Metal Gear

[gunswordfist]

I heard someone say that reviewers think that V's story is weaker than the other entries in the series. Assuming they just mean 1 and 3 and not 4 or, dear God, 2's story, is there any truth to this, Foggle?

[Foggle]

There's not a whole lot of story. After about 17 hours, I think I've seen maybe 30 minutes of cutscenes total (excluding the Prologue and Ground Zeroes). The plot is extremely basic so far and mostly exists as an excuse to have fun gameplay. It's far closer to Metal Gear 1 and 2 than it is to the Solid series in that regard. That said, the writing itself is definitely much stronger than in the previous games; the dialogue sounds a lot more natural and there's very little exposition.

Overall, the unintrusive storytelling and intriguing cinematic opening make for a much better narrative experience than 1, 2, 4, PO, and PW IMO. While the Prologue is classic MGS Kojima - an hour-long interactive cutscene/tutorial - the rest is just pure video game.

If you're interested, here's the basic plot:

Minor spoilers, maybe?

Big Boss has been in a coma for 9 years after Skull Face destroyed the MSF army and base he built with Miller in Peace Walker. When BB finally awakens, an assassin from Cipher (Zero's organization) shows up to kill him, but is thwarted by a mysterious man named Ishmael. Together, they escape from the hospital as it is mercilessly attacked by Cipher's private army. Big Boss loses contact with Ishmael, and then meets Ocelot, who takes him to Afghanistan; there, they must rescue Miller and begin rebuilding their base and army under the new name Diamond Dogs.

[close]

[Spark Of Spirit]

How's the voice acting? Does Hayter deliver as always?

[Foggle]

How's the voice acting? Does Hayter deliver as always?

David Hayter isn't in the game, unfortunately. He was replaced by Kiefer Sutherland because... who knows. He does a pretty good job, though.

The acting is pretty good. Same standard as MGS 1 and 3.

[talonmalon333]

David Hayter isn't in the game, unfortunately. He was replaced by Kiefer Sutherland because... who knows. He does a pretty good job, though.

The reason is that they wanted an older voice for Snake since he's older at this point. Sutherland is a great voice actor. Hayter is good but he honestly doesn't have much depth to his voice.

The acting is pretty good. Same standard as MGS 1 and 3.

Why do you think the voice acting in 2 and 4 is worse?

[Peanutbutter]

I think it was a good idea getting Kiefer Sutherland to play Big Boss. Honestly, I wished he had been his voice in the first place, it might have helped made Naked Snake becoming Big Boss in Snake Eater less obvious.

[Foggle]

The reason is that they wanted an older voice for Snake since he's older at this point.

Yet that didn't stop them from getting David Hayter to voice a literal senior citizen...

Why do you think the voice acting in 2 and 4 is worse?

I don't think it was really "worse," but the best performances of the series were definitely in 1, 3, and now 5 IMO.

I think it was a good idea getting Kiefer Sutherland to play Big Boss. Honestly, I wished he had been his voice in the first place

I agree. It would have helped differentiate between the two main characters a lot better. But I'll always love Hayter.

[talonmalon333]

I don't think it was really "worse," but the best performances of the series were definitely in 1, 3, and now 5 IMO.

I feel like some of the characters were still sort of finding their voices in MGS1. Plus, Liquid's sort-of-British hammy voice acting just doesn't ever sound good. He sounded the best in MGS4... because they just stuck with Ocelot's voice whenever Liquid spoke.

I agree. It would have helped differentiate between the two main characters a lot better. But I'll always love Hayter.

I love Hayter, too, but I do think he has very little emotional depth in his voice.

I liked having Hayter in MGS3 because it helps us to draw that initial comparison between Snake and Big Boss.

[gunswordfist]

There's not a whole lot of story. After about 17 hours, I think I've seen maybe 30 minutes of cutscenes total (excluding the Prologue and Ground Zeroes). The plot is extremely basic so far and mostly exists as an excuse to have fun gameplay. It's far closer to Metal Gear 1 and 2 than it is to the Solid series in that regard. That said, the writing itself is definitely much stronger than in the previous games; the dialogue sounds a lot more natural and there's very little exposition.

Overall, the unintrusive storytelling and intriguing cinematic opening make for a much better narrative experience than 1, 2, 4, PO, and PW IMO. While the Prologue is classic MGS Kojima - an hour-long interactive cutscene/tutorial - the rest is just pure video game.

