't even affected by it). And with Skyward Sword, they actually corrected that issue, but in place of it we had the treasure and insect issue which is far more present. It's like the night and day transitions in Simon's Quest.

That's just one of the issues I have with the game. There's also the in-game partner which is like a much, much worse version of Navi. Everyone always complained about Navi so one has to think that Nintendo heard these issues. But I mean it when I say the partner in this game is very similar, only she talks much more, and unlike Navi, you can't always just ignore her. Frequently she'll just pop out on her own to explain things (and very often, she'll do this after the game already explained it through text, so all she's doing is reiterating). She also starts beeping you when you are low on hearts to tell you that your hearts are low, and this is when you're already hearing the traditional Zelda beeping starts when your hearts are low. So basically, you're listening to two beeping sounds when your hearts are low.

Hopefully my explanation above made sense since I'm not always good at explaining things. There are also parts of the game where I feel they went too far with the motion controls, such as with certain controls and some puzzles.

[Dr. Ensatsu-ken]

For the record, not only MM, but TWW also wasn't that well-received by fans initially. This was reflected in its relatively poor sales during the first few years of its release.

Also, I'd like to remind you that for several months after its relate you claimed that you found the game legitimately good, you only changed your stance conveniently after most other people on this board said that rhey didn't like the game.

As for what you described about the treasures and collectables, it'd only be fair to mention that MM forced you to loose all of your loose items in order to save your progress. Granted that, it's not 10-second clips that you have to keep sitting through again to get them back, but the fact that you even have to go out of your way to get them back is ridiculous, and to me that was a big problem with the game, even if the design was intentional. In contrast, what you just described to me would be problematic, but I'd honestly take that over the game forcing you to recollect all of your non-essential items every time at you saved (not counting the owl statues).

As for going too far with the motion controls, I can certainly understand that complaint, but my whole point in my initial post is that even if the controls didn't work out that well, I respect Nintendo for trying something different and taking the risk to enhance the gameplay experience. Even through failures, they will. Learn insiteful things for future projects.

[talonmalon333]

Also, I'd like to remind you that for several months after its relate you claimed that you found the game legitimately good, you only changed your stance conveniently after most other people on this board said that rhey didn't like the game.

That didn't change. I still consider it to be a good game. I just don't think it's comparable with most of its predecessors. I don't know you think I'd just follow what everyone else says. In fact I'm likely the only one here who beat the game, so my issues with the game are probably very different from most people's here.

As for what you described about the treasures and collectables, it'd only be fair to mention that MM forced you to loose all of your loose items in order to save your progress. Granted that, it's not 10-second clips that you have to keep sitting through again to get them back, but the fact that you even have to go out of your way to get them back is ridiculous, and to me that was a big problem with the game, even if the design was intentional. In contrast, what you just described to me would be problematic, but I'd honestly take that over the game forcing you to recollect all of your non-essential items every time at you saved (not counting the owl statues).

Majora's Mask only made you lose things like arrows and bombs (rupees can be stored in the bank). I never found that to be problematic because they are easy to recollect. You basically just find them on a whim while naturally making progress.

[Dr. Ensatsu-ken]

When you need them for solving mandatory puzzles or completing dungeons, it most certainly is a big deal (and I never mentioned rupees since I know about the bank, obviously). You either have to waste money buying them again, or just complete the dungeon in one-go, which is problematic on your first run through if you don't know what you're doing yet are restricted to a time limit.

[talonmalon333]

When you need them for solving mandatory puzzles or completing dungeons, it most certainly is a big deal (and I never mentioned rupees since I know about the bank, obviously). You either have to waste money buying them again, or just complete the dungeon in one-go, which is problematic on your first run through if you don't know what you're doing yet are restricted to a time limit.

Honestly, I don't know when you played Majora's Mask, so I wasn't sure how well you remembered the bank, being that it's not one of the biggest parts of the game.

As for items, I still think the game provides plenty when you need them. In fact, for dungeons, right next to the owl statues you always find jars filled with arrows and fairies (and I think bombs). Either way, I suppose it's just a matter of opinion, but I think it's a bit different. I like the limitations that Majora's Mask puts on the player and think it makes for a good game system. With those Skyward Sword things, some of it just feels like developer mistakes.

[Spark Of Spirit]

Zelda Wii U footage

- sail cloth returns
- Miyamoto calls the horse 'Epona'
- swing your sword and fire arrows while on horseback
- insect and animal life throughout the world
- pick/eat apples
- metallic sound when you hit an enemy means you hit the right spot for damage
- jump off the horse and go into slow-mo for aiming with bow and arrow
- reconfirmed for 2015

It looks like the anti-Skyward Sword, honestly.

They also confirmed Star Fox will be out before Zelda in 2015. Weird.

[Foggle]

Zelda Wii U footage

omg

- sail cloth returns

omg

They also confirmed Star Fox will be out before Zelda in 2015. Weird.

omg

[Foggle]

this gameplay footage is giving me a stiffy

I'm glad this genre (humongous, truly open world adventure) has finally become viable with the new gen

this is looking like it'll be my game of 2015 along with metal gear solid

[Spark Of Spirit]

It looks like ALBW only in full 3D. I really can't wait to see how far they go with that concept.