What Movie Did You Just Watch

[Dr. Ensatsu-ken]

So, I kind of want to call the new Godzilla movie a guilty pleasure of sorts. I definitely get why it's not doing well with critics, but I also can't help but see it as a tribute to the campy nature of some of the past films, right down to the human characters being stupid and the plot being nonsensical. I mean, for crying out loud they boost Godzilla's energy by exploding a nuke right in front of his face. That'd be like trying to heal someone by bursting open a can of energy drink right next to them. It's the kind of logic you'd find in some of those older era Godzilla movies. In that regard it's entertaining to an extent, but it's not shot nearly as well as the 2014 version, doesn't have the clever political satire of Shin Godzilla, and doesn't all out commit to the camp like Destroy All Monsters or Final Wars. So, it's still ultimately kind of a mess.

[LumRanmaYasha]

I've been bummed to hear all the mixed reception to the new Godzilla - I was really hoping for some unadulterated monster mayhem, but it sounds like there's a lot of lame human drama stuff in it too. Still, I'm planning to see it with friends on Monday or Tuesday, so I'm hoping it'll be a fun experience nonetheless.

Also, I forgot to mention it, but I've seen all the John Wick films now and damn do I love them. The action sequences just keep getting better and better with each film, and I'm totally engrossed in the world and John's journey. The first one is my favorite since I feel it's the most complete story, but regardless I've enjoyed each film and am totally down for more installments in the franchise. I've even rewatched the first film and Parabellum with VLord, and I'm not one to rewatch a film so soon after first seeing it, which really shows me how enthralled I've become with the world these films establish, the action, and the character of John Wick himself.

I do wonder about the ending of Parabellum though. Namely:

Spoiler

I get Winston thought he could play John, but for someone who has always had the upmost confidence in John's ability to survive anything thrown at him, knows first hand what he's capable of, and has even warned other people not to cross him before, it strikes me as a bit careless of him to not make sure he was dead after betraying him. Now granted, a normal man wouldn't survive being shot that many times and dropped off a building from that height, but John ain't no ordinary man and Winston should know that. I have to wonder if this was really the best solution - maybe Winston should've let John in on his plan, and staged his death, letting him keep the Continental and John get away. Then he wouldn't risk John surviving and gunning for him in the future. Maybe it'll be revealed in the next film he intentionally didn't finish the job, but it's still strange that he would risk John getting revenge because of a misunderstanding, so I don't think that's it. Either way, I was shook by Winston's betrayal and am pretty exited to see the "consequences" of that.  Also, I'm very happy Lawrence Fishburne's character survived. His performance as the Bowery King has been captivating and a riot in these past two movies, and I'm really hoping there'll be even more of him in the next one. 

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As far as other movies I've seen recently go, I don't get the love for Rocketman. I didn't like it that much better than Bohemian Rhapsody - it felt like a bunch of music videos set to Elton John songs loosely strung together by the standard musician biopic formula. Granted, there's things I do appreciate about it, namely that it's unabashedly gay and dwells in Elton's failures and low points more than in his successes, which is a bold move for a mainstream biopic about a still-living musician. But I really didn't like that the movie posits that Elton needed to forgive the people who abused him and ask forgiveness from them. I get the core of the idea - there were people he treated poorly that he absolutely had to make amends to for sure, and he definitely needed to let go of the past to focus on finding happiness in the present. But directing this epiphany towards his abusive, unloving parents really rubbed me wrong since they didn't have any redeemable qualities depicted in the film, and that hit a nerve with me for personal reasons. 

[Foggle]

Glad you dig the Wick! I think they get progressively more enjoyable but I can agree on the first one being the "best" since it tells a simple, effective, and engaging story, whereas the other two are more focused on action and twists.

[LumRanmaYasha]

I think what's great about these films is that you could make a case for any of them being the best one. In fact, I think 3 has hands-down my favorite action sequences in the franchise so far. I like all the films about as strongly, but I give the edge to the first for being a self-contained story that is very centered in John grieving over the loss of his wife and the emotional catharsis of his revenge being the most satisfying, whereas the other two have more open endings and lingering plot threads to lead into sequels.