If you're interested, here's the basic plot:

Minor spoilers, maybe?

Big Boss has been in a coma for 9 years after Skull Face destroyed the MSF army and base he built with Miller in Peace Walker. When BB finally awakens, an assassin from Cipher (Zero's organization) shows up to kill him, but is thwarted by a mysterious man named Ishmael. Together, they escape from the hospital as it is mercilessly attacked by Cipher's private army. Big Boss loses contact with Ishmael, and then meets Ocelot, who takes him to Afghanistan; there, they must rescue Miller and begin rebuilding their base and army under the new name Diamond Dogs.

[close]

Thank you. Sounds like that's how I'd want it to be.

How's the voice acting? Does Hayter deliver as always?

David Hayter isn't in the game, unfortunately. He was replaced by Kiefer Sutherland because... who knows. He does a pretty good job, though.

The acting is pretty good. Same standard as MGS 1 and 3.

I keep on forgetting to really grade Kiefer's voice. From me barely paying attention from what I've seen, he does sound pretty good.

And like I've always said, Hayter is good but his voice isn't that nuanced. He's not on [name of Max Payne's voice actor], Master Chief's or of course certainly not on Michael Ironside's level.

[talonmalon333]

Kojima has come a long way since the hour long cutscenes of MGS4.

Seriously, was there never a point in the development of MGS4 when Kojima looked at the game and realized that maybe, just maybe, the cutscenes were getting too long?

[Foggle]

Kojima has come a long way since the hour long cutscenes of MGS4.

Seriously, was there never a point in the development of MGS4 when Kojima looked at the game and realized that maybe, just maybe, the cutscenes were getting too long?

I still think MGS4 was Kojima's way of trolling both his fanbase and publisher. The cutscenes and story were likely insufferable on purpose.

[talonmalon333]

Wait, what?

[Foggle]

It's no secret that Kojima wanted to end the series with MGS2, and he's said that he never intended to present explanations to the mysteries brought up in that game. He also stated that the main themes of 4 were "getting old" and "outgrowing the things you used to do." Couple that with the debut trailer featuring an Alan Smithee credit (either writing or directing, I forget which), an early cardboard box sporting text reading "No place for Hideo," Big Boss' line about how "the world would be better off without Snakes," and the subsequent games (PW, MGR, MGS5) barely resembling the previous ones... I dunno. But I think it goes a lot deeper than just bad writing.

[Peanutbutter]

I can understand the problems with 2, but 4 didn't have a bad story. The only thing that wasn't really explained properly was why Ocelot went through with his "Liquid possessed me!" shtick.

[talonmalon333]

It's no secret that Kojima wanted to end the series with MGS2, and he's said that he never intended to present explanations to the mysteries brought up in that game. He also stated that the main themes of 4 were "getting old" and "outgrowing the things you used to do." Couple that with the debut trailer featuring an Alan Smithee credit (either writing or directing, I forget which), an early cardboard box sporting text reading "No place for Hideo," Big Boss' line about how "the world would be better off without Snakes," and the subsequent games (PW, MGR, MGS5) barely resembling the previous ones... I dunno. But I think it goes a lot deeper than just bad writing.

I can understand that Kojima might have wanted to address themes like these. But I don't think it has anything to do with trolling. I honestly think the weirdness of MGS4's story is a result of the series overarching story and lore simply being too convoluted. It was just too much for 4 to explain. Mainly, MGS2 just didn't make sense, and Kojima needed to find a way to make it... less nonsensical. Like, you can make fun of the twist in 4 that Ocelot merely tricked everyone into thinking he was Ocelot using nanomachines, And I'll agree it was stupid. But let's be honest, how else was Kojima supposed to make sense of something as stupid as being mind controlled by Liquid through Liquid's arm? At the very least, I'll take the explanation in 4 over the original intent of 2.

Personally, I think the long cutscenes, to some extent, are a natural progression of Kojima's problem since MGS2. He always had a problem with cutscenes and doesn't seem to know how to tell a story without having it be spoon fed. In MGS4, there is more plot to spoon feed, so the cutscenes length just grew and grew.

Also, I'll always defend the character drama in MGS4, if nothing else. And that includes the ending.