Batman: The Animated Series

[Avaitor]

I'm at the point of my B:TAS rewatch where I've finished the pre-Adventures of Batman & Robin episodes, which means that I'm finally trying out my Blu of Mask of the Phantasm.

Damn, this looks good. The movie's as terrific as ever, too.

[Avaitor]

I haven't picked up the Blu set yet, and I'm not sure if I will, since I already spent a decent amount to get the series on DVD, and rewatched the whole thing not too long ago. What I've seen does look like it's worth the upgrade if I was made of money, but I won't be able to get to it anytime soon.

However, I did go to Fathom Event's screening of MOTP on Monday. If I have to make a complaint, it's that seeing it on the big screen really shows off the film's limitations in animation- it's very apparent that it was made for video, and despite some strong moments it comes off as a little dim. Besides that, I had a great time. All of the beats hit just as well, if not better, on a big screen with a decent crowd in attendance. I think the sound quality was especially on point- besides the score, you just get a chance to appreciate the brilliant voice work in the film. Conray, Delany, and Zimbalist's performances especially sell it.

I'd do it again, primarily if I could convince someone to come with me. I had a great time solo, but it's worth going to with an audience.

[Dr. Insomniac]

According to rumors, the engine's revving up again on BTAS.

Don't know how to feel. It'll probably be fun to watch if they bring back all the old writers and Timm doesn't put in a Bruce/Barbara romance, but I think the show's had its time and that time's passed. If they make a Batman cartoon, I'd want it to either go in a radical direction or play with or distill the Batman comic runs that came out since BTAS and the DCAU ended. Such as taking the best parts and ideas of the Morrison, Snyder, and King runs and refining that into its own cartoon. While time and writers mining it for themes and references have turned BTAS into the traditional Batman series for better and worse, and I'm afraid bringing back the show means it won't be the spearhead in innovating Batman like it used to, and it'll just be the Batman show that reminds you of a show I watched as a kid. Even back two decades ago, ending TNBA on their own terms and starting up Batman Beyond was their way of saying you can't do BTAS-style adventures forever without changing up the formula. It's like when rumors about bringing back the 90s X-Men show happened a couple months ago, where that could be fun, but it sounded like such a huge step backward compared to the Hickman train X-fans are currently riding on. I don't want the band to come back together if all they're doing is singing old songs. I want them to reignite the flame and make a show that could break as much new ground now as the show did back in the early 90s.

[Dr. Ensatsu-ken]

I'm pretty much of the same mind. On the one hand it's neat to see something great from the past make a comeback, especially since the DCAU Batman is my favorite iteration of that character. Furthermore, they would have a bit less restrictions in terms of censorship than they used to. That said, I then remember that I don't trust modern Bruce Timm at all to make something that isn't about exploiting how dark or gritty it is, and he will probably be heavily involved with this. Also, looking at the Batman and Harley Quinn movie doesn't exactly leave me optimistic as to what the actual returning series will look like.

[Avaitor]

Yeah, most of what Timm has done in recent years, primarily the pieces with mixed ties to the DCAU, gives me any confidence in this going well. The fact that a significant portion of the cast is no more also hurts my enthusiasm. Although I'd be more interested if this was just a short or even a movie, but a whole new season or two sounds like it'll do more harm than good.

I'd be be more interested in returning to Batman Beyond, but even that I can take or leave. The DCAU's time in the light has passed, and I'm honestly pretty okay with it. Warner/DC seemed to be as well, until B:TAS has recently started to make them some nice nostalgia-oriented money.

[Dr. Insomniac]

I mean, I think with regularly putting Conroy and Hamill on Batman projects, and having Dini writing Batman things like the Arkham games and the recent Adventure Continues comic, they always had their finger on the button when it came to making more BTAS. It was just a matter of when than if. And I did ask myself why they never made a Batman Beyond sequel or series of movies. Was it really more important and lucrative to keep making those DC Animated Movies instead?

And if we are just bringing back the DCAU, can't we do something we didn't do prior? Finally give Diana her own show, do something with all those Milestone characters besides Static, or something off the wall like Books of Magic or Seven Soldiers of Victory?

[Avaitor]

Now that I think about it, it's a little surprising that they're going back to smaller scales with B:TAS after each season of Justice League was bigger than the last. That may be a good thing though, as JLU did get exhausting, although I do much prefer it to how Young Justice turned out.

I would like to see them try other characters instead, but it makes the most sense to go back to what they and everyone else knows and loves with Batman. I do wonder if they'll go back to the noir-ish elements of the earlier episodes, or stick to something closer to TNBA.