[Dr. Ensatsu-ken]

Also glad to hear that you liked them, Lum! I saw the first movie with my dad back in 2014 when it was out in theaters, and we really just saw it on a whim since we had fee AMC movie pass tickets that we ended up using for my birthday. I didn't have any particular expectations going into it other than hearing some fairly positive word of mouth from critics, so I was pleasantly surprised by how good it was and ended up buying the movie on Blu-Ray and really loving it even more after looking at all of the behind-the-scenes work and effort that went into making it. At that time I didn't expect it to get a sequel, but was overjoyed when it was announced that John Wick Chapter 2 was going into production, and now we have the third one with a fourth already announced and scheduled for release in just two years. The way that this series has grown in popularity over the past few years has been really great and well-deserved.

Like Lum, my favorite is still the first movie. While the sequels have overall better action scenes, John's motivation in the first film really gives it a level of impact that the sequels just don't have to capitalize on. That said, whereas they suffer a bit in terms of story potential, they more than make up for in regard to the action and world-building. To me, the first movie has the surprise factor as well as the best use of John Wick as a character (and arguably still the best villain in Viggo, IMO). Also, Alfie Allen is just such a good actor when it comes to portraying a shit-bag that you want to punch in the face (and yes, I do mean that as a complement). The second movie has the best world building elements in the series, and introduces two of my favorite supporting characters in the franchise so far in Cassian and The Bowery King. In particular I really wanted to see Cassian make a return in this movie since his plot-thread with John is still unresolved, and he's one of the few characters in the entire series to take on John Wick and make it out alive (he even came close to offing him a few times). The fact that John willingly spared him is something that I've always interpreted as John feeling guilty for having killed his Ward against his will, so he may have taken some pity on him even though Cassian would still pose a threat to him later on down the line. As for the third film, like Lum said, I think it by far has the best and most creative action scenes, though probably has the weakest overall story of the franchise. I'd still say that it's about on par with the second movie, though, and overall I'm just really excited to see more of this Universe through the next movie and that supposed Continental TV series that's in development.

As for the whole thing with Winston at the end of John Wick Chapter 3:

Spoiler

I was also surprised to see him genuinely betray John at the end. At first I thought that he and John had a plan, especially because when the Adjudicator told him that John was "gone" he reacted like he was un-surprised, but when he understood her meaning than he looked more serious about it which meant that he hadn't staged a fake death with John. It's especially interesting since the whole reason he landed himself in a situation in which he needed to betray John to get out of in the first place was because he helped John earlier by taking pity on him and giving him an hour to escape. If you remember in the first movie, he immediately had Ms. Perkins executed once she broke Continental Ground rules. This is what he was supposed to do with John, but he treats him more friendly and gives him a chance, which shows that he does on some level have a fondness for John, which it's why I find it all the more surprising that he legitimately turned on him in the end. That said, his reaction to realizing that John was still out there was not one of fear (or at least it didn't look that way), but of acceptance of the consequences. I have a feeling that unlike other people who have pissed off John, he might get a shot at redemption in the next film, but that remains to be seen.

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[LumRanmaYasha]

Yeah, I was surprised Cassian didn't show up in 3 since you think he'd be eager to pursue his revenge on John. Then again, the film does start immediately after the end of 2, and when we last saw Cassian he wasn't in the best shape - probably needed to get surgery to get that knife out of him without bleeding out. Hoping he will show up again though, maybe even in the next one.

Spoiler

As for Winston, he did tell John "not to make the mistake of thinking this is personal" when John was conflicted about killing him, probably also referring to his own intentions as well. I think Winston decided to make the best choice for him to keep the Continental and his power in NYC, and shooting John in front of the adjuticator was the best way to prove his loyalty to the high table and make up for his leniency with him before. I do wonder if he could convince John to just let it go, but considering how pissed off John seems to be I don't think he's going to get out of this without a beating at least.

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[Dr. Ensatsu-ken]

Yeah....I would've preferred if Dark Phoenix was cancelled after all. In the same way that Charles Xavier mentally blocked Jean Grey from remembering key parts of her past (yes, they pull that BS again), I choose to mentally block this movie from my mind and go on pretending that Logan was the swan song to the FOX era of X-MEN movies.

Also, nothing against Simon Kinberg as a person, but why the fuck is the guy notorious for fucking up the Dark Phoenix Saga the first time by writing The Last Stand now both writing AND directing a second adaptation of it to fuck it up all over again?

