Ninja Gaiden Series

[Dr. Ensatsu-ken]

Yeah, it really goes to show how much the landscape of gaming has changed in just a decade since then. I mean, while the game was ridiculous even back then, it still wasn't that uncommon to have such "gamey" games also be huge AAA titles that were highly anticipated releases. These days that just doesn't happen anymore for mainstream titles.

I'm somewhat different in preference from TGBS in that I do very much prefer the balance and intricate design of the original game, but I also do really appreciate the unrestrained insanity of the sequel. The game gives no fucks and throws everything at you without rhyme or reason, yet while that sounds like a disaster on paper, it strangely works more often than it doesn't.

He said it best when he described this game as the purest translation of a classic NES game to a modern(ish) 3D platform.

[Dr. Ensatsu-ken]

So, apparently Team Ninja has admitted that most of the source code for the XBOX/360 versions of the first two Ninja Gaiden games has been lost, which is why they keep re-releasing the Sigma versions:

https://www.theverge.com/platform/amp/2021/3/25/22350928/ninja-gaiden-master-collection-koei-tecmo-black-game-preservation-data-loss

Guess we can chalk that up to yet another case of the shitty state of game preservation.

[Mustang]

Hmm, I was watching someone play Ninja Gaiden 3 Razor's Edge, and the level he was on looked very tedious; Dealing with boats and turrets (?).

To get that out of the way, I have avoided NG3 at all cost because of word of mouth and reviews way back. Looking at it now, and going by memory of NG1/2, what was wrong with Razor's Edge again? If you'd ask me to give a 1st impression off of what little bits I saw, I would tell you it looks like NG2 but the level design is worst. Combat looks fairly similar with Ryu doing this weird slide, but considering I can "now" put up with rolling (barely) I can put up with that.

I say all that because considering a lot of the games I've put up with compared to NG3/RE, it don't look so bad. Almost looks like a case of "being the same as the previous one".

I'm tempted to get this master series, but I dread both Sigma's. There not bad, but I hate playing as the other characters. I can't remember if you were forced to play as them, but I do recall being character locked in in certain points. I guess bits of NG is better than no NG at all. We'll see.

[Dr. Ensatsu-ken]

I meant to respond to this earlier, but completely forgot. Basically, for me, the main issue is that the core gameplay loop is significantly less interesting than the prior two games. What I mean by that is there was more to the gameplay than just fast-paced combat and combos. While Razor's Edge did do a lot to add back depth into the combat, it comes off feeling rather hollow because the end result is still very monotonous to me.

For example, the vanilla version of NG3 only had one melee weapon available to you at any given time (the Dragon Sword or some alternative sword that played identically), and a very selective group of enemies making the variety pretty limited, even for a relatively short campaign mode. Beyond that, though, it streamlined everything too much. There was no more inventory of potions or other consumable items and no shops to upgrade weapons. Everything was now handled through a streamlined skill tree. They made it so that enemies no longer drop essence upon death that you can either consume for currency, health, or Ninpo, or choose to absorb to fast-charge a UT, which was now just a one-and-done move that would build up over a certain number of kills and didn't require any skill to connect (just charge it and Ryu would instantly execute a certain number of enemies in response). This one change has HUGE ramifications on the flow of combat and core gameplay. Now you aren't given any kind of immediate in the moment choice but instead have to play a certain way and then use your power move when the game dictates that you can. A lot of the fun of the first two games were skillfully using spacing/positioning and a keen sense of timing to chain a series of UT's together to take out a hoarde of powerful enemies. The same can be applied to Ninpo, which again is a use-it-or-lose-it move that you can activate once after some build-up and again is an auto-killer that doesn't regard positioning or any kind of skillful use.

The Steel-on-Bone mechanic from the base version of the game that just randomly activated an execution animation, many time in mid-combo, whether you wanted it to or not was thankfully drastically changed to be a counter to grab moves. And while that is actually a positive change, it ironically became this game's much less interesting version of chaining UTs. It's funny because some people defended the change to the essence/UT system as a way for the developers to stop you from spamming chaining powerful moves together, but effectively SoB in Razor's Edge was the same thing anyways, since you could easily bait a grab move and chain together a series of instant-kills which trivialized various combat encounters. The thing is, you'll probably find yourself doing this more than standard combat anyways, because the game just throws gauntlets of enemies at you in drab, barren, and sterile combat arenas until it decides that you can move on.

I mean, the NG series never had stellar level design, but it did still have an action-adventure approach to said levels which you really feel missing in the third game. You could actually use the terrain to your advantage in those games, such as luring enemies into a more cramped environment and taking them all out at once with a weapon or UT that had a large AOE, or charging a UT against approaching IS or TAC Ninjas approaching you while taking cover behind a wall to avoid being interrupted by any projectiles, and then unleashing it on them as soon as they turned the corner. Levels were still levels, effectively. In NG3, they are either highly scripted set-pieces or glorified flat arenas, which gets boring fast.

So to answer your question, yes, Razor's Edge does have a lot more weapons and moves that you can use in combat and on a surface level looks fun. And, to be fair, it does have its fans, and maybe you would be one of them. But unless you are the type of person who likes to expriment with combos (which isn't easy in this game given how aggressive the enemies are), you will quickly find yourself relying on the most basic and safest strategies and then subsequently get bored with how one-note the gameplay loop feels.

It's maybe worth giving a shot if you end up getting the game for cheap (I got it for less than $10 when I finally played it several years ago, so I can't really say that I got ripped off), but given your current tastes in action games I have a feeling this game will fall flat for you even quicker than it did for me.

[Mustang]

The thing is, you'll probably find yourself doing this more than standard combat anyways, because the game just through gauntlets of enemies at you in drab, barren, and sterile combat arenas until it decides that you can move on.

So to answer your question, yes, Razor's Edge does have a lot more weapons and moves that you can use in combat and on a surface level looks fun. And, to be fair, it does have its fans, and maybe you would be one of them. But unless you are the type of person who likes to expriment with combos (which isn't easy in this game given how aggressive the enemies are), you will quickly find yourself relying on the most basic and safest strategies and then subsequently get bored with how one-note the gameplay loop feels.

It's maybe worth giving a shot if you end up getting the game for cheap (I got it for less than $10 when I finally played it several years ago, so I can't really say that I got ripped off), but given your current tastes in action games I have a feeling this game will fall flat for you even quicker than it did for me.

I may check it out if I can find a physical copy at a decent price, but all of that sounds rough. The quoted really stands out and is a huge negative for me. I prefer to have good to great level design, but I've always been able to look past that. When you mess with my combos and force me to play a certain kind of way, you stepping on toes at that point.

Definitely unfortunate.