[Dr. Insomniac]

Probably since McDuffie died and he was the one steering the wheel on JLU, and they're likely JL'd out after all those DTV movies.

I think going back to basics is a double-edged sword. It'll likely sell well and appeal to the traditional Batman fans, but you don't want to go too far in the "It's weekdays afternoons in 1992 all over again!", because if you put too much effort in making stories that feel like the old episodes, you end up fueling the question of why the viewers shouldn't watch reruns instead. And since we know how DCAU Bruce's story ultimately culminates, and it's hard to think of any interesting enough gaps in his timeline that are worth covering, there's also the pitfall in making retroactive filler.

I guess if there's a gap worth exploring, you could do something like what the Batman/Catwoman comic by Tom King is doing right now, make a show that takes place between the end of JLU and the beginning of Batman Beyond featuring a Bruce who burns bridges with his old friends, while showing occasional flash forward episodes to after BB showing it wasn't all for naught and he can finally break bread with Dick, Selina, and Diana, scenes that BB and JLU's future episodes neglected to do. Something more character-driven and somber, but still with plenty of action in-between. Really doubt that's something WB wants to do though. It'll likely be more in the style of TNBA, but they add in Damian or something.

[Peanutbutter]

Now that I think about it, it's a little surprising that they're going back to smaller scales with B:TAS after each season of Justice League was bigger than the last. That may be a good thing though, as JLU did get exhausting, although I do much prefer it to how Young Justice turned out.

I would like to see them try other characters instead, but it makes the most sense to go back to what they and everyone else knows and loves with Batman. I do wonder if they'll go back to the noir-ish elements of the earlier episodes, or stick to something closer to TNBA.

Yeah, sad to say but while I liked YJ's first two seasons, Season Three just spread the show's scale out far too wide. It's also bloated with way too many characters. I still say the 2nd time skip did absolutely nothing. It'd be nice if Season 4 only happens a few weeks after the end of 3 but I'm not holding my breath. And GregX was way wrong about The Light, they still suck.

[Dr. Insomniac]

The problem with the Light beyond how much they over rely on the "the heroes think they won, but their actions were secretly part of our plan" cliche is they're built on reveals rather than characterization ever since season 1. Half of the first season covered them in silhouettes before revealing the master villains of this DC show are people like Lex and Vandal, and their master plan is to conquer the galaxy, and one of their secrets is their working for and planning to backstab Darkseid. And the show plays all these up to be surprises like it's supposed to be a twist that it's Lex Luthor of all people who wants any of this done. YJ isn't a show that plays fast and loose with the DC mythos. It just takes the typical "Justice League and their young allies fight the Legion of Doom" plot but stretched to at least four whole seasons. And that would be okay on its own, but such a formula lives and dies on the characters, and characters aren't this show's strong suit in lieu of most of the character development happening during time skips or shifts in personality happening due to an overuse of mind control.

[Peanutbutter]

I will never understand Greg Weisman's or Brandon Vietti's logic in doing the time skips. Robbing us of the characterizations as you mentioned robbed of us of so much tension. Oh, Tula aka Aquagirl sacrificed herself? Wow, can't wait for the usual flashback when that episode com---oh, what's that??? I have to buy a PS3 game with PS1 graphics just to know what happened to her? Yeah, I sure was torn up over her even though we only had one episode.

Seriously, it was only a few episodes later they revealed Aqualad didn't even defect so her being dead at zero lasting weight over any of the cast which means she might as well have been left alive or just not brought up in the first place. Then there's how much a waste of time they did with Ocean Master. So much tension and genuine emotion could have been explored from his connection to Aqualad's mentor and what his reactions along with his finding out that Black Manta was his father. Nope, neither happens. The latter happening offscreen was obscene. I still like Invasion overall, but that mess rendering Ocean Master completely useless culminating in him being uncermoniusly killed off in two seconds in his one appearance in the Outsiders irks me.

[Dr. Insomniac]

Describing Caped Crusader as "More BTAS than BTAS!" sounds intriguing but also concerning. BTAS was never a show that relied on excess.

[GregX]

And GregX was way wrong about The Light, they still suck.

Ach, leave me out of this. It's time for 'Succession'.

[Dr. Insomniac]

So Brubaker's the head writer of Caped Crusader.

[GregX]

So Brubaker's the head writer of Caped Crusader.

I like Brubaker a lot. A lot.

But J.J. Abrams... I despise. His presence just fills me with dread. I don't know about this, but I'll give it a shot.