FOX genuinely did not give a shit about this project with the Disney merger, I suppose.

[Dr. Insomniac]

Since Dark Phoenix was meant to be the start of another trilogy until the merger turned it into the finale, imagine how it could have gotten worse. Judging from this and some insiders reactions to New Mutants, seems like the XCU was going to die even if Disney didn't buy Fox.

[Avaitor]

I'm waiting until Tuesday to see Dark Phoenix, since MoviePass doesn't really work on the weekends, and that's when we have $6.50 movies anyway, but I'm really not expecting much. I did also rewatch The Last Stand, which is as bad as I remember, but also meaner? I've seen some discourse over the bit where Storm says that the mutant cure is an oxymoron when there's nothing to cure is shooting down Rogue, who has every right to want a resolve to her powers, which is totally justified. Then there's the time when Xavier tells Logan that he doesn't need to explain himself to anyone, least of all to him. The fuck was up with that? Magneto's bit about how in chess, the pawns go first is also extra. On top of that, while I do like the idea of the mutant cure, there just isn't much connecting the storylines together, or enough thought put into any of them to make it work.

As far as other movies I've seen recently go, I don't get the love for Rocketman. I didn't like it that much better than Bohemian Rhapsody - it felt like a bunch of music videos set to Elton John songs loosely strung together by the standard musician biopic formula. Granted, there's things I do appreciate about it, namely that it's unabashedly gay and dwells in Elton's failures and low points more than in his successes, which is a bold move for a mainstream biopic about a still-living musician. But I really didn't like that the movie posits that Elton needed to forgive the people who abused him and ask forgiveness from them. I get the core of the idea - there were people he treated poorly that he absolutely had to make amends to for sure, and he definitely needed to let go of the past to focus on finding happiness in the present. But directing this epiphany towards his abusive, unloving parents really rubbed me wrong since they didn't have any redeemable qualities depicted in the film, and that hit a nerve with me for personal reasons.

I just saw this, and I more or less agree with you. I did generally like the musical sequences, but the biopic boilerplate material is flat as all hell, as much as Taron Egerton gives his all. I do ultimately like it more than BoRap though, mainly since I like Elton's music a lot more than Queen's, but I will admit beyond the campier moments and open gayness, there isn't that much more to it.

As for the forgiveness scene near the end, I think that comes from Elton's own desires to make amends with his parents, but it doesn't work as well in the film as it probably does in his mind because as you said, they don't come off as very sympathetic here. I do feel genuine remorse in that sequence, but it's imperfect.

[Dr. Insomniac]

I read a spoiler, and Dark Phoenix has a weird parallel with the Captain Marvel movie.

Spoiler

So you know how Skrulls are now innocent refugees desperately looking for a home with none of their villainy in the MCU? The D'Bari, the guys Jean Grey genocided in the original Dark Phoenix comic, are basically comic Skrulls here. They even shapeshift. And since they're villains here, this completely ruins one of the biggest moments in the source material. And instead of Jean's turning point being her murder of billions of innocent aliens, it's just killing Mystique.

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[Foggle]

Emmy saw Dark Phoenix yesterday and said it was "pathetically bad." Keep in mind that she actually liked Apocalypse.

[Dr. Ensatsu-ken]

I'll stand up for Apocalypse and say that it's decent....if you pretend that it's an early 2000's superhero movie.

Dark Phoenix kind of makes me feel bad for James McAvoy and Michael Fassbender, who were perfectly cast as Professor Xavier and Magneto respectively in First Class, and actually feel like they are trying here despite nobody else in this movie seeming to give a shit. It just feels like such a waste of talent.

[Foggle]

I enjoyed Apocalypse as a comedy! As a superhero movie I thought it fell flat, but a lot of it was very funny (whether intentionally or not).

[Dr. Insomniac]

[Avaitor]

Tarantino really wasn't kidding about Once Upon a Time in Hollywood's ending deserving to not be spoiled. It's pretty batshit, even (or especially if) you know where the Tate/Polanski stuff was going.

I enjoyed the movie, but I'm not sure how much or even how I really feel about it. On a first viewing, it seems kind of aimless, but the character work is some of his best. I really want to see it again soon to get a fuller impression.